Jasen's 6x10 squaredrop

[JasenC]

And so it begins.

Building a 6x10x4.5' squaredrop of my own design for Mrs. Boss and myself.

I ordered the Northern Tool 5x8 steel trailer thru Amazon, shipping was $140 vs $540 from NT direct, that would have been the deal breaker.
I scoured CL and OfferUP for weeks looking for one, but anything reasonably priced had scaly rusted frames and rotten tires, I don't want a trailer project.
The local dealers rarely had anything used, and they wanted a mint for them, and steel prices are thru the roof 2-3 times higher than 2 years ago, so fabbing one up was out of the question.


So lets put it together.

Oh wait, I may be missing a part or two.

Best I can tell I have all the frame parts, waiting to hear back from NT and the freight company as to where the axle, wheels, springs, fenders, hitch coupler, lights, wiring and hardware are.
Freight ticket lists 2/3, sounds like a big box for the rest of it.

The freight company has had it at their facility an hour north of me for 18 days, they were 9 cans behind schedule.
I'm not upset about that, I've been dealing with this stuff at work for nearly 2 years now trying to remodel houses. One week I can't get plywood, the next week I hit 7 stores to find the last electrical remodel box in all of Seattle. Seriously, it can be like finding TP was early 2020

Anyway...

Build plan

6x8 cabin, queen sofa bed, rear galley, plywood/2x2/foam construction.
Flame King stove
Gasland 6l Tankless WH
Small sink
Maxxair roof vent
Dokio 160W solar
1500W inverter
NOCO genius charger
1 Interstate Batteries deep cycle 98Ah, probably add 1 or upgrade to lithium
Chinese diesel heater
BAL stabilizer jacks
Alpicool C40 cooler fridge
15-20 gal water
7-10 gal gray water
Outdoor chem toilet
Outdoor shower
Custom built 10x10ish retractable awning (I have an idea)
Buying canvas at Seattle fabrics for PMF
Paint with Totalboat
All LED lighting
*Custom built windows (I have another idea) Tap plastics is only a mile down the street.
Star gazzer

And a bunch of other bits
Planning a cedar strip ceiling and back wall (scored at work), thinking of doing a padded wall covering, maybe headliner, a heavy fleece or felt.
Not doing shore power, at least at this point. I'll put in the receptacle for it and use it to charge the battery.

* Window choices are slim right now and polycarbonate is 1/2 the price. A little extra work for something I'll be happier with.
Scavenged plenty of 2x4's from work to resaw into 2x2's
I'll probably be able to save some other stuff from the trash along the way.
My work buddy, the company cabinet builder, scored me some nice high quality cabinet ply scraps that should work nicely for the galley and cabin storage. Sounds like there might be some hardwood scraps coming to use for trim work.
I'll have to buy all the wall/flr/roof sheeting, it would be a lucky score to get the grade/type in the thickness I want.

I've been remodeling houses for 30 years, but I've watched all of the youtube videos, except for that one guy.
Doesn't hurt to see how others do it, as well as learn from their mistakes.

Joke of the day: I'm shooting for a $3500 build.
That's what was negotiated with Mrs. Boss

 

[celadon]

I am looking forward to this build! Especially the awning part. The devious smiley is what sold me.

 

[working on it]

...[Joke of the day: I'm shooting for a $3500 build.
That's what was negotiated with Mrs. Boss

* I started my build with the "promise" to keep it under $500, but knowing already that'd be nearly impossible, from reading the forums/lurking for a year or two before I started (first: Expedition Portal, which led me to TnTTT). Ostensibly, I was just making a safe and dry sleeping trailer for my wife's Bigfoot hunts with her girlfriends, but also had personal camping/exploring/travelling in mind for myself, as I was approaching retirement (I was 61).

* I started the build at a friend's home race-car shop, 50+ miles from home, for

• 1) room to build in (none in my garage at the time),
• 2) using my friend's skills and tools (I had minimal amounts of each, myself, specifically the major welding of frame extensions & reinforcements needed), and
• 3) so I could hide it from the wife until too far along for her to stop the project (I had hidden several car resto/racing projects in that manner before, and they were even more expensive).

* I had/have an HHR Panel that I would hide parts in, for unseen transport to the shop, so she'd not get wise to the expense. I paid cash for all parts, and destroyed the detailed list of what I'd bought, lest she would find it, too. I brought it home after 11 months and ??? spent, only half-finished (no interior, no windows, no wiring, etc.), and started finishing it with my purchases in plain sight. At home, I gradually used my new-found skills (& new tools) to get it camping after another 11 months. I'm still adding to/modifying it 10 years later, with probably 8-10 times the initial $500 budget spent on it.

I am looking forward to this build! Especially the awning part....

* I use a canopy when camping, since it was a cheap $50 EZY-Up (I have a spare $50 canopy, as well), but just couldn't see spending the extra cash for an awning (three to five times as expensive) for gaining "ease of use" vs canopies. I've tried designing my own variants, but the parts to make each one would be $150-200, so I never made one. Now that I'm older(71, with some non-working parts), and have trouble putting up the so-called EZY-Up canopy, I'm still looking for an awning solution, so I'll be following your build, also.

 

[twisted lines]

And so it begins.

I'm shooting for a $3500 build.
That's what was negotiated with Mrs. Boss

Buy Her a Shreder For Christmas

 

[JasenC]

On todays episode of As The Trailer Turns.

Finally got thru to the freight company.

Was on hold for a couple minutes, the gal gets back on the line and says, we're still looking for the 3rd package. Asked me to give them a couple more days.
It shipped on 10/11, landed locally on 10/22, I got 2 of the 3 packages on 11/9.
That's the 3nd time this year a freight company lost a sizable package. One lost a 4x6' casement window from the Mfg to the job site, another lost a crate of 22 panes of tempered glass for the deck railings at the same job, and now this.

Have an email conversation going with NT.

NT; I'm sorry about blah blah blah, can you provide the part numbers.

Me; Your asking for the part #'s for all of the missing parts?
I have no idea, I don't know every part that comes with it, I don't even having a parts list.

NT; Sends parts list

Me;

 

[JasenC]

I'll try to get some drawings up soon. The awning is in my head but I'll draw it up in Sketchup.

The laptop took a header recently and I haven't been able to find my DATA transfer cable to move everything to the new laptop. Made 2 stops on the way home tonight and neither store had any, Amazon to the rescue.

I also have to rework the roof design, 4 designs and a few partial redraws and I've never quite liked the roof lines. Saw something on Youtube last night that I had kind of had in my head awhile back, but once seeing a similar design I said, that looks awesome, I'm doing that.

 

[JasenC]

On this evenings episode of As The Trailer Turns.


NT

Hello,
Thank you for contacting us.
I am sorry to hear you are missing parts. We do not have all these parts in stock, as part numbers F,G, L,R, T, 7, 10, 11, 12, 15, 31, 19, 22, 25 are out of stock. Would you like to return this item for a refund. Or would you be able to find these parts locally with a discount?
Please let us know if you have any questions.
Regards,

Looked up cheapest comparable parts for the big items, full axle assemble, tires, fenders $500
That still leaves lights/wiring and various other nuts/bolts/washer, coupler etc.

So probably a bit more than they sell the trailer for.

And I've been futzing around for a couple hours now dealing with it.

Right now I have a full frame with the build plate/serial # and a receipt which gets me registered with WSP.

I owe the freight company another day, so I guess I have the weekend to think about it.

Tune in for the next episode of As The Trailer Turns to watch Jasen pull on his bread some more.

 

[JasenC]

Another e mail round with NT, which the didn't really read. I asked them to send me a new trailer kit and I'll send back what I have, they said they couldn't break up a kit.
I reiterated my request for a new trailer.

In the mean time...

Well into my roof redesign. Going from a flat roof to a coopered roof. Also moving the roof bump from the front to the rear and removing the angled back typical to a squaredrop.

Got my roof angles sorted out on the front corners, these correlate to the tongue build out.
The transition from the coopered roof spars to the flat at the triangles will have to work it's way of in situ, the spars have a gentle curve (1.5" in 3') so it won't be to difficult.
It might be a pie slice of the triangular roof sheeting or maybe add a little curve to that triangle panel to get a tight joint.
There are going to be a few situations I'll let the material guide me on how best to proceed.
Also fiddling with the galley layout. Sink on the left, stove top on the right, top load fridge, which is the main driver, in the center.

New drawing, it's easier to start fresh on this than trying to modify the old drawing, I usually end up wrestling some miss alignment that takes for ever to find and correct.

 

[celadon]

That is a super interesting design! I'm excited to see it take shape.

 

[JasenC]

...[Joke of the day: I'm shooting for a $3500 build.
That's what was negotiated with Mrs. Boss

* I started my build with the "promise" to keep it under $500, but knowing already that'd be nearly impossible, from reading the forums/lurking for a year or two before I started (first: Expedition Portal, which led me to TnTTT). Ostensibly, I was just making a safe and dry sleeping trailer for my wife's Bigfoot hunts with her girlfriends, but also had personal camping/exploring/travelling in mind for myself, as I was approaching retirement (I was 61).

With my current situation on the trailer, only having the frame, my back plan it to get a discount from NT, buy I smaller 5' wide trailer from HD, Lowes, TS or CL and use the parts I have to build it out to what I need.

 

[JasenC]

That is a super interesting design! I'm excited to see it take shape.

Thanks Celadon.

I've been watching youtube for months. teardrops, squaredrops, overlands, van conversions and schoolies gathering ideas.
Couple that with 30 years in home remodel and this is what you get for good or bad, haha.

 

[JasenC]

The latest on the trailer.
Talked to the freight yesterday. The guy I was talking to told me who ever I had talked to last week never initiated the lost freight search.

Called NT today and they said the exact same thing.

Both said 48hrs to do the search, so I guess that puts me out to Wednesday.
Which put it at 4 weeks since the frame parts I have landed at the local freight facility.

 

[working on it]

* I've bought many items at Northern Tool over the years, but have found out that ordering over their website, or doing business over the phone with them, is useless and inevitably a waste of time. Never turns out well, for me. I've had more success ordering unobtainable NT items from Amazon (for slightly more), and dealing with their customer support if shipment goes awry.

* It seems that my local NT stores seldom have what I want in stock, and/or the items aren't there if I actually drive to one to buy in person. It was much better 10-20 years back (practically everything retail was).

 

[JasenC]

I haven't been around much, okay almost not at all for awhile. The holidays, caught Covid 1st week of January despite all my precautions, that took me out at the knees for 2 weeks, no hospitalization though. Followed by nearly 2 months of headaches and fatigue that had a healthy active 58yo huffing and puffing before the top of 1 flight of stairs.
My company van full of tools got stolen out of my driveway last month, PD still hasn't found anything thing, had to tool up another van. The company is out a 2014 E250 and nearly $6k in tools, I'm out $2k in hand tools which the Ins is picking up and the company said they will pick up any slack left from the Ins. Wasn't happy about getting a Sprinter tall boy as a replacement to the Ford, the Spinters 4' longer and a foot taller but it definitely drivers better and is more comfortable to drive.
Took a bad step 3 weeks back twisted my foot and fell hard on my tail bone, but yeah I'm back up and operating at about 93% efficiency so happy days.

The freight company found the rest of my trailer literally as I was working on returning it, oh wait, no they found the wheels, fenders, hitch coupler, lights and hardware but not the axle.
Took delivery in January as I was knocking on deaths door with Covid. NT was to get in more axles mid Jan but that didn't happen and then they were to be coming in mid March and what did I find when I got home Wednesday, FedEx dropped off my axle. Glad that fiasco is over, NT's CS pretty much sucks these days although I don't know if it was ever good or bad, never delt with them before as I've never had any issues with them over the years aside from a simple return or two.


Now the garage got destroyed during the holidays, covid, work, scavenging trailer materials etc. I've started working on cleaning up that but now that my winter project has moved into spring I may just pull the Jeep a little farther into the side yard and build out there. I can tarp off between the house and fence if I need too now that there shouldn't be anymore wind storms until Autumn.

Also think I scored enough free steel for my frame extension from 5x8 to 6x10, our company truck driver found a piece he is saving for me down at the shop plus I got my hands on an old 52" Biesemeyer style table saw fence guide rail tube.

Missed a sale at Harbor freight on their 110v Titanium series MIG welder, my Miller Cricket wire feed is older then dirt and it gave up the ghost last year when I was trying to put a new muffler on the truck. I can't get parts for it anymore, it doesn't take gas and I'm tired of messy flux core wire. A bolted up frame doesn't sit well with me on something like this.

Don't think I'll get much done this week, the kids are dropping off the grandson today for a week while my son has a routine surgery.

 

[rjgimp]

Yeah, that co-vid thing... I just now saw this thread for the first time as when you first posted I was huffing and puffing and two days later I was in a coma and on a ventilator for the next 29 days. Finally got discharged Jan 7th. Good times, baby. Good times.

NT sure isn't what they used to be and even that wasn't worth writing home about.

 

[JasenC]

Wow RJ glad you got through it hopefully with no long term issues.

 

[JasenC]

In the in-between time of the trailer parts wondering their way to my place via the scenic route over the past 5 months, I've scavenged up some materials.
Plenty of nice straight spruce/pine/fir (whitewood) 2x4's from Dunn lbr.
The company truckdriver/tool pen mngr. texted me the other day, said he ran across some steel down at the shop they were going to scrap that I might want.
3 pcs totaling 41' of 1/4x3x1.5" channel, worth about $400 right now around here.
I do have a little wire wheel work ahead of me, but it's all surface rust, no scaling.

Seeing I'm building a 6x10 on a 5x8 NT trailer, I'm now thinking of replacing the A frame and front and rear cross bars with this.
Or if the 3 lengths work with minimal waste I may buy enough steel to build the full perimeter and A frame. But I have to watch the budget,
I'm not making any sacrifices elsewhere, this is already an upgrade and we're only doing camp ground camping.
I wanted a semi tough rear bumper anyway, and the front, well as you know, it will just be all the stronger and more stable for towing.

 

[JasenC]

Got the bed frame sorted out.
I'm going with a convertible sofa arrangement, but haven't been happy with anything I had designed up to this point from an ease of use point seeing there's not a lot of elbow room inside the camper.
Was scouring the interwebnet today for some inspiration when I ran across the Tokyo tri fold futon frame. This was actually designed by William Bouwer a woodworking back in the 70's, so technically it's a Bouwer bed, who actually invented the modern folding futon frame. I couldn't find any detail on it other than a couple pictures and a video from the futon shop where I discovered it and one little thing on Pinterest.
I'll have to build a mock up to fine tune the dimensions, it's a bit of guess work at this point.

Youtube link shows how simply slick it is.

 

[JasenC]

Getting close to starting.
Prices on lumber has dropped a bit, going to see if the lumber yard I typically use for work will give me the companies jobber price on sheet goods, I already scavenged plenty of 2x materials off a few of my job sites, scored a bunch of scrap cabinet plywood for the gally etc. from my buddy the runs the cabinet shop.

I spent 7-8 hrs this weekend organizing the garage, I now have 11' 9" W, that was the challenge, and 17' D of floor space. My table saw, band saw and jointer are on wheels so I can shift them around off the side wall or even push them outside if/when I need a little more elbow room plus I can always haul the camper into the side yard where I can put up a poly tarp between the rafter tails and fence.

Going to rip most all my 2x4 studs in half for walls/floor and band saw my curved roof spars before I put the trailer together. Figure I'll run all my 2x's through the planer so they are all a tad thicker than the ridged foam (room for construction adhesive) to make sure my wall laminations go smoothly.

 

[JasenC]

Hear ye hear ye,
On the 1st day of the 6th month in the year of our lord 2022 The build has begun.

I've been designing off the specs EZ posted on the NT trailer, which are spot on, Thanks EZ.
Today I put the frame box together so I could lay out the new location of the axle and frame cross bars as I am extending it by 2'. It's sitting at 20 3/4" off the floor on the jack stands, which is 3/4" high per EZ's specs.
I'm going 65/35 on the axle location, the trailer uses 2 C channel cross bars at the axle, I'm replacing those with 1 pieces of the 3" 1/4 wall channel iron I scored at work. Once I get it all bolted up I'm going to break out the welder and go at it then pull all the bolts. Despite NT includes nylock nuts, I'll feel better not thinking about a bolt working loose in the future, besides it'll just make the frame all the more rigid.
I also scored, from work, an old 2"x3"x 84" table saw fence guide rail to use as a rear bumper and seeing I now have an extra cross bar from the OE axle location, I will use that to extend the side frame rails to 10' and hang my bumper off of those.
Also mocked up the spare tire location. I plan(ed) to use a GM spare tire cable hoist but I don't have the top clearance, but if I relocate the hoist back behind the front frame rail, mount it horizontal and use a pulley to get the cable where I want it, I think it'll still work, this will leave 12" clearance from tire to the ground. There will be a triangular tongue box taking up most of the tongue, the propane tank, diesel heater and 160W solar panels will go in there plus some extra storage. I'm still undecided about putting in some 6-8" deep in floor storage bins in the first frame bay. I could cut those in easy enough at a later date if I choose, I'll at least plan for that in my floor framing. My concern is the camper will overhang the side rails by 8" on either side so cutting out structural framing might leave me a weak spot at the door.
The Sketchup drawing also shows my fresh/gray water tank (16/10 gal) locations. I placed the fresh water tank on the right side as my mechanical closet is at the left rear corner where I'll have the battery, on demand W/H, Inverter, converter, power management etc. this should pretty well balance those two locations out.
It's a bit tight in my garage but about 4' of the width is being taken up by my scavenged materials.

As far as NT's build instructions go, they pretty much suck just like everyone says. I laid everything out oriented per the picture, those holes go on the bottom, those holes go up front... When I went to attach the tongue bars, yeah the cross bar was upside down, and would it be to much to ask to put the 16 1.25" bolts in a different bag than the roughly 40 1" bolts and nuts.