Is the U.S. headed for a food shortage?

[Bodyman]

Not here. In the last fifteen to twenty years there were programs, mainly for conservation purposes, to pay farmers to keep poor ground out of production. In the last few years many of these contracts have expired and now only the ground most prone to erosion remains. Much of the other is heading for the Gulf of Mexico now with the rain we have been having.

[angib]

we help out other countries with our grain reserves because we can, and because it's the right thing to do.

But we need to be grown-up about it, and recognise that this may not be the real reason we do it - and I say we, as Europe does exactly the same as the US and no doubt Canada does too. It may give us a warm glow to congratulate ourselves on how we help the poor and starving, but the help is mostly going to our farming industries in our own countries.

Our farmers get two benefits:
- the governments are a buyer for crops which might not otherwise be sold (as we both produce surpluses); and
- the governments pay a 'market price' which helps to maintain a higher price for crops than would exist otherwise.

Countries receiving aid get one upside and two downsides:
- free agricultural produce feeds people who might otherwise starve;
- the aid tends to come with some strings attached, for example on how the recipient countries can operate their economies;
- giving out free produce in recipient countries forces down the market price of those same crops there, so farmers of those crops can't make a living - some of the people getting food aid may need it because we screwed up their market.

Sorry to get all heavy, but it's other peoples' lives that are at risk, so we should do what is right, not what sounds right.

And on a lighter note......

Dandelion wine has log been popular with home-made wine fans over here. It is famous, not only for its ability to work like paint stripper on your throat if not of very good quality, but also for its ability to give you a 'bad head' afterwards.

Andrew

[S. Heisley]

The world is changing and the pace at which it changes seems to be increasing with the dismaying downturn of both food and oil reserves and global warming. If there is anything that could and should bring the world's people together, it would be working together to solve these issues.

As far as the government paying for farmers NOT to plant, I remember in my childhood of people who, yes, took advantage of this offer when they had no plans to plant in the first place. And, yes, the program was used to keep the price of the grain up. With the making of ethanol now a reality, grain will begin to sell at a premium price and farmers should no longer need as much financial help.

As far as buying grain for other countries, I agree with you, Andrew. It's the old adage: "Give a man a fish, feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, feed him for a lifetime." There are organizations that are trying to teach people in poorer areas how to farm and raise livestock and at least that is something.

Okay, on the lighter side: Too much of any wine will give one a bad head!

[Bodyman]

I really don’t agree that the government pays farmers not to plant corn and soybeans. I think it is just the opposite.
I am not a farmer but did grow up on a farm and don’t fully understand or agree with farm programs.
Here is how I understand it. I may be wrong and hope I don’t upset someone. Six or eight years ago most of my wife’s family farm came off a ten year set-aside program. This program was for poor highly erodable ground which really should not be planted to row crops year after year. I believe this program paid $90 to $95 per acre. When the contract expired this ground no longer qualified because it’s crop base (estimated annual yield), while low, was too high. So this ground went back into production along with many other acres across Iowa. At that time large scale operations were paying around $120 per acre rent for this type of ground. The government reimbursed the renter for around half of this. In addition if the yield did not exceed the crop base the renter received a check for the difference. I believe these practices still exist. Also if the price of corn does not exceed a preset amount per bushel the farmer is also paid.
I would say the government is paying farmers (mostly large scale farmers) to plant more and more acres to corn and beans on poor ground not paying them to let the ground lay idle.
All this leads to the joke (not always said jokingly) that farmers have to have two mailboxes. One for the Gov checks and one for everything else.

[Walt M]

I don't know how many of you have had a chance to visit our fine state of NH. Great handbuilt stone walls run for miles through the forest. ? Back in the 1800's 80 percent of the state was farm land. Think of that, next time you ride through the White Mountains. When food gets to a point that people think it's expensive, farms will make a come back.everything does turn, turn,turn.
Walt

[caseydog]

There are two groups involved in government subsidies -- farmers, and agribusiness.

Many years ago, subsidies were set up to help farmers survive in tough times. Today, I'm not sure how much of the current subsidies are helping farmers, and how much is just plain corporate welfare.

The farm bills that go through congress are huge, and complicated. I know I can't figure out where the money is going -- and I pride myself on trying to be well informed. But God help any congress member who opposes these bills, because they are one of those "third rail" issues that you are not supposed to touch.

CD

[daddiozz]

"Will there be a shortage? Better questions is can you really feed yourself and family. Takes an amazing amount of land to feed a family all year.
_________________
Aunti M (Miriam) "

Is there really enough "wild" game available? Even most First Nations people knew they needed to help nature along. That was when wild animals out numbered people.

,,,yes "Aunti" there is plenty of wild ones to go around....you just gotta know where to look.

no no not "wild ones" wild animals of the food type.

If there are enough, I'd have a hard time trusting that most humans would be responsible hunters. Don't forget about what happened to the buffalo.

Mmmmm...buffalo....

no buffalo in Ga,but plenty of squirrels,rabbits and bambis....and thats just in my backyard!!...my mtn retreat in W Va has many times more ....not sure what its like in Jersey though ...the only wild life I saw on my last visit was in Atlantic City....

[satch]

THE END IS NEAR

[caseydog]

THE END IS NEAR

Not yet -- that happens when the "Thread-Killer" thread hits 1,000 pages.

CD

[satch]

THE END IS NEAR

Not yet -- that happens when the "Thread-Killer" thread hits 1,000 pages.

CD

Well, if that happens, everyone on the forum can get together and form a teardrop community in the desert somewhere. We can elect Elmo for pres. (maybe not), start our own wars ( west coast Tearjerkers vs. east), we can have our own little country... sorry it's been a long day

[TheBizMan]

If there is a food shortage, it would be easy to fix. Go back to the familygarden. My wife and I started growing tomatos, onions, peppers, strawberrys in pots on our patio. The pots are approx 2-4 gallons each. so far since april, we have harvested enough to have several meals and still bottle some for the future. That is only from a small effort. Imagin how much we could grow if we planted an 8' x 8' or bigger garden. One of our kids raises rabbits (16 hutches) so we have meat available. Food shortage, bring is on.

[daddiozz]

... It could get to a point that your very survival may be in your own hands.

....its always been that way....just kinda hard to realise it with every manner of convienence and grocery store and "fast food" outlet every where you go..........somebody earlier on this thread mentioned the "darker side" ...consider this ...for whatever reason..,gas /diesel runs out ...trucks can't get to the stores etc to re-supply ....anybody want to take a stab at how long it would be before the store shelves would be empty?That single fact alone should galvanize everyone to stock up and/or start a "victory garden". ....most won't..

[S. Heisley]

Thanks for the corrections, critiques, deep thoughts
and ...chuckles!

On the world news, tonight, they said some stores in China are no longer supplying plastic bags to their customers and customers there are bringing their own.

Yes, maybe, just like the lyrics, "Turn,turn,turn" will happen yet!

[Wolf]

The joke in this town is "where do you buy your groceries" We have one store here for about 3,500 people. Forget food, I'm going for the bullets if it gets that bad. My neighbor has a tiller and an empty lot so we are joining forces to put in a garden right here in town. Nice thing here is we can air dry a lot of food.

[S. Heisley]

I usually have a great dandelion crop. It's too wet even for that this year. Lots of white clover, though. Any recipes for white clover wine?
Randy

Like the edible dandelion, clover is another plant that can be eaten in times of famine. According to the Field Guide to Edible Wild Plants clover is a member of the pea family. The leaves and stems can be briefly steamed or eaten raw, as a salad. The roots can be cooked or smoked and eaten in a meat or other such sauce or stew. The flowers have been used to flavor cheeses and tobaccos as well as being eaten raw. During famines, bread has been made from the seed-filled dried blossoms. Crushed dried clover blossoms can also be used to make a tea. Sorry, no wine recipes were found for clover.

Clover ( Trifolium repens) is actually good for the soil because it provides nourishment (fertilizer) by taking nitrogen from the air and fixing it to the soil with the help of the bacteria found on its roots. It can be used as a ground cover or as a border. It spreads indefinitely though, so will probably take over your lawn unless you kill it with some nasty chemical. At least you have an excuse for letting it stay... It's good for the soil!

Okay, that's probably more than you ever wanted to know.....