Inverter newbee questionss

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Inverter newbee questionss

Postby rustytoolss » Mon May 16, 2016 8:10 am

I have a fair understanding of wiring AC systems. And I have a good understanding of 12 volt systems. But I'm lost doing systems on at trailer. The part that I'm lost on is. Ok I wire my TTT for AC to run my coffee maker, it plugs into the wall socket. Now I also have a 12volt battery with an inverter. Will I be able to wire the 12v power to the same wall socket to run my coffee maker ?
Or do I have to power the top part of the socket with AC---and the bottom part of the socket with the inverter 12v DC power (then move the electric cord plug to the proper socket position?)
Or do I have to make a master 3way switch position 1 DC/ position 2 OFF/ position 3 inverter 12DC.
Yeah I'm lost :shock: :?
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby lrrowe » Mon May 16, 2016 8:16 am

Me, I would not do either. I can see it being an opportunity for disaster. I would go with separate and appropriate sockets for DC and AC.
Bob

First Post on Purchase of Trailer: http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=60722
Hot water infloor and radiator heating project:[url]http://www.tnttt.com/posting.php?mode=reply&f=54&t=62327[/

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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby H.A. » Mon May 16, 2016 10:50 am

I y.
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby lrrowe » Mon May 16, 2016 11:40 am

My reponse was written with the understanding that a typical 120VAC outlet was to be usded for both 12v DC and 120VAC with the 12 V DC itmes having typical 120V DC plugs installed. If I was wrong then please ignore my post. But if right, I can just see what happens to the 12v dc device if 120v ac is switched on.
Bob

First Post on Purchase of Trailer: http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=60722
Hot water infloor and radiator heating project:[url]http://www.tnttt.com/posting.php?mode=reply&f=54&t=62327[/

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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby rustytoolss » Mon May 16, 2016 11:44 am

H.A. wrote:I assume your reference of "12v power" actually means inverter output at 120volt ?

Anyway, what you propose is easily accomplished.
"Transferswitch" its called in the elecrtical business. Can be manual operated or automatic & onto great levels of complexity if one desires...

In a simple camptrailer, it can be easy as plugging in your 'shore powercable to mainspower or inverter as desired.
The "3 position switch" mentioned, simple as that is, is perhaps a next step up in complexity.

Can you post a simple diagram of a system that uses 110 volt shore power and 12 volt power with inverter to 110 volt power ? Maybe that will help me to understand.
I've done a lot of 12 volt wiring. And a fair amount of 110 volt wiring. So I'm ok with that stuff. Just unsure of using an inverter. Would I need two separate wall sockets (one for 110 , and one for the inverter powered 12volt system ) ?
Last edited by rustytoolss on Mon May 16, 2016 12:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby rustytoolss » Mon May 16, 2016 12:07 pm

lrrowe wrote:My reponse was written with the understanding that a typical 120VAC outlet was to be usded for both 12v DC and 120VAC with the 12 V DC itmes having typical 120V DC plugs installed. If I was wrong then please ignore my post. But if right, I can just see what happens to the 12v dc device if 120v ac is switched on.

I did this once as a kid...was not good :shock:
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby H.A. » Mon May 16, 2016 2:40 pm

[qu..)
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby MtnDon » Mon May 16, 2016 2:53 pm

rustytoolss wrote:Can you post a simple diagram of a system that uses 110 volt shore power and 12 volt power with inverter to 110 volt power ? Maybe that will help me to understand.
I've done a lot of 12 volt wiring. And a fair amount of 110 volt wiring. So I'm ok with that stuff. Just unsure of using an inverter. Would I need two separate wall sockets (one for 110 , and one for the inverter powered 12volt system ) ?


First there are two separate systems. You got the 12 VDC and the 120 VAC. Everything is straight forward there.

Where the fuzziness is probably coming from is the source of the 120 VAC. You would have two sources; the shore 120 VAC power and the inverter supplied 120 VAC power. This is where the ATS, automatic transfer switch, comes in and can make this very simple. [do a search on amazon for "RV transfer switch"] The incoming 120 VAC shore power connects to one terminal set. The inverter supplied 120 VAC connects to a second terminal set. The ATS output feeds the 120 VAC circuit(s) in the trailer.

If there is no shore power going into the ATS, you would have to switch on the inverter and then the ATS will route that to the trailer circuits. That would be the default setting. If you then connect shore power the ATS will sense that and after a brief delay switch the shore power through to the trailer 120 VAC circuits. At the same time it would disconnect the power it was receiving from the inverter. The ATS can only feed from shore or inverter; not both at the same time. It would still be up to you to turn the actual inverter on when needed and to turn it off when not needed.

hope that helps....
Our 6x12 deep vee nose cargo trailer camper conversion... viewtopic.php?f=42&t=58336

We have a small off grid cabin we built ourselves in the NM mountains; small PV solar system; 624 watts PV, Outback CC & inverter/charger ... http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.0
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby rustytoolss » Mon May 16, 2016 3:27 pm

OK , this is getting clearer now. Is this something that most TD campers just not bother with (the transfer switch that is) , and just use shore power ?.... Then if they want 120vac from their deep cycle battery, they just connect a inverter, to get the 120vac for say a coffee maker/ TV , Right ?
And all interior/ porch lights are straight 12 volt from the deep cycle battery (like a car ).
I've been around large RV's most of my life. But never had any reason to learn anything about the automatic transfer switch systems.
For me it's always been automotive 12 volt systems. And 120/240 household systems.
Thanks for helping a guy out. :lol:
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby MtnDon » Mon May 16, 2016 4:33 pm

rustytoolss wrote:........Then if they want 120vac from their deep cycle battery, they just connect a inverter, to get the 120vac for say a coffee maker/ TV , Right ?



That's what H.A. was saying..... :thumbsup: very simple and no cost. A big RV with a built in generator will usually have an ATS.
Our 6x12 deep vee nose cargo trailer camper conversion... viewtopic.php?f=42&t=58336

We have a small off grid cabin we built ourselves in the NM mountains; small PV solar system; 624 watts PV, Outback CC & inverter/charger ... http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.0
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Re: Inverter newbee questionss

Postby Shadow Catcher » Mon May 16, 2016 9:12 pm

I wired our 300W Morningstar Sursine with a 30A DPDT switch between the 120 power from the converter and the circuit breakers.
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