Offroad trailer suspension

[drewh1]

Here are 3 photos all showing pretty much the same view; the inside of the drivers side trailer wheel. The important differences are that the first photo is with leaf springs, then second with the Timbren axle-less suspension with Straight spindle, and the 3rd photo is the same Timbren except with the 4" lift spindle.

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Dave - just wanted to thank you for these posts. I ordered the Timbren with the 4" lift after reading your post. I haven't mounted the wheels yet (waiting on hubs) but it looks like I will have plenty of ground clearance when done.

 

[Dave Nathanson]

Dave - just wanted to thank you for these posts. I ordered the Timbren with the 4" lift after reading your post. I haven't mounted the wheels yet (waiting on hubs) but it looks like I will have plenty of ground clearance when done.

Right on. Let us know how it goes for you. I had a hard time getting the right info, but together, we can get it all figured out for the next guy!

 

[drewh1]

well it is not a great photo but this is it - 18" of ground clearance, I had to turn over the trailer hitch to raise it up and replace my wheel/jack as it was no longer long enough. So even with the 14" wheels and tires, I still have more clearance than the FJ.

I only drove it around the neighborhood but noticed it felt very solid and did not rattle over bumps at all. Can't wait to try it off-road this spring in Oregon.

 

[drewh1]

I really enjoyed this tread lots of good info. I am happy with my leaf springs and gas shocks since I am a mild off roader in the local wind river moutains here in Wyoming. but it might be a good option choice for a four wheeler trailer. you can get way more off road with them to dump atvs for trips in to the woods. I think from your photos you need a good trailer frame which I don't have and I think its over kill for my travels but I like the idea a lot big time. I got a new kampmaster I am building with a better frame than the harbor freight one on my old tear. its a thought idea for the future. I like it. slow

Well the gas shocks have to be a big help. As far as the actual trailer goes, I imagine I will be doing some welding on mine as time goes by. It is definitely not beefy enough for constant heavy off-roading but so far it is holding up. Nice thing about metal is you can always weld more on to it

BTW, that is a beautiful spot you travel in, Love Wyoming and always wanted to have that license plate on my trailer.

 

[wavebreaker]

Noticed not been posted in for a bit but I thought I would add my views.
I have built 9 off-road trailers 8 that are in use and one still under construction. 5 of these are teardrops.
I have used timbren/torsion/springs and airbags.

Was the first in north America to use a timbren suspension system on a off-road trailer. dealt with the engineers at timbren to make the first 1500# with 3000# spindles for brakes. The system worked fine for several years then the primary bushing on the main pivot failed , it was a major failing the tires at the top tilted into the trailer while I was traveling down a dusty road (did not notice smoke)if not for an obstacle I would not have stopped till after trailer was in flames. Tires had heated up to the point of burning thru side of trail and melting carpet and mattress inside of trailer.it is imperative that the front bushing be lubed regularly. On mine there was no grease fitting they now come stock with one. they also line bore the bushing after installing into the arm rather than using one pre drilled. The force applied to that bushing goes up with the larger sized tires. its a constant twist on that bushing.
Now all that being said I called timbren after the failure to find out how to fix it and they ended up selling me a new pair at cost They stand behind their product and are awesome people to deal with.

The fellow that has that particular tear has put many miles on it with no further issues but he keeps it well lubed.

As for leaf springs I find a few things to them I don't like. They bounce way to much it adds a lot of stress overall to the trailer. Off-camber situations can get truly hairy with springs a bad bounce and it can lead to a flop. wash board roads those springs at speed cant keep up the trailer looks like a jumping jack. The axle on 30 inch tires you only get 14-15 inches of clearance not a lot (trust me I have got stuck on tree stumps. But again it is only my opinion.

Torflex axles I have used once was not for me was for another person they seem after several years to have no issues. Thought the trailer has never really seen any hard off-road and maybe has 10,000 miles on it total.

Leads me to my final system trailing arm airbags. The tear I am building now is the third I have done this way. I design the trailer so as to have nothing under body at all the trailing arms are it.
on airbags at full rise I have 22 inches of clearance on 31 inch tires. I can adjust this from 18 to 22. the system works well the trailer hardly bounces on washboard roads and stays solid in off-camber situations. I have an onboard air compressor to keep bags inflated. I air up and down for parking and road conditions. highway hard off-road a little softer and when parking I drop to bump stops for steadying.

trying to remember how to add photos will add later.

 

[Lucky J]

Noticed not been posted in for a bit but I thought I would add my views.
I have built 9 off-road trailers 8 that are in use and one still under construction. 5 of these are teardrops.
I have used timbren/torsion/springs and airbags.

Was the first in north America to use a timbren suspension system on a off-road trailer. dealt with the engineers at timbren to make the first 1500# with 3000# spindles for brakes. The system worked fine for several years then the primary bushing on the main pivot failed , it was a major failing the tires at the top tilted into the trailer while I was traveling down a dusty road (did not notice smoke)if not for an obstacle I would not have stopped till after trailer was in flames. Tires had heated up to the point of burning thru side of trail and melting carpet and mattress inside of trailer.it is imperative that the front bushing be lubed regularly. On mine there was no grease fitting they now come stock with one. they also line bore the bushing after installing into the arm rather than using one pre drilled. The force applied to that bushing goes up with the larger sized tires. its a constant twist on that bushing.
Now all that being said I called timbren after the failure to find out how to fix it and they ended up selling me a new pair at cost They stand behind their product and are awesome people to deal with.

The fellow that has that particular tear has put many miles on it with no further issues but he keeps it well lubed.

As for leaf springs I find a few things to them I don't like. They bounce way to much it adds a lot of stress overall to the trailer. Off-camber situations can get truly hairy with springs a bad bounce and it can lead to a flop. wash board roads those springs at speed cant keep up the trailer looks like a jumping jack. The axle on 30 inch tires you only get 14-15 inches of clearance not a lot (trust me I have got stuck on tree stumps. But again it is only my opinion.

Torflex axles I have used once was not for me was for another person they seem after several years to have no issues. Thought the trailer has never really seen any hard off-road and maybe has 10,000 miles on it total.

Leads me to my final system trailing arm airbags. The tear I am building now is the third I have done this way. I design the trailer so as to have nothing under body at all the trailing arms are it.
on airbags at full rise I have 22 inches of clearance on 31 inch tires. I can adjust this from 18 to 22. the system works well the trailer hardly bounces on washboard roads and stays solid in off-camber situations. I have an onboard air compressor to keep bags inflated. I air up and down for parking and road conditions. highway hard off-road a little softer and when parking I drop to bump stops for steadying.

trying to remember how to add photos will add later.

Wave braker, thank you for all that info.

I have about the same views that you have with the different types of suspension.

But I do not have experience with air bags and trailing arms. My main questions is what to use as pivot points. I know some use bushing, and others use rod end, and johny joints. The only worries I have with bushing, is them wearring out, and loosing alignment. What did you use so far, and how did it held up?
'Thank you

 

[Tony Latham]

I've read the rumors of the Torflex that failed. My suspision is that the guy welded the axle to the chassis instead of welding on the brackets. I've seen that method done on forums. Dexter advises against it. It can cook the internal rubber pieces.

The new U.S. Army trailers are being axled with Dexter Torflexs. Don't discount them.

Having said that, on 'drop #4–– if it happens–– I might pony up for Timbrens.

Tony

 

[Lucky J]

I am not going to pull my 3500 pds dexter from under my utility/off road trailer, I can leav with the 3500 capacity and It is never close to capacity in overlandind (when I am far from populated area and only loaded to capacity when I am close (firewood and other duty). But it is to bouncy to carry light capimg and xpedition gear on washbord and rough dirt road.

Same with the 2200 dexter from the TD, can not leave anything like eggs, and other soft food that need to be cool in the galley fridge, it will all be lost.

The dexter from that TD will be reused for a light utility/motorcycle/atv transporter.

 

[working on it]

I am not going to pull my 3500 pds dexter from under my utility/off road trailer, I can leav with the 3500 capacity and It is never close to capacity in overlandind (when I am far from populated area and only loaded to capacity when I am close (firewood and other duty). But it is to bouncy to carry light capimg and xpedition gear on washbord and rough dirt road.

Same with the 2200 dexter from the TD, can not leave anything like eggs, and other soft food that need to be cool in the galley fridge, it will all be lost.

The dexter from that TD will be reused for a light utility/motorcycle/atv transporter.

• I don't agree that a leaf spring axle is too "bouncy" to ride right, and that only Timbren axles, or torsion axles are the way to go. I like, trust, and have easily repaired leaf spring axles, before, and wouldn't write them off to history, as being out-dated or incapable for light or heavy use. with a little planning or modifications, you can tailor leaf springs for any road condition.
• As I stated before, earlier in this thread and in others, I stayed with leaves on my last trailer mod/upgrade, when replacing my original axle and springs (overloaded spindly axle of unknown capacity) with a Dexter 3500 lb axle w/brakes. I replaced the original equipment with off-the-shelf springs from Northern Tool. I bought the 3000 lb (a pair, sold individually) springs, because I knew I was loading my trailer heavier with each trip, and modification, and was pretty sure it would weigh more than 2000 lbs eventually. I would've preferred a 2500 lb rating, but they didn't offer a rating in between 2-3k lbs in the size/type I was using, I got the 3000 lb set which has worked pretty well, so far.
• 
• Since my previous spring set had a shackle tear loose from the frame. I reinforced the frame rails with 1/4" angle, boxing in/ covering over the trailer frame, I opted for all new hardware. New leaf springs and all the associated hardware are easy to come by in North Texas, and I chose to stay with leaf springs due to ready availability everywhere, and standardization of the hardware making repairs easy to do. I previously had another trailer spring problem, on my tandem trailer, which I had grossly over-loaded with engine blocks and heads, breaking one spring when it over-flexed (used a ratchet strap, 5000 lb rating, to secure the broken end). I replaced it in a parking lot near the Redneck Trailer Supply that I passed on my way home, where I got a replacement spring. Later on, I replaced much more hardware, worn and rusted out, on that trailer in 2007, when I replaced both axles with new Rockwell-American axles (each 3500 lb w/brakes), at a friend's shop near Azle, where there is another ready source for spring axle parts.
• I added an oversized, progressive, bumpstop (modified to fit between axle and frame, with no gap), to serve as a means to soften hard jolts, and prevent the springs from over-flexing (which tore loose the shackle on my TTT, and broke the spring on my tandem trailer). I tried it as an experiment, in lieu of using shock absorbers, or air bags, or Timbren airless springs. Since I made my own "active airless suspension", I see that Timbren makes their own version, which wasn't made back in 2014, when I made mine.
• 
  vs homemade, earlier version
• 
• It works very well, proving itself when it protected my springs from breakage, when my trailer flew after hitting a major pothole at 75 mph (so bad that it caused belt separation in three of my truck tires, 10 ply, on my Chevy 2500 HD). I haven't taken it off-road yet, but I think it will serve well there, too, and if too harsh, then I can adjust the bumpstop by cutting the center ligament, and make it more compliant. IMHO, leaf springs are more easily repairable/cost effective/modifiable than the alternatives.

 

[Lucky J]

• 
  
  
  I don't agree that a leaf spring axle is too "bouncy" to ride right, and that only Timbren axles, or torsion axles are the way to go. I like, trust, and have easily repaired leaf spring axles, before, and wouldn't write them off to history, as being out-dated .......

• 
  
  I think that we mis understood each other. I am not counting out spring leave suspension either. The 3500 pds dexter axle I have on my utility/off road trailer is flex ride /torflex type. And what I do not like about it, is that it is to stif for camping duty, (light load) and perfect for utility duty (heavier load). But I like the fact that it is a heavy duty axel set-up. When I ordered it to replace my weak 1500 pds leaf spring axle that was on it, I was thinking about the 3500 pds hubs and spindle, but forgot about the fact that the spring load would most of the time be to much.
  
  Now, If I would go with srping leaf, I would have the same problem with that trailer, cause my load is way to different for the different use I make out of it. But I do have a spare spindle and radius arm with a fully built hub with me all the time for out off bound travel. I hated to be stuck for speciality broken parts.
  
  But even with the now new to us teardrop, my plan is to build a real off road expedition trailer from my old jeep YJ tub with a RTT. That one would be built with long travel leaf spring with purpose built load and 3500 pds hubs.
  
  But the TD, I want the softer ride possible and a load range that can adapted according to the type of road I travel. Only air ride can do thise rapidly.
  
  Now, back to my original question, I still want to know what was used as joint for the Trailing arms of that air suspension, and if it is still working fine.

 

[VORSHEER Trailers]

I would stick with Timbren independent suspension for off-road.

The ground clearance you will achieve with Timbren will surpass your truck or SUV. So if you drive over it, you know your trailer will too. No worries about hitting the bottom of your trailer.

If you really want to build an off-road trailer then Timbren will probably be the suspension you're using: https://timbren.com/axle-less-product-finder/

 

[ArkansasDon]

it all comes down to how far back in the back country you want to go. I pondered on axleless axles on my 1st build end up with a leaf spring & straight axle w\shock set up (24" of chassis clearance & 14" of axle to ground clearance). That trailer took me & the wife to all of our offroad destinations whether in fair trails to rough washed out trails. (3rd photo)
My current trailer modification build, I put the same type suspension system on a new 2019 Runaway Range Runner (2nd photo): I removed the original trailer suspension & hangers & kept the 3500lb Dexter Axle. I install heavier spring hangers, 31" leaf springs, Dexter Axle Flip Kit, shock & mounts. The ground clearance I gain was the same on my 1st trailer build, 24" classis clearance, 14" of axle to ground clearance. We've taking this squaredrop 30 miles back in off the main National Forest Dirt Roads in pretty rough terrain, approach is important, we crawled over exposed rock, used our recovery boards for bridging, dealt with off camber roads w\turns, creek crossings with eroded banks never had any issues getting to our destination. Known your vehicles & trailers limitations (I didn't build a belly dragger),good offroad coupler & hitch, recovery gear on board & plain ol' common sense works.

I drive a full size 2000 GMC Z71 with some suspension add-on's (Rancho), stock 5.3 motor w\performance built transmission 12,000lb winch w\75ft of 3\8" Master Pull synthetic winch line, recovery gear under the rear seat, on board air compressor & recovery traction boards.

It all comes down to what "you" want as of offroad suspension & feel is best for your situation.