2013 Mirage XPO 6x12- Mt Air Express

[cornfused]

Looking good so far, I'm also interested in how this holds up.

[AZ_Desert_Rat]

Hi Cindy,
I like the insulation of the floor cavities --- Please keep us posted as to how well they work and hold up. I need to insulate mine as well, the heavy rubber-backed carpet helps, but is no match for really cold camping ...

[hankaye]

Rainier70, Howdy;

Cindy, would you be kind enough to go through the process of the canvas treatment.
I do better understanding photos and videos than I do with printed words.
Looks good what you've got so far.

Thanks

hank

[hankaye]

AZ_Desert_Rat, Howdy;

Hi Cindy,
I like the insulation of the floor cavities --- Please keep us posted as to how well they work and hold up. I need to insulate mine as well, the heavy rubber-backed carpet helps, but is no match for really cold camping ...

Exercise your options and don't camp where it gets below your comfort temp. ...

hank

[Glenlivet]

That's interesting, the heat loss through the floor. I hadn't thought that would be a biggie. I'd better start thinking about insulating mine. Thanks you.

[Rainier70]

Hank, I didn't take pictures of the canvasing process. Although there are lots of pictures of the process in the foamie build sections. Anyway here is what I did:

Washed my canvas painter's tarp from Harbor Freight and dried it so that it could shrink... it lost about a foot.

I cut my foam to the size of the spaces.

Ruffed up the smooth surface of the foam with sandpaper and by bouncing the sharp end of a screw driver over the surface to make dimples. This is just to create more surface grip. Many of the foamie builds use a wallpaper scrapper/perforator for this step. Others don't even do this step.

Cut a piece of canvas for the foam piece.... about an inch big in all directions.

Next I put on a good layer of Titebond II glue onto the foam.

Then I spread the canvas onto the top of the foam. Pulling it tight and around the side. Rubbing it in and getting it to bond with the glue.

After that was set and mostly dry. I rollered a soaking coat of 50% glue and water over all of the canvas, until it was soaked good. This drys really hard.

I let that dry and then painted with primer and later with semi gloss interior paint that I had.... should use exterior.

LIke I said though it will cost almost as much as putting frp panels on if you have to buy all the materials.

Looking at Home Depot prices and just picking gallon as the size here are some of the costs:
1 gal Titebond II $18.68
1 gal Primer abt $15
1 gal exterior paint abt $30
HF canvas painter's drop cloth abt $15

Some people that are doing the foamies are using Glidden Gripper Primer as both the glue and the primer it is abt $22. But using it you wouldn't have the cost of the glue and primer both.

Another avenue for less cost is to check with your stores' paint departments for "mistake" paint. Or even at a city hazardous waste disposal. They frequently have part gallons of paint.

This was worth a try for me since I had the materials extra already. I don't know if it will hold up to all of the gravel roads I travel, but we'll see. If not I am out my work and $15. But I enjoyed learning how to do this process and how many uses it could have. Some people are even using this process to make foam/canvas boats and kayaks.

Edit: On the costs. I over estimated since I have only used about a half gallon of all the materials instead of a full gallon. They were leftovers, and I still have leftovers. I used maybe a little more than a half gallon of the TBII. So figure costs of about 1/2 gallon amounts instead of the gallons.

[Rainier70]

AZ_Desert_Rat, Howdy;

Hi Cindy,
I like the insulation of the floor cavities --- Please keep us posted as to how well they work and hold up. I need to insulate mine as well, the heavy rubber-backed carpet helps, but is no match for really cold camping ...

Exercise your options and don't camp where it gets below your comfort temp. ...

hank

I know this was kidding, but for me I don't always have those warm weather options. I need to leave the valleys when the air gets bad for me just about anytime of the year. That means during early spring burning etc. Both the farmers and the forest service have been burning off and on since mid April. Which is fine, they need to, but I have to get up higher and out of it. The same goes for late fall when many fields etc are burned again. The latest I had to leave and camp was about 20th of Nov last year. The weather at 7 to 10 thousand feet is iffy and usually very cold early in the spring and late in the fall. So my camper needs a bit more insulation than most.

I think that the cold coming through the floor that froze my water bottle this last time was made worse because there was a good "breeze" going. Thus the "wind chill" was lower than the actual temp outside. I figure that the underside of my ct is much like a cot. If you have ever slept in a cot in the cold, you will know that you have to put a lot of insulation under you or the cold air under will suck the heat right out of your body.

A few other people also camp in the high elevations such as Idaho, Wyoming, or Colorado. What I am doing with my ct may be of help to some of them also.

[hankaye]

Rainier70, Howdy;

Yep I was kidding... thanks for taking it the way it was intended,
also thanks for the SBS for the canvas trick. Much appreciated, truly.
Try a sign shop for some chloroplast, it's the corrugated plastic that is
used for the belly pans on a lot of the RV's that are on the road nowadays.
It will help keep road debris from eating away at you under insulation. A
thin metal strip to secure the front and use some self-taping screws down
the sides and across the back. It will also ad a (somewhat), layer of air insulation.

Survival tip from my days in the military, Always have 7X's under you than you
have over you when sleeping outdoors. Heat moves to cold so even if the cold is
below that's the way the heat will move. Kinda like sleeping on a cold waterbed.

Good luck with your build, please keep us in the loop.

hank

[lrrowe]

I wonder how practical it is to use on a CT, the idea I used last fall while hunting/camping for my DIY tent/canopy system.
Basically I set up a 10x10 canopy under a 12x20 truck/car type of outdoor awning/shelter. I put plastic tarp on the ground for a base and sit my cot on top of that. Now my previous experiences of sleeping in the Eastern woods like this is that under the cot, is a lot of cold air is there to move up through the cot to my sleeping bag. In other words, I froze many times.

So this year I draped an old heavy quilt over the cot to enclose the area under the cot. Then I put a couple of layers on top of the cot, under the sleeping bag. This year in 25 degree nights, I was very warm as compared to earlier times.

Now here is my ideas or question. What about putting a "skirt" of sorts around the CT at night in cold weather? Yes there are many details and logistics to think about. But that might that help keep "moving" cold air from getting under you? Just maybe it might stabilize the temp to be a little higher then if you did nothing?

Does this make sense?

Bob

[Tx River Rat]

Bob
You are dead on about the skirt. We underpinned a rv on a deer lease and it made a ton of difference.
Ron

[Rainier70]

Yeah, if you can block air movement that helps with the heat retention. Skirts are really helpful when you camp for multiple days. But they do have the setup factor.

Many of my trips are short. I may leave at 6:30pm and overnight it, then come back at say 10 the next morning. I know that sounds a little crazy, but that's the way it is. I really like having very little extra set up to do. The more that I get finished with things like this insulating, the more it just works and is comfortable and easy. Things are packed and ready enough that I can get parked and be in bed in about 20 minutes. That is what I really like about having the ct. With it I can leave at a moments notice, and yet be safe, comfortable, and have fun for one day or for a month.

[lrrowe]

When I made this post, I realized that this step would not be a quick thing to do at each camp setup. But I am sure that for a week's hunt camp in November, that taking the time would be worth it. Now the challenge is what to use and how to secure it. But I think I will wait to tackle this until the CT is right in front of me.

Bob

[Rainier70]

Irrowe, I am really looking forward to seeing what you do with your ct. You've certainly given some great input in the various discussions. You must have an encyclopedia of ideas all ready to go!

[lrrowe]

Thanks Cindy for the observation,
I have a ton of ideas which I have developed over many months of lurking and then contributing to this great forum. I really planned on starting my CT mods now, but a very painful and physically limiting back/nerve issue developed which basically has me chair bound. So all committing was placed on hold. This means no CT was ordered.

But the good news is that my specialist says he can fix it with me going under the knife. May 21 is my operation date. Then after 6 weeks of doing little for recovery, watch out. I will approach this all with a vengeance. Hopefully, once successfully getting up off the operating table, I will place my order for a 6 x14, tandem, barn door, screw less side, and 6" added height CT. And I do have a lot of different approaches that I will take ( money allowing). There has been a huge amount of creativity and craftsmanship shown by others and I look forward to trying to add to that.

Bob

[Rainier70]

Bummer! I am sorry to hear that. Praying for all the best for you. May you have a speedy recover.