What Sumner's been doing in the shop

[angib]

Don't the internet make the world seem small? A motorcycle list I'm on referenced a streamliner that's on Sumner's (he of the pop-up teardrop) web site and I went to see what he's been working on - a Suzuki-powered Lakester:



Here is Sumner's web site.

Andrew

[JunkMan]

Those wooden shocks don't look like they would do very much good

[PaulC]

For those that are interested in the high speed stuff they have just held our speed attempts up North. Check here http://www.dlra.org.au/2006.htm

Cheers
Paul

[Gage]

He's been working on that thing for a couple of years now. I think Grant is also trying to build one. The good thing about Sum is his house & shop is right next door to his store. So he can sneak out at lunch and work on the streamliner.


That's Sum on the left.

Have a good day.

[Joanne]

Don't the internet make the world seem small? A motorcycle list I'm on referenced a streamliner that's on Sumner's (he of the pop-up teardrop) web site and I went to see what he's been working on - a Suzuki-powered Lakester:



Here is Sumner's web site.

Andrew

I've read through his pages and he's doing a pretty amazing job. My only thought is that the car is going to be HEAVY for a motorcycle engine to push. I would think that weight would be your enemy.

Joanne

[asianflava]

My only thought is that the car is going to be HEAVY for a motorcycle engine to push. I would think that weight would be your enemy.

It may be a factor, but wind resistance is a bigger factor.

[angib]

I would think that weight would be your enemy.

Not really, for a record car, as rolling resistance is not that high (relatively) at high speed - like asianflava says, aero drag is all that really matters - oh, and stability too, that's always good to have.

The importance of drag over weight shows in the use of a water tank for engine cooling - it's far better to carry the weight of a tank of (gradually heating up) water down the track, rather than have the drag caused by airflow through a radiator.

To put cooling system drag into perspective, I seem to remember that at its maximum the new Bugatti Veyron requires 300hp just to overcome this drag. OK, it has 1000hp (yes, one thousand), but even then 300hp ain't chicken feed.

Andrew the Aero-Nerd

[Artificer]

To put cooling system drag into perspective, I seem to remember that at its maximum the new Bugatti Veyron requires 300hp just to overcome this drag. OK, it has 1000hp (yes, one thousand), but even then 300hp ain't chicken feed.

Andrew the Aero-Nerd

This seems strange to me. Maybe its the difference between aircraft and cars. I seem to remember either the P38 Lightning or P51 Mustang's oil cooler's having a net zero drag because of the air being heated.

I'm probably missing something huge with this thought train. (oil vs. water cooling...)

[Leon]

I would think that weight would be your enemy.
Joanne

A lot of the cars at Bonneville end up running with ballast to make the cars heavier and shift the CG. Traction with a light car can be a problem at high speeds.

[asianflava]

To put cooling system drag into perspective, I seem to remember that at its maximum the new Bugatti Veyron requires 300hp just to overcome this drag. OK, it has 1000hp (yes, one thousand), but even then 300hp ain't chicken feed.

Andrew the Aero-Nerd

This seems strange to me. Maybe its the difference between aircraft and cars. I seem to remember either the P38 Lightning or P51 Mustang's oil cooler's having a net zero drag because of the air being heated.

I'm probably missing something huge with this thought train. (oil vs. water cooling...)

I heard something like that. I heard that the heated air exiting the radiator of the P-51 generated some kind of thrust. I never checked the validity of that though.

[asianflava]

Found this pic after a quick google search, I guess it's true. I found it on a page that said that the thrust produced almost cancelled out the drag.

Also found this page about the Meredith Effect. I'll be honest, I just scanned thru it, Andrew may be interested in it.
http://www.airandspacemagazine.com/ASM/Mag/Supp/JJ99/Mustang.html

[angib]

asianflava,

Fascinating! Another twist in the 'international' nature of the Mustang.

I imagine building a ducted radiator system for the Veyron would take up the whole car - at full power, the cooling system is trying to dissipate about 750 kW (yup, 3/4 of a MW!!!). Plus it 'only' does about 250mph, so that Mustang paper suggest this isn't fast enough (min 300mph).

There's an article here that reveals that in addition to the three water radiators, there are water-cooled turbo intercoolers - and elsewhere I've seen that the car has two air conditioning condensers, plus coolers for engine oil, gearbox oil and differential oil. It really is a very silly car, even if it is a substantial technical achievement.

Andrew

[McTeardrops]

Angib

Have you seen anyone trying to use the Meredith effect, or NACA ducting, to cool a Seven?

[angib]

Have you seen anyone trying to use the Meredith effect, or NACA ducting, to cool a Seven?

To quote that paper, the Meredith effect starts to help at speeds above 300mph - how much power are you putting into that Seven?

The NACA duct was invented to get an air intake from a surface, so you could argue that on the bonnet/hood of a car is a relevant use, but really you'd simply run a hose from the grille area, unless you're really more interested in its styling than efficiency.

I have seen a Seven/Locost with a ducted radiator - which is what you'd want to use for least cooling system drag, at the expense of some weight - but I can't remember where I saw it........ The exit was out the top of the bonnet/hood, so I suspect it was a motorcycle-engined car, as any car engine would take up too much space to allow this.

Andrew