Re: New TTT - The Boxcar - New Sliding Bed

[Mike M.]

Same pump here, but less money. It might take longer than the few minutes they discribe due to more space, but it would work.

[cokebottle10]

If you drop air pressure 1 PSI over a 4X8 sheet of pylwood it would be 4608 pounds of clamping force. 96 inches X 48 inches = 4608 square inches X 1 pound per square = 4608 pounds. A shop vac would work just fine.

Want to crush a 55 gal can? Hook a shop vac to it.

A shop vac is under load when it is moving air. When you stop the air flow it is not under load and should not heat up. Stop up the hose and it should run all day long.

Thanks for the info on how you made your vac bags. I was over thinking it.

I love his build. Please keep the photos comming.

Thanks,
David in Fletcher NC

[bdosborn]

Dave,

Your right, the shop vac worked great, I really don't need to improve on it. I think I was over thinking it in reverse. But, as I think about it, isn't it a common mistake to over clamp and squeeze all the glue out of the joint? Maybe you don't want a really deep vacuum?
Bruce

[Joe G]

I got a pump kinda like the 2.5 CFM pump off eBay, but it's a 5 CFM instead. It starts smoking after 20 minutes of running, so I'm not sure how good that type will work. I think they're made to draw a deep vacuum on refrigeration equipment for a short time, like 5 minutes or so. 30 minutes makes them heat up enough that the vacuum oil starts to smoke. At least it does on the one I got.

Bruce

It's common for those refrigeration vacuum pumps to 'smoke'. Typically it's mostly water vapor. Nothing to worry about. They do get hot, but I've had to run them for several days straight before, and never noticed any damage to the pump. Still draws down well into the 29.9's In-Hg.

Nice build.

[bdosborn]

Okay, maybe I won't throw mine out just yet. I plan to vacuum clamp the filon skin so I'll give it another try.

Bruce

[doug hodder]

What are you going to use for the adhesive on the filon Bruce? Doug

[bdosborn]

What are you going to use for the adhesive on the filon Bruce? Doug

Doug,

That's a good question. I sent an email to Crane Composites, the company that manufactures filon asking that very question:


How do you recommend affixing your product?
Thanks,
Bruce

Bogacz, Jim wrote:
We do not have any recommendations for adhesive.

We do not do any laminating.

Our product is generally sold to OEM's, which have their own on-site
lamination equipment.

Consumers generally don't buy Filon.

I would suggest contacting an RV repair facility in your area.

Thank you,

Jim Bogacz
Customer Care Specialist


And the answer pisses me off to no end. They make a product *specifically* for laminating yet they have no glue recommendation. Pathetic.

So I'm going to use the FRP adhesive from Home Depot. Lets hope it works since I don't really know what else to use...

Bruce

[doug hodder]

Sorry to hear that is what your answer is....I wonder if they are not willing to commit due to expansion issues? Do you have any idea of what the expansion numbers are on a sheet of the material in the size you are working with? Kinda sounds like they are covering their A$$. I haven't worked with it previously, have with a lot of acrylics and polys, but might be an idea to scuff the back side with an 80 grit to give it some tooth to bond with. Just an idea. Doug

[bdosborn]

Doug,

I'm sure their lawyer has advised them not to give glue recommendations. I guess I understand why they would do it, I just wish they'd help the little guy out. I don't have a clue what the expansion numbers are and at this point I'm afraid to find out since I've already bought the filon. Thanks for the tip on scuffing the backside, I'll give it a try.

Bruce

[doug hodder]

Thanks for your work....I'm watching...thinking of "bagging" some walls. Doug

[bledsoe3]

Thanks for your work....I'm watching...thinking of "bagging" some walls. Doug

Walls for what?

[doug hodder]

lets just say somethin'....Doug

[bledsoe3]

Inquiring minds.....

[Esteban]

Bruce and Doug, Larry and Diane skinned their Outback Teardrop with Filon. They thoroughly documented its construction, step by step, at their website:
outbackteardrop.com

Stabond is the suggested contact adhesive to use with Filon and I contacted the factory located in Gardena, CA for a technical data sheet and made phone calls to ask many questions. Filon expands and contracts and the same rate as the plywood mounting surface so use of other adhesives is not suggested without contacting Kemlite. Stabond [$35.00 Walt's RV] comes in 1 gallon containers and it's shelf life is 6 months from date of manufacturer. Humidity and temperature does affect it's performance so reading the technical data sheets is a must before using. It's applied using the cheapest paint spray gun, pressure type, not siphon, that you can buy [$25.00 Home Depot] and then throw it away after using it. We did not have a compressor nor the facility to spray the adhesive so we inquired about using a paint roller. By spraying, it's coverage is 500 square feet per gallon. You apply the adhesive to the Filon and plywood and let it dry to the touch. The application time is between 5 to 45 minutes, depending on many factors. If you apply the Filon too early where the Stabond is wet underneath, the solvents evaporating will cause gas bubbles within 7 to 12 hours after application and these bubbles will show through the Filon. So rolling it on will be thicker than spraying and required longer drying time. While spraying or rolling it on, the Stabond starts to spider web almost immediately. When you stick the two dry pieces together, just by barely touching them, it's permanent and you can't pull them apart. That was one of the scary things to deal with.

My bolds above. HTH guys

[bdosborn]

Thanks Estaban, I've been to their site and read about the Stabond but I think they had delamination problems too. I wonder if anyone has a link to where you can get Stabond? I know they carry it at Alrite but I won't buy anything from them - they're too expensive! Maybe I'll call around town to RV repair places.
Bruce