Construction techniques - wood

[jrjr]

Hi all, my first post!

I have been reading these forums now for days and have sort of decided on my construction method. I fly RC planes and need a small trailer to haul some larger ones to the field. So, I have purchased a HF trailer and have it assembled. I plan to build a 4x4x8 with extended V nose. I will use either 1/4" Luan if I can find some good stuff with exterior glue or 3/8" ply and I think a 2x2 frame. I live in upstate NY so snow load is of a concern here over the winter with outside storage.

It seems like the way to go is with the canvas/gripper covering approach. I am wondering though if I should coat the unit with Titebond 2 to start with. Will the gripper adhere to the TB good? I understand one can use just the gripper to adhere the canvas to the wood as well, but which provides a stronger bond? Sure would be nice to get the added waterproofing from the TB. Another possibility that I have read here is using a 50/50 mix of mineral spirits and cheap poly to initially waterproof the container but will the gripper stick to that good? After several days of reading here I haven't seen a definitive application approach but there are lots of blurbs on the subject throughout the forums. Perhaps I have missed something.

Great resource you have here and I appreciate any input!

[KCStudly]

You hit it just right. There are a lot of variations on the canvas skin approach and from what I have seen none of them have been failures.

The latest thinking is that TB2 should be used to glue the canvas down, and gripper as a primer on top to help fill the weave prior to paint. There has been some feedback that gripper (at least over foam) is not the best adhesion.

[Fyddler]

I used slightly watered down TB2 and Musslin. My thought was I didn't need the structural strength of the canvas since the trailer was built out of plywood (Fomies rely in the canvas as a structural component as I understand). I used a paint roller to apply the TB2, stuck the muslin on, then rolled out again to totally soak the muslin. I had problems with bubbling if the muslin while it was drying so I just drank beer and kept rolling it out until the bubbles quit appearing. I first did the sides, overlapping into the roof by an inch, then did the roof, overlapping down the side an inch. The slightly watered down TB2 seemed to soak in to the plywood well. The idea with the muslin is two fold: It waterproofs and seals the wood. The other idea is to seal up all the joints so what ever you paint with doesn't crack at the seams. I rushed my fenders and just painted them, and the paint cracked at every joint weeks into my travels. So far a miles I don't have a sing issue with the rest of the trailer. I also played around with sanding the Musslin after it dried and achieved a very smooth finish, but I only tested very small area and didn't really find it necessary because by the time I put on the TB2 and paint you don't see any fabric pattern due to how fine the Musslin is.

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1401291513.886409.jpg (48.21 KiB) Viewed 1998 times

[tony.latham]

"I will use either 1/4" Luan if I can find some good stuff with exterior glue or 3/8" ply"

JrJr:

You might poke around your lumber suppliers for 1/4" "Moisture-Resistant Plywood Underlayment." I can get it here in the middle of no-where, so you probably can too. It's a significantly higher quaility plywood than the 1/4" AC fir ply and it's about $8 cheaper a sheet ($22). 3 Laminations with a solid core. Both surfaces are smoothly sanded and one side has great-looking contrasting grain. As far as the glue, I've thrown scrap pieces in a bucket of water for a week and no delamination. I've heard that this stuff is Russian birch but have no idea if that's true.

Tony

[jrjr]

You hit it just right. There are a lot of variations on the canvas skin approach and from what I have seen none of them have been failures.

The latest thinking is that TB2 should be used to glue the canvas down, and gripper as a primer on top to help fill the weave prior to paint. There has been some feedback that gripper (at least over foam) is not the best adhesion.

I appreciate all the answers!
While poking around the web I found this that might be of interest-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnOegaOKu38

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I used slightly watered down TB2 and Musslin. My thought was I didn't need the structural strength of the canvas since the trailer was built out of plywood (Fomies rely in the canvas as a structural component as I understand). I used a paint roller to apply the TB2, stuck the muslin on, then rolled out again to totally soak the muslin. I had problems with bubbling if the muslin while it was drying so I just drank beer and kept rolling it out until the bubbles quit appearing. I first did the sides, overlapping into the roof by an inch, then did the roof, overlapping down the side an inch. The slightly watered down TB2 seemed to soak in to the plywood well. The idea with the muslin is two fold: It waterproofs and seals the wood. The other idea is to seal up all the joints so what ever you paint with doesn't crack at the seams. I rushed my fenders and just painted them, and the paint cracked at every joint weeks into my travels. So far a miles I don't have a sing issue with the rest of the trailer. I also played around with sanding the Musslin after it dried and achieved a very smooth finish, but I only tested very small area and didn't really find it necessary because by the time I put on the TB2 and paint you don't see any fabric pattern due to how fine the Musslin is.

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1401291513.886409.jpg

Thanks, I have looked and considered muslin. It sounds good and may be the way I go too.
So, TB2, muslin,then more TB2
What did you top coat with if anything?

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"I will use either 1/4" Luan if I can find some good stuff with exterior glue or 3/8" ply"

JrJr:

You might poke around your lumber suppliers for 1/4" "Moisture-Resistant Plywood Underlayment." I can get it here in the middle of no-where, so you probably can too. It's a significantly higher quaility plywood than the 1/4" AC fir ply and it's about $8 cheaper a sheet ($22). 3 Laminations with a solid core. Both surfaces are smoothly sanded and one side has great-looking contrasting grain. As far as the glue, I've thrown scrap pieces in a bucket of water for a week and no delamination. I've heard that this stuff is Russian birch but have no idea if that's true.

Tony

Sounds good. I will look for that!
Thanks

[Fyddler]

I used a primer called First Coat" by Rodda, final paint is Cloverdale Eco Logic, it's a water based (low VOC) two part acrylic epoxy. I used an HVLP sprayer to spray it out.

[jrjr]

First coat sounds like a good product.

Question
When you applied the muslin to a side panel, you overlapped the top by 2". Did you stick the 2" on the top down at the same time as the side, or not glue that 2" and wait for the side to dry first then do the 2" on the top?

Edit
Looking for the underlayment I found this
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Unbranded-7- ... /203183010

but it says it's not available in my store. Putting that model number in search results in this
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Unbranded-7- ... ord=431178

Which IS available in my store. Looks like the stuff you were referring to.... ya think?

[Fyddler]

When I covered the sides I glued it to the top, and it was only 1" or so, it really is not a critical dimension. The links didn't come through, but I just purchased the cheapest cotton Musslin fabric I could find in the width I needed.

[jrjr]

What a mess.....
The only place around me with the birch underlayment was Home Depot... or at least the website says they have it. I called first since its a 45 minute drive. Oh yes they said on the phone... we have 119 of them. Once there I find that the website is incorrect and the sku is for luan. Called HD customer service and they checked other stores.... all the same so it's not available from HD either. Will have to check around for the best luan I guess. HD did have some 1/4" birch but the center was akin to cardboard and twice as expensive.

[GPW]

Looking for good wood ..... stay away from the HD ... Try a Real Lumberyard ... Better wood , likely cheaper too ...

[jrjr]

Yup I agree. I am always willing to pay a bit more for the good stuff

[LeeOrlando2]

Looking for good wood ..... stay away from the HD ... Try a Real Lumberyard ... Better wood , likely cheaper too ...

In my small town, Georgia, "Ace was the hardware place" & lumber yard before HD came to town. They still are thriving some 6-8 years after arrival of HD. I know they are competitive or only slightly higher on some things. Anyone ever compare their lumber?? I definitely will price them soon, when I start my build!

[jrjr]

I have gotten my build started. Here's a pic of the progress. A friend gave me a big roll of nylon material which kind of compares to 7oz canvas in weight. Maybe a bit thinner. I plan to do some testing before actually putting it onto the trailer but I was wondering if anyone here has experience using nylon. Would it be best to adhere with TBII or paint? I got a couple of gallons of the old, real oil base paint to use if I want. Should get the testing started today. There isn't much info on using nylon on here. I have read some comments that ballistic nylon would be the strongest but no application history or results.

[GPW]

That’s looking Very Nice !!!

[rowerwet]

I don't buy plywood at home depot, here in southern NH it is all made in china garbage that will warp as fast as you cut it. Lowe's has Sureply underlayment, it is great stuff, I use it for boats and my tear.
I used porch paint to stick my canvas to the plywood, TBII is cheaper and sticks just as hard as gripper to foam, sticking to wood is even easier, I recommend the TBII method for sticking fabric to anything.
Not sure about your fabric, cut off a 1 foot square sample and test the bond with gripper and TBII, I find the trick with synthectics is to make sure the glue goes through the weave of the fabric (you might try perforating it lightly with a wagner 250) since it won't be as easy to stick to.