Shocks?

[dangerranger]

I notice that most here don't put shocks on their trailer. Is it just added weight? a waste of time? I'm drawing up a custom frame for a 10 ft Wanderer and would shocks be a good thing to have? Or just extra weight and time that gains very little? Thanks Eric

 

[Sparksalot]

You can blame the kit trailer heritage from much of that. I've contemplated adding them more than once. With mine, I'd opt for brakes instead, for those trips into the Rockies and such.

If you're building your own frame, add the shocks, there's effectively no penalty to do it at this point.

 

[dangerranger]

Thanks! I have another question. The completed Wanderer shouldn't weigh over 1500 lbs dry. I have some 2x2" steel tubing in the right lengths that is 14 gauge thickness. The wanderer was designed to sit on a Harbor Freight frame and hang over. I'm building the front and rear cross members to extend out to the walls and be under the front and rear walls. Do you think that will be too light for frame rails? I may also extend a support arm out under the door area. I don't believe it will be any heavier than the Harbor Freight frame But will it be too light? The tongue and supports will be a heavier wall material. Thanks Eric

 

[Squigie]

Shocks are good.
If you can incorporate them, you won't be disappointed.

The only reasons my build will not be using shocks are:
1. I'm using Timbren suspension. The design is fairly shock-absorbing to begin with.
2. I'm using Timbren suspension. Adding shock mounts is more trouble than its worth.

But for any leaf spring suspension (and maybe even torsion axles), you can bet your butt that I'd be adding shocks. Trailer bounce is one of my oldest enemies. I must strike him down at every opportunity.

 

[Sparksalot]

Thanks! I have another question. The completed Wanderer shouldn't weigh over 1500 lbs dry. I have some 2x2" steel tubing in the right lengths that is 14 gauge thickness. The wanderer was designed to sit on a Harbor Freight frame and hang over. I'm building the front and rear cross members to extend out to the walls and be under the front and rear walls. Do you think that will be too light for frame rails? I may also extend a support arm out under the door area. I don't believe it will be any heavier than the Harbor Freight frame But will it be too light? The tongue and supports will be a heavier wall material. Thanks Eric

That's a whole 'nother thing altogether. You can probably get more input with a separate thread on the topic, plus having a sketch or two for illustration.

 

[Tony Latham]

I notice that most here don't put shocks on their trailer. Is it just added weight? a waste of time? I'm drawing up a custom frame for a 10 ft Wanderer and would shocks be a good thing to have? Or just extra weight and time that gains very little? Thanks Eric

I don’t install shocks because torsion axles don’t need them.

Tony


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[coyote-TNT]

My teardrop has them (Tractor trailer cab shocks) and I did not put them on the Scotty I rebuilt. I notice zero difference. And it is leaf spring under both, not torsion. I'm no pro, just my experience. Coyote

 

[olddawgsrule]

I don’t install shocks because torsion axles don’t need them.
Tony

I tend to agree. Proper frame and suspension not much need.. I do see bump stops though. I wouldn't want the torsion to bottom out or the axle to wack the frame. Now with leaf spring I might debate the want (not need) for. One major plus for torsion is the axle-less system. I like the idea behind it, just not certain there's enough in there to do the deed as we wish it to do.. Something 'I' need to look at deeper.

My intent is something a little more Overlander Style where a side is going to carry a lot of weight at times. I don't do Rock Crawling to say, yet there are times I need to. I'm looking at clearance (axle-less) and what these torsion units could do (with a bump stop in mind). I've looked at Sumo's and not so sure required for my needs/wants.

I guess the question surrounds how to reduce the earthquake we cause while towing our units around. I don't see shock absorbers as doing the trick. to some point yes, yet truly how much? You're still going to wrap you breakables, and nothing you left on the counter will still be there (in place).

Just MHO..

 

[Tony Latham]

I wouldn't want the torsion to bottom out or the axle to wack the frame.

I don't know how you'd put a bump-stop on a torsion axle. They can't hit the frame since the swing arm is outside the frame.

Tony

 

[Squigie]

I think a bump stop for a torsion axle would require an arm mounted to the frame, extending out to where it would stop the arm from over-traveling.

Although I'd like to say it seems like overkill, I must say that I wish my current tent trailer had them.
It is on its third axle since new. (Lots of receipts, invoices, and service records with owners manual. )

The original axle failed in 1998 (6 years old). Don't know how, but the right side failed and dropped the frame onto the tire.

The replacement axle failed in 2003 (5 years old). Do know a bit about that one, and the right side failed and dropped the frame onto the tire.

Nope. Didn't accidentally repeat myself there. It suffered the same breakage twice.
I suspect that both previous owners habitually overloaded the trailer (only 250 lbs of payload to work with, including water, propane, and battery - and its heavily biased to one side).

If there had been a bump stop, there wouldn't have been a blow-out at 65 mph, when the frame (technically the step mount bolts) tore the tire to pieces just moments after the torsion suspension failed.


Then again, I wouldn't own that trailer if it hadn't been available for $1,200, because it had a busted up inner fender and the cabinet over the fender, a floor ripped to bits, and tire residue all over the floor. Without the damage, it was easily worth $4,500 more.
Call it a draw...?

It does worry me, though. The right side of the trailer is sagging about 1.5" lower now than when I bought it (~5 years ago), even though it's loaded with less gear.

 

[olddawgsrule]

I wouldn't want the torsion to bottom out or the axle to wack the frame.

I don't know how you'd put a bump-stop on a torsion axle. They can't hit the frame since the swing arm is outside the frame.

Tony

It would require a outrigger of sorts, yet could be done. I see it as one of the cons of torsion that can be changed, with a clever mind that is.

 

[Tony Latham]

I see it as one of the cons of torsion that can be changed...

They kinda have their own internal stop. The military went with Dexter Torflex on all of their utility trailers. No bump stops.

But weld one up. Maybe you're on to something.

T

 

[olddawgsrule]

I see it as one of the cons of torsion that can be changed...

They kinda have their own internal stop. The military went with Dexter Torflex on all of their utility trailers. No bump stops.

But weld one up. Maybe you're on to something.

T

Tony, talk some more about torsion, please. My thoughts are there is a stop (of sorts) built in. Yet I don't know for certain.
If there's not, then it seems you'd be over twisting (torquing) the bands to the extent of damage. Most Overlander's I read about use spring suspension with a stop. I really like the axle-less torsion system for the clearance it allows. I'm researching a suspension for my Ultimate Build.

"The military went with Dexter Torflex on all of their utility trailers."
That's interesting!

 

[Tony Latham]

I see it as one of the cons of torsion that can be changed...

They kinda have their own internal stop. The military went with Dexter Torflex on all of their utility trailers. No bump stops.

But weld one up. Maybe you're on to something.

T

Tony, talk some more about torsion, please. My thoughts are there is a stop (of sorts) built in. Yet I don't know for certain.
If there's not, then it seems you'd be over twisting (torquing) the bands to the extent of damage. Most Overlander's I read about use spring suspension with a stop. I really like the axle-less torsion system for the clearance it allows. I'm researching a suspension for my Ultimate Build.

"The military went with Dexter Torflex on all of their utility trailers."
That's interesting!

I think you are chasing a problem that doesn’t exist. Somewhere on Dexter’s site it shows the up and down travel distance of their Torflex axles.

T

 

[Tony Latham]

 

[olddawgsrule]

I think you are chasing a problem that doesn’t exist. Somewhere on Dexter’s site it shows the up and down travel distance of their Torflex axles.

T

Did some serious research this morning (slow morning) and it looks like you're right (again). I chasing an issue that doesn't exist.. My mind always looked at the cords and thought while rock crawling (all weight on a tire) the center tube could roll past the cords leaving you with one heck of a situation. Everything I read so far shows that as next to impossible (or taking so much more effort).

Thank you for your patience and assistance.

 

[ArkansasDon]

I changed out leaf springs & added shocks, the shock absorbers make for a softer more controlled ride, slowing axle articulation down keep the tires planted to the ground longer. My trailer tows nicely on hwy & rough off road use. The wife & I do a lot of dispersed camping 95% were 5% is spent win public RV grounds with our son & his family.
I removed the original stock factory leaf springs & hangers, kept the 3500 Dexter Axle. I added long 31" leaf springs & hangers. Theirs many advantages by adding longer leaf springs to the trailer: the trailer can't react as quickly to a bumps, it spreads the load more out evenly from the axle.

 

[working on it]

* While researching all about trailer axles prior to replacing the "too-small" weight-capacity axle on my TTT, back in 2014, I tried to discover if torsion axles had an internal "stop" to prevent over-flexing and possible damage to fender, frame, and especially the rubber rods inside the axle tube. Only on the Inland RV/Airstream site did I find any reference to "stops" in any torsion-axle website. https://inlandrv.com/dura-torque-axle-article/

* I had envisioned some off-road travel for my trailer, sometime in the future, so I wanted over-travel of the wheels to be compensated-for, or eliminated, due to past experience with really bad roads/trailer interaction. Since I couldn't find any reference to other torsion axle manufacturers' over-travel prevention measures (and the expense of making my own, if not found), I opted to use a leaf-spring axle instead, with a type of over-travel-prevention device that I'd used on several vehicles over the years, cushioning bumpstops (various durometer rubber types, and construction types had been used).

* The axle I chose had to be about 3500 lbs rated, with brakes installed, and at that time I found the spring-type to be about $150 less than torsion, and $250 less than the equivalent Timbren axle-less axle. I already preferred the leaf spring axle for easier parts sourcing and ready availability, so that was what I went with. For around what a torsion axle alone would've cost me, I was able to install all-new axle/springs/hardware + my homemade shock absorbing active bumpstop + the welding machine I made it with (with additional steel frame reinforcements, too). An equivalent Timbren set-up would've been double that???

* The benefit of making my own suspension from individual components is that I could easily (and cheaply) replace any if it failed to function as I wished. The springs are standard double-eye 25.25" size, and come in available weight-ratings from 1500-7000 lbs per pair (I bought 3000 lb per pair, since I knew I'd need nearly that capacity, eventually), and cost $50 per pair, then. The key to making them work correctly (no sag or no bounce, either) on the road, was by tailoring the Daystar progressive bumpstops to precisely fit between axle and frame, with adaptive cushioning since they are hollowed-out. If they needed to have more "give", then I could sever an inner tension for that, as is, they work well, and haven't needed any alteration.

*

 

[ntsqd]

Typical short trailer springs are designed to maintain ride height with varying loadings. As such they don't move much and without a large range of motion a shock absorber is not going to do much. Move to a more supple spring and now it will move more and need the damping a shock absorber provides.

My take on the Torflex and shocks is that probably don't need them for mostly pavement & low speed off pavement use, but if you're going down Saline Valley Rd or Baja roads at any speed at all then shocks are a must for these axles. I would suggest that Timbrens can benefit as well. A spring is a spring whether made from metal or an elastomer and elastomeric spring won't also function as a damper.

 

[lfhoward]

My trailer has shocks because the military used them with the leaf springs on the M101 & M116 series trailers. So glad they’re there, because I get no bounce when I hit bumps.