radius edge trick question

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radius edge trick question

Postby zukamini » Mon May 26, 2008 11:21 pm

Hey guys and gals , I built my tear back in 2003 using tie & tape process and polyester resin. several coats of a high build primer were used to fair out the sides and top and instead of a metal trim strip, I sanded a contour (radius) to the area where the sides meet the top to give it a smooth appearance. however, I was never really happy with the sanding job I did,and I learned that you must seal hi build primer before the top coat goes on or you will be sanding it all off and redoing it again :thumbdown: . So here i am ,I've sanded down to the polyester resin and coated entire body with west epoxy. I have used West 405 wood flour mixed with epoxy to fair out all the sunken screw holes(another note to self, do not use lumber yard wood fillers to hide screw holes) and finally, I have built up the area where the sides meet the top with 405 wood filler and epoxy. this has been sanded to a knife edge (square corner) . my question is there a good method to sanding a contour ? I was hoping to keep the radius consistent , any help would be much appreciated. JIM
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Postby angib » Tue May 27, 2008 8:29 am

There must be a router bit that will give the round-over radius you want, but I imagine it would have to be a big router and a big bit.

To do something like the deck edge radius on a yacht (say, 2"-4" radius), we would first trim by hand using a power planer to get something like the right shape and then sand it by hand using a sanding block, checking regularly with a radius template.

One of the two tricks with sanding a rounded edge is in using a long, narrow sanding block that has the sandpaper stuck to it. Doing this job with a power sander won't work - it's just too hard not to take off too much material and create flat spots. Clearly, doing it by hand isn't a 10-minute job, but if you want it right.....

The second and most important trick is to move the sanding block correctly - the block is aligned along the edge and moved diagonally - so not only does it move along the joint, it also rotates around the radius, and that rotation is 100% essential. You cannot get a smooth radius if you try to sand at a constant angle. If you have bad wrists, you need to find someone else to do this job!

If the joint gets to a tight curve, switch to a shorter sanding block but keep the same diagonal, rotating motion.

This job sounds like it requires an impossible level of skill, or hand-eye coordination, to make an exact radius, but it's surprisingly easy to do once you take the plunge. I can do it, so it's neither skilled or hard.....

Andrew
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Postby doug hodder » Tue May 27, 2008 9:37 am

I think you'll find that the idea of a radius corner is going to wear off a lot faster than that edge at this point if doing it by hand. Especially if you want a fairly large radius. Ideally I think you'd need to run a router to cut that to get it even and with a minimum of time, especially if you want a radius that is more than just taking off the sharp edge. Like Andrew says however, it can be done and he has the technique to do it. I'm too lazy.

How much of a radius you can put on it depends on what thickness you used on your materials. I ran a 1.25 R bit for the roundover on the sides of my new trailer. It does take a big bit and a big router, but smaller ones could be easily done with a typical homeowners type router. I did however put a backer strip behind the side when built and removed all the screws after the epoxy adheseive cured, so that it would allow me to cut that much material without opening up a hole. Whatever direction you go, it does need to have the sharpness of the edge taken off. Epoxy typically doesn't like a hard corner like that, opinions may vary. Doug

Sides to roof and tongue box have 1.25" R, trolley top has 3/4" R

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Postby zukamini » Tue May 27, 2008 10:16 pm

Thank you very much Andrew & Doug, the radius is only about .5", so i tried the sanding block method and it works pretty good. it's a bit of a workout though. I cut three blocks of different lengths and attached sticky back sandpaper to each. the (trick) seems to be the sanding motion(as Andrew mentioned) and working the corner from both sides. thanks again guys. PS that is one fine looking tear Doug :thumbsup: JIM
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Postby doug hodder » Tue May 27, 2008 10:24 pm

Jim...also check with a local body shop paint supplier. They have a variety of profiles of sanding blocks in rubber of varying densities. I've got a bunch of them and they are invaluable. Just an idea, and thanks for the compliment. Doug
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Postby zukamini » Tue May 27, 2008 10:53 pm

Thats a good idea Doug, I'm still a little concerned about the front curve and keeping the profile consistent. I purchased a epoxy based primer (ENDURA hi build) , but after reading the spec sheet, it may not be what I'm looking for. I would like to apply a hi build primer that is sandable as I know( as hard as I look) I've missed some little imperfection.
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Postby doug hodder » Tue May 27, 2008 11:01 pm

Make sure you seal the sanded portions with epoxy prior to a primer coat. It needs it. Since you did a "stitch and glue" technique and are familiar with epoxy I'm sure you know this, but epoxy resin and the epoxy primer aren't the same critter. Good choice on a high build primer, it will hide a lot of imperfections, but not everything, spot putty will take care of the rest. Doug
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Postby zukamini » Tue May 27, 2008 11:19 pm

Well Doug, I'm sort of a READY,FIRE,AIM type of guy that will jump in with both feet and then try to learn how to swim. :lol: I get eager to see the finished product and I think thats how I got here (sanding off and redoing) so , please enlighten me on the do's and don'ts. I thought you only had to seal the primer before the top coat was applied. I have been careful not to break thru the epoxy that was applied after the first sand down.
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Postby doug hodder » Tue May 27, 2008 11:48 pm

Seal raw wood with epoxy resin, for me, I don't use Rot DR. ..sand it so no grain appears in wood, primer over that, sand primer (depends on brand and timing whether or not it needs to be sanded), shoot/apply paint or whatever topcoat. The quality of your top finish depends on how well you did the sub surface stuff! Paint doesn't hide much...I'm with you... I want instant results and want to see it looking good...that's a hard one to put off, but well worth the efforts to do so. Good luck on your build. Doug
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Postby zukamini » Wed May 28, 2008 12:02 am

Thanks again Doug , I thought i missed a step. hopefully all will go well JIM
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Postby zukamini » Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:16 pm

A little update on the tear redo. 1st photo shows radius corner that turned out pretty good and following photos show sanded (OEM) paint to epoxy primer. I think one or two more coats of high build,with some sanding and sealer , hope to apply top coat soon. <a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/zukamini/radiuscorner.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a> <a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/zukamini/td3side.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a> <a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/zukamini/td4rear.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a> <a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/zukamini/td8epoxyprime.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a> <a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/zukamini/td7epoxyprime.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
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Postby Roly Nelson » Fri Jun 06, 2008 1:25 am

Jim, I have found that I can make just about any shape of sanding block from the black rubber base of a traffic delineator, like they use to direct traffic into proper lanes. I have a number of inside and outside shapes that I've cut out of this solid rubber, using my bandsaw. I was a bit concerned about the blade grabbing the rubber but it cuts just like a piece of soft wood, no problems. You have quite a build going on there, it should be a work of art when finished.
Roly :thumbsup:
See the little 1/2 Nelson Woody constructions pics at: http://gages-56.com/roly.html
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