Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-Foru

Converting Cargo Trailers into TTTs

Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby CaleyAnn » Mon Jan 22, 2018 6:45 pm

Update on parts arrival. I got the two dome LED lighting units. They look nice, and look like they will be easy to mount.

Also got the three 15 amp rated cigarette lighter power sockets, and discovered that they are too long. In other words I cannot mount them flush with the sides of the plywood panels. What I will have to do i add what I call 1/2 inch standoffs made of more than likely some kind of nicer wood that is sold by the foot at Home Depot. I will use a router to do the edges in some kind of nice cut, probably just rounded. That should provide clearance away from the exterior aluminum siding, and leave room to hook the wiring up.

Speaking of wiring. The only way to run the wiring is to use 1/2 to 1 inch wire loom. That is what the trailer manufacturer used to run all the trailer light electrical. Hopefully this plastic tubing will keep the wires from chafing when driving over rough roads.
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby tony.latham » Mon Jan 22, 2018 7:26 pm

You're certainly precluded from a battery box on the tongue.

I'd put the battery inside. I'd also reconsider your needs. How many nights are you going to be out?

A little 35 amp/hour AGM has about 20 useable amps in it. Those computer fans must pull next to nothing and LED lights the same. Just recharge while towing. They're little... 7.7 x 5.2 x 6.4 inches and weight about 25 pounds. I'd build a small battery box and screw it to the sidewall and floor.

https://www.amazon.com/NPP-Rechargeable-Battery-Button-Terminals/dp/B01LW19AOE/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1516667994&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=35ah+battery&psc=1

If that's not enough amperage, bump up to a Group 24 AGM. You'll get about 45 amps from one of those.

Just wire in a voltmeter in and don't let it get below 11.5 resting volts.

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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby CaleyAnn » Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:35 pm

Tony, There is actually a reason why I am purchasing the battery generator. Not only can I use it while camping (gold mining) for a week, but it will come in handy for my house when power goes out, which is about half a dozen times a year. Have no reason why I lose power, but I do. Just had a power outage that lasted only 10 minutes thank goodness, but at least this battery could power my cable boxes, one of which is my telephone. I don't have phone service if I don't have power. And this will come in handy during the summer when it is so very hot, and when most of our power outages occur. I could at least run a small 12V fan. It's pretty much a win-win for me. And this particular battery generator has the ability to recharge on 120VAC, as well as from my car, or from the solar panels. All I will need to do is drill a hole that will contain a plug receptacle that my solar panels plug into. I will put the battery and all the control stuff in on storage compartment under the bed.

Attached is my solution for a bed platform and storage. I decided to keep this a permanent thing. There is enough room on the side, 17 inches, for me to get up and get out of the trailer through the teardrop door I will install in a rear inside wall. I will also have a 15"w x 30" L drop down table I can use to eat on, or place my small 12 Volt TV, propane heater, or small 12 Volt fan. And I have enough room that I could add a second if the need arises.

With these two things, I may still be able to put some small cupboards in the front at the ceiling for additional storage.

To test all these building plans, I will have to plot out in pencil everything lightly on the existing plywood inside the trailer. Hopefully I will be able to move around without trouble with all of it in place.
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby John61CT » Mon Jan 22, 2018 10:24 pm

A generator is engine-driven, converts fossil fuel into electricity.

That battery is very expensive and 99% sure doesn't actually qualify as true deep cycling.

For less money you will get both much greater capacity and a much longer lifespan out of a pair of 6V Duracell golf car batts from Batteries+ or Sam's Club.

No way with those consumer loads will a small battery be enough, unless you get a **lot** of sunshine, even then you'd need to watch your consumption, don't want to discharge lead batts below 50%.

With a good SoC (State of Charge) meter you can make sure you don't draw down more than your panels can put back in.

Or keep adding panels until you have enough wattage, or get a little genny

You want to get the bank back to full at least a few times each week for longevity.
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby McDave » Tue Jan 23, 2018 9:52 am

Hey Caley Ann,
I spent some time in 29 Palms about 35 yrs. ago. So, really just one piece of advice for now. Take your time and be sure you understand what you know.... It is easy to make changes on paper before you spend the time and money for real. Here is a tool that will help you during the planning phase. Weight and balance are important, and with tow vehicle limitations it is nice to have a gauge while planning.
https://www.engineersedge.com/calculato ... alance.htm

And here is some battery info.
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/

Good Luck with your project, Remember to have fun with it.

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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby CaleyAnn » Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:59 pm

John, I will look into these 6V batteries sometime in the future, but for now I will go with a matched set from ECOpower. I stated the reason why I wanted this kind of battery earlier, but will state it again. I need it for home use also because of the problem we have with local power failures. I can use it to make sure my two models are powered, one being the cable telephone modem. Without the backup power, I have no way to call out if an emergency should occur. This battery also can be charge from 120VAC, or from the car while I am driving, or from solar panels.

I'm not one of the persons who runs everything at once either. The most I will run at one time is one LED light, the two computer fans, and a TV. If I want to heat things up, the TV will be shut off, and more than likely I am reading on my Kindle. This is pretty much the way I do things at home. My normal electric bill is only about $30 per month. I am a miser

McDave, Took a quick glance at those two links. Thanks for the interesting, and informative information. It will take me time to read and hopefully learn something
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby CaleyAnn » Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:30 pm

Back with what I hope will be good news for those saying I should have a deep cycle battery. I realized that with one of my hobbies, astrophotography (AP), I had purchased a 106Ah Exide RV/Marine Deep Cycle Battery for when I was traveling, and doing my AP. I wanted to make sure I did not lose power when in the middle of a photography session, and I never did with this monster battery. Right now I have it on charge, and am hoping it will be resurrected, as it was pretty low, at 10 volts. If it does come back to full life, I will use this as my primary, and my Battery generator for when I need to put this back on for a full charge over several days. I hope the combination of 225Ah will be enough to get me through a week of camping.

I decided to order my Teardrop camper door for the interior rear wall. I needed that in order to have it when I do erect the wall. Based on the specs, it says the provided hardware will accept a wall 1.5 inches in thickness. So that will be what me interior rear wall will be to accommodate the door. Slowly I am getting all the parts I need to start the project. The last three items I need are the plywood, the foam insulation, and the last item I ordered, which are the two computer cooling fans.

Once I have all the various parts, I can then start the insulation and wiring job. Maybe I can have some of this ready for my first gold mining foray in February. Of course that depends on the weather. If it rains, then dry washing for gold is a bit of a problem.

One question that I have after watching a video on YouTube. It seems there are people who like to abscond with trailers and RV trailers. What do you think about my having to purchase some kind of device that will keep someone from backing up to my trailer, and just towing it off. Is there something I can get that will prevent such a nefarious act?

EDITED: After research on the internet, I decided I had better get a basting bulb and get some distilled water. I opened the covers on the battery, and as I suspected, nearly dry. I added distilled water with the bulb, and closed things up. I have the battery on a charger, and just hope that it wasn't too late to rescue this battery. I did not know you had to check water levels once a month. Stupid me. Guess that is like the lack of knowledge about wiring, and other electrical stuff. But I am learning. I just hope the battery wasn't an expensive lesson.

On another note, after some research, I have found out that the particular battery generator I want recommends discharge no lower down than 20 percent, but says it can go down to 10 percent and still be usable. I gather that any lower than 20 percent starts degrading the recharging ability back to whatever peak level is available depending on how old the battery generator is. That means only 95Wh of capacity that can be used. Like I said, still learning.
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby hankaye » Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:02 am

CaleyAnn, Howdy;

Don't know if I'd mix an old battery with a new one. You might want to do
some more research about that. Think you'll find that mixin' will not get you
much better then the weaker of the 2. Electric ain't my strong suit so here's
a search I did;
https://www.google.com/search?q=mixing+ ... refox-b-ab
this is the Google page, pick what you will ...

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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby CaleyAnn » Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:30 am

Hank, Wasn't planning on mixing with either the battery generator, or if I purchase an AGM Deep Cycle, that one either. If I had been able to resurrect the battery, I would have used it by itself. I just checked, and though the charger said fully charged, the power indicator on my battery box housing said barely there.

Looks like I will have to go out and purchase one or two new batteries, and ensure I stay up on the maintenance that I didn't know about. Always thought the new batteries were maintenance free. Wonder if my car battery is in need of a drink?

Anyway, trying was at least a try. At least I will have the battery disposal fee of $18 for this battery towards a new one, and I still have the battery enclosure I purchased for the now defunct battery. Stupid me just tossed a $150 battery down the drain because of lack of knowledge. Sigh!!!
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby John61CT » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:16 am

The learning curve unavoidably costs some money.

Here the lesson is that Lead batts must be stored isolated at 100% full, and self-discharge must be taken into account.

FLA kept on a tiny trickle is OK, fancier chemistries better to top up every couple weeks, depending on temperature.

Cooler is better
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby John61CT » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:29 am

*Please* just use the term battery,

or maybe "powerpack" for the "battery in a box with some electronics",

ideally by brand/model since they vary so widely.

Words do mean things, and the term "generator" is so widely abused by (mostly scamming) marketeers, it causes a lot of confusion and should not be used in that way by evidence-based rational consumers.

For clarity, IMO the word should be reserved for the Honda or Champion etc devices that make noise and turn dino juice into electricity.

I suppose a "solar generator" that includes panels and a controller is clear enough, but these powerpack products do not do anything to produce power, just store and maybe convert it.
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby McDave » Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:44 pm

Don't give up on that deep cycle battery just yet. There may be some hope for resurrection. First, take batt. off charger.
Be sure all cells are full but not overfilled with distilled water. Then just let that battery rest and normalize for a couple days. BEST TO NOT HAVE IT SITTING DIRECTLY ON CONCRETE. Then put your voltmeter on there and see if there has been a change, and check water. Then you can put a high amp charge on it 10-12 amps+ probably all night. Then see if the voltage came up to 12.6 or better. If so let it rest for a few hrs, then just put into a normal recharge cycle. You can test each cell and we can go over that later if you want.

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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby CaleyAnn » Thu Jan 25, 2018 1:36 pm

John, I'm not going to get into a terminology fit. I call it what the manufacturer calls it. If they want to call it a battery generator, that is fine with me, but I will not argue. End of discussion on terminology.

McDave, Thanks for bringing back a semblance of hope for this battery. It is housed inside a battery housing made of some kind of plastic. That housing has a cigarette lighter plug on it, and also a battery charge indicator. That housing sits on a small wheeled platform so I can move it without having to pick it up. And that platform is on linoleum floor, out in my observatory. So I think it is going to be fine. I will see if my charger can give it the jolt charge you mentioned. Apparently you can do it with higher voltage to this type of battery like I have done to rechargable NiMH cells that were very low voltage. I just gave them a few seconds on high input, and that seemed to awaken them
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby CaleyAnn » Fri Jan 26, 2018 6:52 pm

I got my trailer insulation today. I was going to get pink type insulation and some kind of gray stuff, but when I got to Homely Despotty, the gray foam was actually white, and granular type. It was pretty much like you see in packing of furniture you put together.

So I changed my plans and got 4x8 sheets that are 1 inch thick. This is very rigid type foam, so I could not bend it at all. In order to get the foam between the framework, I had to cut things in three pieces. The frame width is 14.75 inches, so I had to cut to 13 inches wide, and then add two other pieces to make up for the difference.. It ended up being a very tight fit. I actually had to lightly tap the last piece into place. This metal stud or whatever you call it, is basically a U-shape on the side, then that U-shaped metal stud is bent over the top of the trailer, and down the other side. I stuffed another piece of insulation in the slot to close off everything. I will cover with the metal looking sticky tape to close off any little gaps that I may have either missed or created. My cutting was not perfect. The R-Valuse is 6, which seems to be the highest for one inch thick foam. I hope it will make some difference when it comes to the cold in the winter, and heat in the summer.

One side of the trailer is pretty much done. But I still have to remove the other side plywood, and the forward bulkhead wood and metal pieces in order to access that. Hopefully I will get the other wall and the forward bulkhead finished this weekend.

Then I have to figure out how to do the ceiling. I think that where the ceiling curves, I will have to use pink foam, as it does cut easier, and I can create little V-grooves that I can use to shape the foam to the curves. I will be leaving a gap at the top corners on the sides of the trailer that will contain the plastic conduit that will carry all the 12 volt wiring. The wiring is thin enough that I think I only need this conduit on the sides. I will wrap the wires that lead down the wall, or into the ceiling with something to protect them from chaffing, or maybe I can cut a groove in the insulation to accommodate the wiring. I have a wood burner tool that I can put the X-acto knife onto to do the cutting.

I now know why I cannot get the trailer dealer to install a Fan-tastic fan into my roof. Those metal studs are less than 14 inches apart when you include the flanges that stick out. This fan is too wide, and that would have meant cutting part of one of these out. Probably not good for structural integrity. But I did find https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00407CK5W/_e ... P94C&psc=0 Which seems to be adequately rated, and it is for a smaller trailer or van, which probably will work well with the trailer I have.

The one thing I am not looking forward to is cutting the four 2 inch holes in the side of the trailer to make room for the two computer fans, and the related vents. From what I have read, all I have to do is drill a pilot hole into the side of the trailer siding. Then I take my 2 inch hole saw, and cut through that, through the foam, and then finally through the interior plywood. That supposedly will give me a straight through hole in the four locations I want.

I've done designing my basic setup for this trailer. I will have a platform that is 27 inches wide, 18 inches tall, and 63 inches long. The top will be made up of three fold up lids so I can access the three compartments underneath. One of those compartments will be for my battery and electrical The other two will be for general storage. This bed, while looking from the rear of the trailer will be on the right side. I have to put it on that side, as I have to install the teardrop doorway (24x36) on the left side. This ensures I have room to get in and out of the trailer without having to crawl over the bed platform. I'll probably have to round the corner of the platform near the door in order to make it easier for me to move in and out, but I don't think that will matter, as my head will be to the rear of the trailer when sleeping. That allows me to swing my legs over the side and turn to get out.

This also allows me to put cupboards at the front of the trailer, which will be 12 inches high, and 15 inches deep located just down from the ceiling. My feet will be under those cupboards.

On the other wall I will install two small fold up table tops. One can be used for munching a meal on, and the other can have a fan or whatever else on top. Unfortunately they have to be folded down at night in order for me to be able to move in and out of the trailer. This trailer is just tiny, so there isn't a lot I can do with it like add a fridge, A/C wash basin, shower and toilet. Maybe someday I will have a vehicle that can tow a 7x16 cargo trailer that I can convert to contain those. But for now, I will have to rough it. But it isn't quite like living in a soft walled tent, which just gives me the heebie jeebies.

Anyway, I have started, and so far things seem to be working out.

Oh! Note on the 106Ah AGM battery I have. It is dead, and will have to go to the battery graveyard. I will get some kind of replacements. I think someone mentioned Duracell 6 Volt 250 something Ah golf cart AGM batteries. I think they are 60 pounds a piece, which is just about at my weight lift limit. There's a vendor down in the Palm Springs area, but I will see if there is something else I can get. I'd actually like to just have one battery of this type, but not sure something is available that is light enough for me to move.
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Re: Here Goes with My Cargo Trailer Conversion, In this Sub-

Postby John61CT » Fri Jan 26, 2018 8:37 pm

The best battery value by far is Duracell (actually Deka/East Penn) FLA deep cycle golf cart batteries, 2x6V, ~$200 per 200+AH pair from BatteriesPlus or Sam's Club.

Deka/Duracell AGM are not great, for AGM, go with Lifeline, Odyssey or Northstar, but FLA is much cheaper, more robust and lasts longer.
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