Towing?

All about towing and tow vehicles

Towing?

Postby johnnail » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:00 pm

I have a 980lb TD. Do you think my KIA Soul would pull it ok?
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Re: Towing?

Postby MtnDon » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:43 pm

In Europe it would be rated for something like 1200 lbs w/o trailer brakes most likely. In the USA I believe it does not come with an approval to tow anything. If there is still some factory warranty left a question to ask is what will the Kia warranty folks say if they find a hitch on the Kia? There are some makes that will void the warranty when they find a hitch on the vehicle. Another question would be what is the gross weight rating?

We in the US tend to have faster speeds on our highways, that may be some of the reason for the differences.
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Re: Towing?

Postby johnnail » Wed Aug 27, 2014 6:26 pm

thanks, Don
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Re: Towing?

Postby MtnDon » Wed Aug 27, 2014 6:59 pm

Our 6x12 deep vee nose cargo trailer camper conversion... viewtopic.php?f=42&t=58336

We have a small off grid cabin we built ourselves in the NM mountains; small PV solar system; 624 watts PV, Outback CC & inverter/charger ... http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.0
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Re: Towing?

Postby wyrdone » Wed Aug 27, 2014 7:43 pm

Wipes sweat from my brow.....according to Subaru's site, I'm rated to 2400lbs. But should keep below 1500lbs unless I install trailer brakes and/or add a transmission cooler.

That and this article makes me feel better about my target weight (Still trying to keep her under 1200lbs Dry weight).
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Towing?

Postby GerryS » Thu Aug 28, 2014 5:13 am

Let's start a war.....you need brakes even if you trailer is "only" 1200 pounds. If I were overlord in chief for a day, this would be one of my edicts. The margin of safety skyrockets with brakes....

I had several close calls because I didn't have them...and every time I had a short stop event, I thought...a). This is going to be it. b) I shoulda got the brakes...

This would happen about once or twice on a trip...it wasn't uncommon. And I don't drive like Mario Andretti....more like grandpa

Also, in the long run, it will save you money. I had a truck with substantial brakes comparatively to any car on the road today, and I would tear through shoes quicker than a toddler could outgrow them...because I bought a cheaper trailer and compromised the brakes.

Bottom line in my experience is the ability to stop quicker,and the cost savings because I don't chew up linings, pads, and rotors as fast make the decision to add brakes a no-brainier. I'll never not have brakes on a trailer again.
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Re: Towing?

Postby slowcowboy » Thu Aug 28, 2014 5:22 am

okay the brake wars. I use brakes even on a tiny teardrop and thats just me. I like them. on heavy farm loads I like them bettor on ice and snow they sometimes save your ass when the trailer hits a dry spot. most of the time its install the controler in your vechile and it install the brakes on the trailer and then its simpley plug in your trailer lights and forget about them you never normaly touch the controler.

for some people they can get by pretty good with no brakes espically on a smaller teardrop and on a vehcile with dang good brakes.

and on a pretty new tow car that has not many miles on it.

any thing used and older and any thing with high milage I would NEVER recomened it.

its sometimes the brakes on the trailer much like the saftey chains on your trialer hitch and sometimes the brakes on your trailer do a lot more to stop you than you acutally realize they are doing!

find your self down shifting even in a automatic slow down is the first sign of needing trailer brakes.

and mine are set pretty low on the controler in the car. but most of the times after I spend the money to install them on a trailer I normally never regrett it and I normaly never touch them again.

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Re: Towing?

Postby Mojave Bob » Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:40 am

Before this thread gets locked :lol: , somebody will probably chime in about "never needed 'em, and I tow an Airstream with my Smart car". The relative NEED for brakes is a sliding scale, relative to the stopping power of the tow vehicle, and the "going" power of the trailer. But one thing is always true -- any vehicle combination will stop quicker with better braking power.

Here is my perspective: I am driving, with my trailer in tow, and suddenly a child darts in front of me. I can come to a straight, wheels-locked panic stop in 30 feet without trailer brakes, or 25 feet with trailer brakes. That 5 feet may save a child's life. And, that is NOT an unlikely scenario. If I can stop just 6 INCHES faster in that scenario, I want to! The same logic applies to whether or not to push to tow limits of my vehicle just because I "can".

I'm not so much worried about protecting my warranty, or my transmission, or my rotors (although those are all valid issues). I am ultimately more concerned about protecting someone from harm.
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Re: Towing?

Postby GerryS » Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:18 pm

So true. So far, I've not had the darting kid, it's usually a minivan that decides they've got to get between me and the car in front of me when traffic is coming to a halt because of the accident ahead.... Oh, there was a few CLOSE calls.

To answer the question that started the thread....what does the manual say? If the manual says you can tow 1500 pounds, your probably OK. But remember cargo in the car itself plus passengers all add stresses too....

It's sad to see that there are so terribly few cars that can tow anything being produces....the CAFE standards are really tough to meet...and lightweight low capacity vehicles is the new norm. I hate the thought of buying an f150 to tow a tear, when my Saturn of just a few years ago could easily have fit the bill.
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Re: Towing?

Postby noseoil » Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:04 pm

Most of the smaller (not full size) new pick-up trucks can be bought with a 4 cylinder engine & standard transmission. They also have full frames for hauling & towing. Ours ('07 Frontier) gets about 20 in town & 24 on the highway, more in the winter without the AC running continuously. I'm wondering what I will end up with while towing 1200# - 1500# for fuel economy. Smaller trucks will do quite well, you don't need a V8 & full size truck to tow a small tear.
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Re: Towing?

Postby Sheddie » Fri Aug 29, 2014 4:43 am

I had a look at the New Zealand Automobile Association web site to see what they had on their list. I don't know what year your car is, but they only list 2009 for the Soul. There probably isn't a lot of difference in the years. The open road speed limit in NZ is 100km/h (60m/h) for light vehicles (under 3.5 tonne) and 90km/h (55m/h) for trailers and heavy vehicles.

The following is from their site. http://www.aa.co.nz/cars/maintenance/towing/towing-weights/?pstart=10
"Check out the towing weight tables we provide per model or your vehicle's handbook for maximum braked and un-braked towing weights. Use these as a guideline. With a fully loaded trailer, braked or un-braked, you must be able to stop from 30km/h (18.64mph) on a dry road within seven metres (23ft).

Trailer brakes are not required unless total weight exceeds 2000kg. As another guide, don't tow an un-braked trailer which, when fully laden, weighs more than three-quarters of the weight of the tow vehicle." (I don't know how this compares to US regulations).

"Kia towing weights

These towing weights are sourced from the New Vehicle Distributor’s spec sheets. They’re based on vehicles sold new in NZ - spec levels and recommendations may vary with used imports. Some vehicles also require a transmission oil cooler be added for towing. It’s best to seek advice from your nearest dealer if required.
Soul 1.6 diesel (Plus & Burner) 2009 un-braked 550Kg (1212lbs). braked 1100Kg (2425lbs).
Soul 1.6 petrol 2009 un-braked 450Kg (992lbs). braked 1300Kg (2866lbs)."
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Towing?

Postby GerryS » Fri Aug 29, 2014 4:46 am

The small truck segment isn't doing all that well. The s10 was eliminated, as was the ford ranger...although I hear they are restarting the line. Well see.

Your 07 is about the same as my jeep....it doesn't do bad. But I'm talking new(er) cars. Unless your looking at a crossover (outback. Forester, escape, etc) your not going to find a passenger car with towing ability. Unlike a decade ago, where even compact cars had some capacity.

I'm all for saving money and fuel....but I resent being completely limited to tinfoil and plastic straws being used to make a car. I'm from an era when chrome was still reasonably thick and not plastic.
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Re: Towing?

Postby Gladtobehere » Fri Aug 29, 2014 6:25 am

I beleive that brakes on the trailer are a very good idea particularly for small tow vehicles. The brakes are only rated to stop a vehicle at its rated load. In small cars that load is consumed quickly by passengers leaving nothing for the trailer and its load.
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Re: Towing?

Postby bobhenry » Fri Aug 29, 2014 6:39 am

:oops:

Look ma ! No brakes ! Image

and not rated to tow !

I guess I'm the village idiot !
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Re: Towing?

Postby Gladtobehere » Fri Aug 29, 2014 6:55 am

I towed a 5*7 Little Guy with a Toyota Matrix. It towed easy. Never had a bad stop. However, with 2 passengers, 3bikes and all the other camping stuff, I believe that brakes would have been required had i ever had an emergency braking situation. I was lucky! :worship:
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