"TrailTop" modular trailer building components

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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:29 pm

I decided to put the second layer of 1/8" plywood skin on the hatch "the hard way"... by that I mean I oriented it 90 degrees differently from the first layer. The first layer was put on with the grain of 2 of the 3 plies running crosswise - that way it bent very easily around the curve. I decided to run this one the other way so that the final laminate of two layers of plywood had the same number of plies running in each direction for maximum strength. I'm sure putting both layers the "easy way" would have been plenty strong enough, but I wanted to see how hard it would be to do it the other way.

Answer: it takes a lot more clamps. I used ratchet straps to pull the plywood into shape, the straps are attached to pipes running through cinder blocks on the floor. Then I use clamps around the perimeter.

I used Titebond III wood glue - it's waterproof and it's also thin enough to be spread easily with a paintbrush, so I could coat the entire surface of the plywood quickly with glue.

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I'll let it set up overnight and tomorrow it'll get installed on the camper shell.
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby Hardryder56 » Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:55 pm

Jeff,
I guess by now you have figured out you can never have too many clamps. ;) I like the way you clamping the second layer on, have you ever used the vacuum bag technique?
Tom
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:59 pm

Hardryder56 wrote:Jeff,
I guess by now you have figured out you can never have too many clamps. ;) I like the way you clamping the second layer on, have you ever used the vacuum bag technique?
Tom

I have not used a vacuum bag. but that or even sandbags could be helpful for a job like this.

I still have quite a few clamps in reserve, didn't come close to using all I've got :).
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:35 am

I couldn't resist doing the 225-lb. gorilla test when I took the clamps off the hatch this morning,. I'll declare the curved fiberglass ribs and the entire hatch plenty strong enough :).

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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:46 am

A few photos of the hatch in place.

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All that's left on the outside of the shell now are flat spaces to fill in with plywood or whatever skin material is chosen.
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Sun Mar 30, 2014 1:00 pm

Someone asked me today using Lexan panels to close out the TrailTop shell. You definitely could do that; here are some translucent panels drawn in the roof and front in this view.

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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby mallymal » Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:50 pm

These profiles are superb....

Someone could make a real design feature of them too, by having natural aluminium colour for the flat panels and a strong colour contrast for the profiles, rather like the t@b

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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:15 pm

mallymal wrote:These profiles are superb....

Someone could make a real design feature of them too, by having natural aluminium colour for the flat panels and a strong colour contrast for the profiles, rather like the t@b

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Thank you.

While I'm definitely not copying the T@B here, painting the TrailTop parts with a bold color and doing an aluminum skin for the panels is something I've had in mind for a long time. I posted this animation a couple of months ago:

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And last week I was driving up I-95 from Florida and came across a T@DA trailer, it's a lot larger than the T@B, but I drove next to it for several miles studying it, thinking, "now that would make a good large TrailTop project..."

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A few days ago I started doing a concept drawing of a T@DA-like TrailTop but haven't finished it yet.
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby Hardryder56 » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:52 pm

Jeff,
What was towing the T&DA trailer? Looks like an old bus or motorhome. How hard would it be to mold the color into the parts from the get go?
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby grant whipp » Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:21 pm

Hey, Tom!

Gel-cote (what is white on Jeff's parts) comes in a multitude of colors, and what you can't buy you can custom-mix, almost like automotive paint.

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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:19 am

Hardryder56 wrote:Jeff,
What was towing the T&DA trailer? Looks like an old bus or motorhome. How hard would it be to mold the color into the parts from the get go?
Tom

Tom,
I should have gotten pictures of the bus too, I'm guessing it was a late 50's/early 60's bus converted to a motorhome. It was pretty cool looking.

Grant answered the color question, but I'll add a little more "color commentary"...

The outer color of a fiberglass part is the gel coat, and as Grant says, it comes in many colors and can be custom-mixed. Doing parts in a different color involves nothing more than using a different color gel coat as the first step. Sometimes the tint is also mixed in the resin which makes the part the same color all the way through. Tinting the resin would be a good idea for TrailTop parts because you do need to cut some of them to length - if only the gel coat has color then the cut edge won't have the color.

About molding the TrailTop parts commercially in different colors - a lot will depend on the demand for the different colors and the shop that does the molding. All shops have white gel coat on hand, and many have black; they buy that in quantity (55 gallon drums or even larger) because that's what they get the most call for. The typical minimum quantity of a special color gel coat that a shop buys is a 5-gallon drum, which would make a LOT of TrailTop parts, so there would have to be decent demand for that color to make doing the color worthwhile - a shop wouldn't want to buy a 5-gallon drum for one order.

The pricing for TrailTop parts would probably go something like this:

- White or Black non-UV gel coat: cheapest (great choice if they're going to be painted)
- White UV protected gel coat: maybe 10% more expensive due to the price of the gel coat
- Common colors UV protected: could be 15-20% more than the cheapest parts?
- Custom colors UV protected: ? (gel coat by the quart is most expensive, so doing a small quantity in a custom color would cost the most)

Tinting the resin as well as the gel coat would add a little bit more to the cost.

If the fiberglass shop has custom color mixing capabilities in house that should reduce the cost premium somewhat.

If these get to production, the variety of colors will be a business decision that the company can make. Pretty much anything is technically possible, but some options might not make good business sense depending on ow much demand there would be for a particular color and what people are willing to pay for the parts.

BTW fiberglass takes paint very well, so doing colors like the T@B and T@da photos posted earlier is very easy to achieve with paint.

Side story about molding in different colors:

I almost always mold parts in white, because I usually I plan to paint the parts I make. When I started the TrailTop project, I wanted to work in my nice warm workshop over the winter instead of the cold garage, but I can't get a real trailer down into my workshop. I did have an unassembled Dinoot Extended kit here though - the only problem was that my yellow trailer is 11" longer than a Dinoot Extended. So I molded two 11"-long side extension side panels for the Dinoot, and I molded them using black gel coat to match the Dinoot parts. Here they are right after coming out of the mold, before I cleaned them up a bit:

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When bolted in place, they made the Dinoot Extended exactly the same length as my yellow trailer, so whatever I build in the workshop on the Dinoot will exactly fit the yellow trailer up in the garage. You can see the panels bolted in at the back of the tub:

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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby Hardryder56 » Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:46 am

Jeff and Grant,
Seems I had one of my "Duh" moments there. I have worked in fiberglass before and totally forgot that the gelcoat is the color and that fiberglass/epoxy takes paint very well. BUT Thank you to both of you for the answers. :oops:

Jeff, when your systems goes into production I cant see anyone having a problem building campers from it, your write ups along with the pictures are all anyone with a bit of mechanical ability and some common sense need for instruction.
Tom
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:54 am

Last week I posted a few photos showing how I was putting cross-ribs in the roof to support a roof-top tent or a cargo basket:

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When I wrote that I thought it was more likely that someone might put a roof-top tent on a more rectangular TrailTop rather than a teardrop shape, but then the March/April issue of Cool Tears showed up in my inbox this morning... there's a feature in it about a teardrop with a roof-top tent on it:

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I guess I'm not so crazy after all :).
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:00 am

Hardryder56 wrote:Jeff, when your systems goes into production I cant see anyone having a problem building campers from it, your write ups along with the pictures are all anyone with a bit of mechanical ability and some common sense need for instruction.
Tom


Tom,

So far I feel like I'm meeting my "ease of assembly" design requirement. Getting the shell assembled to this point has only required basic hand tools, a drill and a handheld jigsaw. The jigsaw was even optional optional until now, trimming the ribs to fit the inside profile of the TrailTop parts could have been done with a coping saw. The jigsaw will be required when it's time to cut the side panels.

No special skills or difficult procedures have been required, except for careful measuring and cutting.

I'm especially pleased with how easy it was to make the curved hatch, and how strong the hatch is.

Of course if you do the curved hatch "the hard way" like I did, lots of clamps are needed. But bending the plywood the easy way, which would be adequate in this application, only requires a modest number of clamps :).
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Re: "TrailTop" modular trailer building components

Postby jscherb » Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:28 am

I found an RV mural on eBay the other day that might be cool on the side of a TrailTop. Here's a concept drawing, I've done the TrailTop framework in black to match the tub and the silhouetted palm trees.

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The seller offers them in several sizes, and I contacted them to ask if they could do a custom size specifically for this project. Yes they can, a 38"x82" would be $134.95. Here's the listing: http://www.ebay.com/itm/281209474027?va ... 1423.l2648

In this next photo/drawing I've edited the TrailTop framework to black (didn't paint the hatch, you can use your imagination on that). I've also used translucent Lexan for the roof and front panel, it could be a dark tint that looked almost black from the outside but still provided some visibility from the inside.

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