RV shower trap question - shower sump pump?

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RV shower trap question - shower sump pump?

Postby aggie79 » Mon Apr 25, 2011 1:49 pm

From what I've seen, RV shower pans are mounted on a raised floor to give room for a trap between the trailer floor and the raised floor.

Can someone say why the shower drain piping is plumbed this way rather than cutting out the main trailer floor and have the trap extend below the floor? (I'm guessing that it is not done this way to avoid freezing, keep road debris from damaging the trap, and/or placing the outfall too low for the black water tank.)

The reason I'm asking this question is that I am considering building a standy with a shower, but would also like it to be "garage-able" while maintaining standing height in the shower.

Thank you for your time,
Tom
Last edited by aggie79 on Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby bobhenry » Mon Apr 25, 2011 2:32 pm

With a little creative adaption a running trap or "s" trap could be easily used as a vent stop.

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It is extremely low profile and since we are not taking 50 gallon showers the small volumn should be handled with the 3/4 or 1" S trap.
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Postby StandUpGuy » Mon Apr 25, 2011 6:34 pm

Since I am putting a shower in a pop top and have the same issues, this is interesting to me. I am droping my shower pan and I figured for that reason alone I would use a grey water tank seperate from my black water. From what I estimate and read here, the "stink" factor of the grey tank is not a big issue and thus I may be able to get away with no trap. If that is not so then I will need to fabricate something low profile as a trap as Mr. Bob Henry is suggesting.
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Postby 48Rob » Mon Apr 25, 2011 6:51 pm

(I'm guessing that it is not done this way to avoid freezing, keep road debris from damaging the trap, and/or placing the outfall too low for the black water tank.)


Yes.

From what I estimate and read here, the "stink" factor of the grey tank is not a big issue and thus I may be able to get away with no trap


Yes again.

As long as you are mindful of what might go into the grey tank, and prevent it, it won't smell enough to warrant a trap.
Milk, meat, grain, food scraps in general will create nasty odors.
Showers, hand washing, and plate/pot washing (as long as you remove the majority of the food scraps first) will leave you with a grey tank that doesn't stink.
It should go without saying that the grey tank should be sanitized at least once a year, if not more often to prevent bacteria from growing (bacteria=stink).

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Postby StandUpGuy » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:24 pm

For me it is going to be showers, hand washing and coffee cup washing.
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Vent

Postby legend lime » Fri May 20, 2011 9:16 pm

Don't forget on any gray water or black water tank installed in a camper you will need to install a vent pipe in each tank and the vent will need to exit at the top of your roof line of the camper. This is to aid in getting rid of the stink and to aid in draining the tanks.

Just my 2c worth.
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Postby aggie79 » Mon May 23, 2011 8:17 am

Thanks for all of your responses.

I'm still wrestling with my overall design - "garage-able" or taller. Shower height is one consideration. A dropped floor is certainly possible, but I'm trying to not have to use a portable "blue" grey water tank. They aren't heavy, but are bulky to haul.

Gary - Dumpster Diner - PM'ed a possible solution. He suggested that a sump pump - home-made version - could be used to pump the grey water to a grey water tank. The genius of this system is that it doesn't not depend upon gravity, and allows the drop floor to come back into my design thoughts. I'm now looking into possibilities of using a sump pump.

Take care,
Tom
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Postby StPatron » Mon May 23, 2011 1:22 pm

Now THAT's a great idea!! :applause:

But, you get the credit for it Tom.

When I was writing about the marine bilge pump I was referring to its usage as a water pump for a pressurized shower.

I will concede to a 50/50 profit sharing on the idea if you insist,,, :lol:
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Postby dh » Mon May 23, 2011 7:02 pm

One thought, look at a bathtub drain, they hug right up to the bottom of the tub and can be used in a shower application, or on the sink in my case.
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Postby Mukilteo » Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:45 pm

I had a late 60s 19 foot Shasta that had the trap beneith the trailer and a box built around it. No gray water holding tank.
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Postby aggie79 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:54 pm

I'm still on the quest to get a garage-able semi-standy that incorporates a near standing shower.

In researching marine showers, I've come across a marine shower sump pump. This would allow me to have a grey water tank that is above the level of the floor which allow to me use a dropped floor.

Does anyone have experience with a marine shower sump pump?

Thanks,
Tom
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Postby StPatron » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:47 pm

aggie79 wrote:Does anyone have experience with a marine shower sump pump?

Thanks,
Tom


No. Just brainstorming here.

Where will the shower water be initially collected?
1. Via floor drain into a temp holding tank.
2. Shower floor only.
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Postby aggie79 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:01 pm

Gary,

These "package" marine sump pumps are pretty compact. The sump is a box that is about 6" x 10" by 5" deep. The pump is a small 12 volt pump like a windshield washer pump. It must be a little different in that the pump has a built in float switch, can run dry, and can handle soap and small debris. Most have 2-4 3/4" fittings on the side of the sump box. To these are connected the drain feeds from a shower, bath sink, etc.

Here is a pic of one I borrowed from the internet:

Image

My thought was to have a line off the shower drain to the close by sump pump and pump the grey water to a tank that is underneath a bed or bench in the trailer. Among many things, I'm not sure how/if you need to vent these things.

Anyway, I'm probably off my rocker one more time.

Take care,
Tom
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Postby StPatron » Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:11 pm

That looks like a slick unit, Tom. I like the idea of consolidating numerous drains also. Thanks for introducing me to the product.

I hope you'll pardon my unfamiliarity with the unit. Knowing your attention to detail, these may be silly questions.

Do you have a location in mind that will allow you to easily access the float in case it sticks? I would be concerned that an accumulation of shower water soap scum and toothpaste goo might clog the works eventually. It appears the clear top is designed for access, but where will the unit be located? Is this a top flush-mount with the floor?

Are there specs on the lift capability of the pump?

I can't with 100% certainty answer your vent yes/no question other than to say that vent design isn't nearly as critical with grey vs. black.

Off your rocker? Nah. Thinking outside the standard grey water tank gravity drop systems "box"? Yeah. You're increasing the potential for complications and also adding to the expense. If your design is dependent on this feature and you're willing to accept the associated risks,,, go for it!
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Gray water

Postby Bikerman » Tue Jul 05, 2011 1:41 pm

Well, I might get jumped on by my "question" as not being environmentally correct, but it's my understanding that gray water can go on the ground.

If I put up a shower tent and shower inside, that's where the gray water goes, on the ground.

It's my understanding that gray water is all water run off that is used that is not black water used by toilets. So, the shower, dish water, sink from shaving and washing, washing clothes or cleaning floors for example are all gray water issues.

The use of environmental cleaning supplies and not to allow certain chemicals to drain as gray water may be required in certain areas and is good practice anywhere.

So, if that's the case, why couldn't you just allow the shower drain to a hose and allow it to drain away from the site?

Yes, it's been awhile since I stayed in any campground. So, if I'm wrong, please educate me.
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