What are ya'll using for heat?

[Squigie]

Though my teardrop plans are fairly simple and spartan, I'm seriously considering a furnace.

I doubt that I need to justify my reasoning here. But...
I tend to do a lot of late-year camping (a.k.a., hunting trips) at high altitude and in nasty weather. Having a furnace to take the 'bite' out of the night can do a lot for morale. It can also be the difference between misery and satisfaction, by drying boots and wet clothing.
And, of course, it helps mitigate any condensation.

I cannot, however, find much information on what people are actually using for heat, except for a few mentions of Mr. Heater type ceramic element heaters and a few electric space heaters.
I can't go electric. I'm not willing to haul enough batteries for that to be viable, I never take a generator with me, and I don't plan to go solar yet (I'm planning for the option and making space for the gear, but the trailer will be in use long before I commit to solar).
The Mr. Heater products are not an option, as those that I've been around tend to quickly auto-shutoff (if they light in the first place) at 9,000+ feet, due to their carbon monoxide safety system (an O2 sensor).

I've seen a few people also using convection heaters. I very much like the simplicity and heat from convection units (I've used them before), but they sure do GULP the propane. Both of my convection heaters in pop-up tent trailers drank about 15 lbs per night, when set at minimum (~45 F) with the outside temp between 0 F and 20 F. Since my average trip is about seven days - and I almost never return to civilization until I'm done - that's completely non-viable (even in the smaller, better-insulated teardrop). I'd have to carry TEN 20-lb propane tanks. (I prefer 20s. They're easier to handle.)

I've been looking for small 'forced air' units and basic non-ducted furnaces; but I'm not seeing much that interests me or seems to be the right fit.

So, what are people using?
Tent trailer furnaces?
Portable propane heaters?
A dozen cats trapped in a sleeping bag?

 

[Tony Latham]

I'm installing this Propex heater in my new build.

That second pic is from my test run. It put's out 180º degree heat. They're miserly. And expensive.

Westy Ventures is the U.S. retailer.

Tony

P.S. there is some interest in the teardrop world with cheap Chinese diesel heaters: https://www.ebay.com/itm/5KW-5000W-...838979&hash=item4d80cc0232:g:HPgAAOSwDcJcf1aG

 

[KTM_Guy]

We have the same Propex heater as Tony. So far we only had one morning to give it a try to take the chill off. The low was 40 degrees so not cold and it ran for about 4 minutes. My wife loved it. We have camped in out teardrop to 25 degrees and didn't need a heater but it would have been nice for morning. We just use normal bedding, sheet, blanket and comforter. We'll be camping year round so it will be handy, next month we plan to camp up in the 10,000' range and I'm sure it will get used then.

Todd

 

[pinstriper]

The Mr. Heater is a catalytic heater and does not produce CO. There is however a risk of it consuming all the O2 in a confined space, hence the sensor and shutoff. I solve this by cracking the roof vent but you lose a lot of heat of course.

But as you say, 9,000’ is its own challenge and I have only tackled 4500’ with my setup.

I would say your cheapest solution, and easiest to implement, would be to reconsider your plan regarding a generator. 2kw should do it. I know my 900w did not handle the startup of a 600w ceramic, and the 200w heater was insufficient at -2F

The other advantage of this scheme is that there is no build required, so you can implement something else later and nothing to undo.



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[Squigie]

Thank you all for the feedback. I'll keep checking back to see what else comes up.

The Mr. Heater is a catalytic heater and does not produce CO. There is however a risk of it consuming all the O2 in a confined space, hence the sensor and shutoff. I solve this by cracking the roof vent but you lose a lot of heat of course.

But as you say, 9,000’ is its own challenge and I have only tackled 4500’ with my setup.

I would say your cheapest solution, and easiest to implement, would be to reconsider your plan regarding a generator. 2kw should do it. I know my 900w did not handle the startup of a 600w ceramic, and the 200w heater was insufficient at -2F

The other advantage of this scheme is that there is no build required, so you can implement something else later and nothing to undo.

Catalytic heaters, in theory, do no produce CO. But in the real world, no reaction is ever perfect and chemical reactions are more complex than basic equations (or something is contaminated).
That very premise was tested in 2003, for example, by the CPSC. CO EMISSIONS FROM A PORTABLE PROPANE CATALYTIC HEATER
They found elevated CO levels to be a byproduct of incomplete catalyzation.
Either way, yes, I mentioned CO/O2 incorrectly. Thanks for the correction.

I appreciate the suggestion for electric, but I'm not going to haul a generator around.
It's more space taken up. More weight. More fuel. More maintenance.
And I absolutely despise the noise of a generator - no matter how 'quiet' - when I'm away from civilization. ...And that's during the day. My opinion of running a generator at night is not appropriate for a family forum.

 

[pinstriper]

Cracking ng the vent also solves the CO problem if there is one.

If propane won’t fire, and a generator is out - for valid reasons IMO - you are down to carrying a lot more batteries so you can drive a dc heater, or finding some sort of wood stove that you can duct heat into your trailer.


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[KTM_Guy]

There are the gasoline and diesel truck cab heaters. But they have problems at elevation and have problem with soot build up. But they work great great till they don’t. And that is usually when you need it most. I looked at them but didn’t want to carry smelly diesel fuel or kerosene. If the TV was diesel I might have gone that way.

Todd

 

[Squigie]

Also not a fan. No diesel for this guy.

I'm not too worried about additional batteries, either. My last two 12v furnaces (including the one currently in the tent trailer) have been able to run a minimum of 4 days on a charge (usually 5) with my only deep-cycle battery, with my wife setting the thermostat at 60-65 F (!! !!).
If set more appropriately and paired with my solar "battery tender", I can go 10+ days without issue. If I absolutely had to, I could use a charging adapter to top off the deep-cycle with my truck, to go until the propane runs out.

 

[NotJammer]

1990's I had Propex in a Westy, it fits in a very small space. Works fine.

1969 an old man died in the next van from a Coleman Catalytic. His dog and kid got out.

Installing the smallest propane Atwood forced air now.

If I had a Diesel truck I would use a Diesel cab heater.

But I don't and don't want modern Diesel anything.

Those super tiny wood burning boxes are interesting, if you have wood.

 

[pinstriper]

It is an interesting discussion of the options and obstacles.

You described your rig as a teardrop, but perhaps you would describe some more ?

One thing we did last year was run a hot tent as a heated living space, but retreated to teardrops or truck bed shells for sleeping.

The hot tents were either canvas lodge tents with a wood stove, or a simple easy-up with sidewalls and a propane cannon heater.

In some cases these were also sleeping quarters.

Overnight temperatures depending on season and location ranged from 0’s to 20’sF, elevation ranging from 4-5k’.

We also bring a half barrel as a campfire ring/rocket stove, running more or less continuously if guys are in camp and the weather isn’t storming and driving us inside.


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[pinstriper]

1990's I had Propex in a Westy, it fits in a very small space. Works fine.

1969 an old man died in the next van from a Coleman Catalytic. His dog and kid got out.

Installing the smallest propane Atwood forced air now.

If I had a Diesel truck I would use a Diesel cab heater.

But I don't and don't want modern Diesel anything.

Those super tiny wood burning boxes are interesting, if you have wood.

The super tiny woodstoves would be out of place in a teardrop, but maybe in a larger converted cargo trailer. I wonder if you can give it enough wood for an overnight burn.


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[NotJammer]

No it wood need wood every hour at least.

My large Ashley Stove in the 70's could go 24 hours just barely with all correct conditions.

Sail boats use tiny wood stoves, very tiny boats and stoves.

Dickinson Newport https://www.go2marine.com/product/20010 ... newsf.html

 

[OP827]

In my build I installed a vintage Hydroflame BRC-10 gravity type furnace taken out of a tent trailer. Paid about 50$. It does not need electricity and fully vented outside so it can run with all windows closed. I did not camp with that yet as I am still working on my build, but from the test run I did it works pretty good and does not take a lot of propane. It produces radiant heating, but a fan can be added if really needed. It looks like this installed from inside:

 

[KTM_Guy]

Also not a fan. No diesel for this guy.

I'm not too worried about additional batteries, either. My last two 12v furnaces (including the one currently in the tent trailer) have been able to run a minimum of 4 days on a charge (usually 5) with my only deep-cycle battery, with my wife setting the thermostat at 60-65 F (!! !!).
If set more appropriately and paired with my solar "battery tender", I can go 10+ days without issue. If I absolutely had to, I could use a charging adapter to top off the deep-cycle with my truck, to go until the propane runs out.

If you can go 4-5 days at a toasty 60-65 degrees on one battery charge why look for another option? Add another battery or a solar panel for more days out.

Todd

 

[MtnDon]

The Propex is a great heater.

We used the hot water from the RV water heater we installed. We are well insulated and do not camp in very low temperatures.

Link to a thread here on this idea.... viewtopic.php?f=54&t=62327&hilit=heating

 

[Squigie]

Alright, diesel guys. I promise I'll look into it.
Just don't expect me to convert.

If you can go 4-5 days at a toasty 60-65 degrees on one battery charge why look for another option? Add another battery or a solar panel for more days out.

Todd

The Teardrop build is a supplement to that tent trailer.
The tent trailer is inefficient and a pain to set up when it's just me - or even my wife or son, and I. ...But it still has its place.
(It's also too wide for some places I go, too low for some roads I travel, and too heavy when loaded for extended stays. But, again, that's why the teardrop is being built.)

The teardrop that this discussion is about will be a new, secondary camp trailer for "lighter" trips with only one or two people.
I can't really just borrow the tent trailer's furnace when I take the teardrop out.

I only brought that up to point out that I'm not worried about battery life with a decent furnace.

 

[Tomterrific-TNT]

Old tiny marine stoves may have used coal or charcoal.

A teardrop stove must have these important features. Outside exhaust and prefer all openings outside for positive killing suffocation control. Isolation from the wood and foam, anything that burns.

A homemade idea I have is a sheet metal panel to replace a window in winter. The stove would be 3 or 4" iron pipe with L's on both ends. The sheet metal would have holes for the L's to go through. Pipe inside, openings outside. Sheet isolates the hot pipe from wood. The outside openings would have a cap on the bottom and a flap at the top. Charcoal brickettes would be fed in the top to keep the pipe warm.

Anyway that is as far as I got. I have thought about oil, liquid fuel but it is too dangerous for homemade. Unless it is used to heat water and the water thermosiphons to the bed.

 

[Squigie]

I checked out some diesel heaters online and even stopped in at a local truck stop to look at what they had in stock; and then cruised down the road a bit to talk to my aunt (a locally-based trucker).
No diesel for me.
I don't want to deal with the fuel. I don't want the stink. They have long startups with 'high' amp draws. And they all seem to draw too many amps when running, for my liking.

I bit the bullet and ordered a Suburban NT-16SEQ propane furnace.
Should be a 2.7 amp draw after a 3.5-4 amp startup spike.
22 lbs.
In theory, propane consumption should be near my last two furnaces.
Data is mixed about whether or not that model can be ducted, or is direct-discharge-only. I guess I'll find out for sure when it shows up.
If it can be ducted, I can tuck it away in a cabinet on the rear bulkhead (with an allowance for return air), and duct to where I want the heat.
If it's direct-discharge, I'll look into Suburban's "special" intake and exhaust pipes, and see where that takes me. I may require some creative thinking and asymmetrical cabin design.
We'll see after it arrives and I have some time to take it apart before I ever use it...

 

[olddawgsrule]

Was very curious what would come up on this thread. We do use heat in our conventional trailer and as I go into the build am researching alternates ways of doing so. Our usage is only just before bed (changing into jammies) and in the morning (changing out of).

Most of our camping is below 4K ft, yet have (and will) return to the spots over 8K. Have woken to snow in several times (and frozen water in the truck bed).

I see the OP is going propane and being we now have one (and like it) will probably do the same. Since I will have a cooktop & frig running on propane, adding the heater seems reasonable.
Now, here's where I get weird.. My existing frig expels heat out through the sidewalls vents. I've wondered just how much and if I could redirect that heat back into the trailer.

 

[Wellcraft290]

cheap chinese diesel. 110 bucks on ebay.

saw lots of vids. 9 amps on startup from the glow plug then down to .5 amp while running on low. I plan on this setup and keep the tank outside in the front box.