M116A3 Build

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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:23 pm

featherliteCT1 wrote:lfhoward,

Have you been able to test how far away from your Victron device you can be with your phone and still read Victron data on your phone?

For example, it would be nice to be able to be driving down the road and to look at your phone as you drive to see what is going on with your electrical system.

Also, what is the operating system for your phone (i.e., Apple or Android or whatever)?

Thanks!

I have not tried it from my Jeep because I haven’t been anywhere yet, but the range from the trailer for the battery monitor (which is the hub of my network) seems to be within the space of a normal campsite. I have no doubt I could get it in my Jeep. The two charge controllers have a shorter bluetooth range, possibly because of where I hid them. From the opposite side of the trailer, where the signal has to travel through the most stuff, I have to be pretty close, like within 12 feet. On the side of the trailer where they are, the signal is pretty strong, but not as strong as the battery monitor. I have an iPhone, using the Victron Connect app.
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:25 pm

bdosborn wrote:
lfhoward wrote:The Vmp of 17.6 of one panel would mean the battery would have to be discharged to 12.6 volts before the charger would kick in (likely with lead acid batteries but not my new LiFePO4 battery).


At the risk of belaboring a point, the panel will be disconnected by the controller so the PV voltage it's sensing to start charging is Voc, not Vmp. Your panel's Voc is up over 21V and that's a fairly typical value. It doesn't take much light for the panel to get to Voc; I get 12.5V when I turn on the garage lights. The victron controller will start charging a LiFePO4 with just about any modern 12V PV panel, you don't need to worry about that 5V difference.
Bruce
P.S. Parallel PV controllers is no big deal, I've been running them for years. Just make sure they are both set to the same battery charge parameters when you install them.

This point about the Voc vs. Vmp is great news. It means a single panel should work in most situations. Thanks for clarifying that. :thumbsup:
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:27 pm

bdosborn wrote:
lfhoward wrote:My 210 watt roof panel from Continuous Resources just arrived. That’s a couple of weeks earlier than expected! Nice! :thumbsup:


I've been eyeing those, let me know what you think of it...
Bruce

Will do. All I could say so far is that it appears to be packaged well for shipping. I haven’t had a chance to open it up yet.
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby MickinOz » Mon Jul 26, 2021 3:59 am

bdosborn wrote:the panel will be disconnected by the controller so the PV voltage it's sensing to start charging is Voc.

That's what I reckon - a panel that isn't flowing any current runs up the volts in surprisingly low light conditions
bdosborn wrote:Parallel PV controllers is no big deal, I've been running them for years. Just make sure they are both set to the same battery charge parameters when you install them.
[/quote]
This one I had never thought would work, however enough have said it will to convince me it must be true. Which is good, because my suitcase controller is hard wired so not by-passable without cutting wires.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby John61CT » Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:27 am

Multiple disparate "dumb" charge sources can all be connected to a target batt concurrently without any problem.

Best if their charge profiles are similar, but even if not, it all works out fine in the end.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Thu Aug 05, 2021 3:24 pm

The new 210 watt solar panel from HighTec Solar is installed. :thumbsup:
Image

Here are the specs:
Image

The old 140 watt panel cleans up nicely and is for sale here and on the Philadelphia Craigslist.
Image

For comparison, here are its specs:
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F/S link: http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=74019

Both are exactly the same dimensions, about 58 x 26. It’s cool that solar efficiency is getting better. I am excited to have 50% more watts in the same roof space. I didn’t have to change the roof mounting at all.

I am impressed by the build quality of the HighTec Solar panel, and the packaging was good also. If you want more info about it, let me know. I bought it from http://www.continuousresources.com. The panel itself was made in Michigan City, Indiana.
Last edited by lfhoward on Thu Aug 05, 2021 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby bdosborn » Thu Aug 05, 2021 4:52 pm

Hmm, looks like they had the temperature probe unplugged when they tested it. Wonder why?

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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Thu Aug 05, 2021 4:59 pm

bdosborn wrote:Hmm, looks like they had the temperature probe unplugged when they tested it. Wonder why?

Bruce

Ha! Didn’t notice that until you pointed it out.
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Fri Aug 06, 2021 12:54 pm

Here is a how-to thread I wrote up today for building my DIY LiFePO4 battery:

Image

http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=74022
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Wed Aug 11, 2021 3:47 pm

Visiting my trailer today where I park it, I decided to change how I go about keeping the battery charged, so that the new LiFePO4 chemistry stays happier long term.

Image

In the past for my lead acid deep cycle batteries, I would leave the solar panels hooked up to it all the time, because 100% charge was ideal for preventing degradation. For LiFePO4, storage over long periods at 100% charge is not desirable, and can lead to cell degradation. (100% charge would be 3.65 volts per cell, or 14.6 volts for the pack.) For the last 2 weeks I had set my solar charge controllers to max out at 14.1 volts, so that things charged to maybe 90%. Today I decided I am not sure that it is necessary to leave the solar charge controllers on at all between camping trips. I ran the fan and some electronics to get the pack’s Amps down to 90% according to the Victron battery meter (which is better than approximating it using voltage readings). I turned off the solar panel so no power would be coming in. There should be very little parasitic draw from the shunt and charge controllers, and none from the battery heater thermostat since I have that turned off. I’ll check back on it in a week to see how it’s doing, but I think this is how I’m going to roll from now on:

At the end of a camping trip, before leaving the campsite, I’ll turn the solar panel off and run the battery down to 90%. Then at home, I’ll park the camper with everything electronic turned off.

Before a camping trip, before leaving, I’ll turn the solar panel on so the battery can charge up to full. I would leave the panel on and charging the whole time while camping, when I’m actively using battery power.

I have thought about how I want to incorporate the battery heater in the winter also. I don’t want to leave it on all the time, which I would have to do if I was solar charging all the time between camping trips. I will plan to turn the heater on prior to a winter camping trip, letting the battery warm up before solar charging. Then the heater would be enabled continuously (with the thermostat) during the entire camping trip. At the end of the trip when turning off the panels I could turn the battery heater thermostat off too.

The change of paradigm here is treating the trailer like an electronic device you turn off when not in use, rather than leaving charging going all the time. The LiFePO4 batteries should be happier that way. The only exception would be if the lithium batteries were highly discharged already. If they were under 25% I would probably charge them for a day or two, to give them a buffer from any parasitic draw. Extreme discharge (under 2.5 volts per cell or 10 volts for the pack) can kill them too.
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby featherliteCT1 » Wed Aug 11, 2021 5:34 pm

lfhoward,

I really appreciate your electrical system explanations. I am learning a lot from you!

You said: "There should be very little parasitic draw from the shunt and charge controllers ..."

Is there some reason why you would not just disconnect all loads, including the shunt and controllers?
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby lfhoward » Wed Aug 11, 2021 6:02 pm

featherliteCT1 wrote:lfhoward,

I really appreciate your electrical system explanations. I am learning a lot from you!

You said: "There should be very little parasitic draw from the shunt and charge controllers ..."

Is there some reason why you would not just disconnect all loads, including the shunt and controllers?

Thank you! :D

I do have a master off switch that I could throw, which would disconnect everything. I would do that if I knew I was just going to store the trailer for several months. But since I’m hoping to camp every few weeks or so, I want the Victron battery monitor to stay calibrated to the number of amp hours in the battery. If it gets completely disconnected it doesn’t forget its basic settings (like battery type, etc.) but it does lose the state of charge info.
My off-road camper build on an M116A3 military chassis:
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=62581
Tow vehicle: 2008 Jeep Liberty with a 4 inch lift.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby bdosborn » Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:14 pm

I have an Iota battery charger with an LiFePo4 plug in wizard. It floats my battery at 13.5V without out charging. Then every two weeks it will wake up and give the battery a quick charge up to 3.65V per cell. Then it floats for 2 more weeks. I'm not sure how well the battery will like the charge regime but I'm going to see how well it works over time.

Bruce
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby John61CT » Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:24 pm

Can those setpoints be adjusted?

That treatment would only be good if the pack were needed for cycling at full capacity during that time, say running bilge pumps on an unattended boat.

LFP cells should not just sit at high SoC when in storage mode, being Floated shortens longevity no matter the voltage.
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Re: M116A3 Build

Postby John61CT » Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:28 pm

lfhoward wrote:I do have a master off switch that I could throw, which would disconnect everything.


The biggest culprit is often the BMS.


> I would do that if I knew I was just going to store the trailer for several months. But since I’m hoping to camp every few weeks or so, I want the Victron battery monitor to stay calibrated to the number of amp hours in the battery. If it gets completely disconnected it doesn’t forget its basic settings (like battery type, etc.) but it does lose the state of charge info

Loads can remain powered by a cheap lead batt, e. g. the Starter, while the pricey LFP cells remain isolated
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