No converter just battery charger?

[milliejohn]

you seem to want more than the original post asked for, a simple, cheap way to recharge his battery, he only needs a basic battery charger that will work off his generator, I will not return to this thread.

[bdosborn]

No, I didn't want more than the original post, I'm just sharing me experiences. I went through the Schumacher and a Minn Kotta charger before I ended up with the ProMariner. Its was about a $100 dollar lesson on cheap battery chargers that I'm hoping the OP can avoid by recommending a quality battery charger. What's your experience with battery chargers and what do you recommend? My guess is that you don't have anything to offer other than snarky comments.


Bruce

[Dale M.]

you seem to want more than the original post asked for, a simple, cheap way to recharge his battery, he only needs a basic battery charger that will work off his generator, I will not return to this thread. :goodnight:

WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM.... Is not other allowed to contribute or have opinion, if it differs from yours...

Dale

[Bogo]

Schumacher was bought out by another company quite a few years ago. Quality plummeted after that. I don't buy them anymore.

[working on it]

I read this post about the charger putting out too much voltage for my AGM battery. I had previously praised a similar Schumacher Charger/Maintainer - the XCS-15, here http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=55430. I decided to test the overvoltage possibility, so I turned on the inverter next to it, so I could have a digital readout of actual voltage, not just the percentage of charge shown on the XCS-15. I had set-up the system so I could do just that, but didn't test it. From now on, I will use the inverter to monitor actual voltage to the battery, because when going overvoltage, the inverter will sound an alarm. Tested it, and yep, it does!

[qwerty11]

I read this post about the charger putting out too much voltage for my AGM battery. I had previously praised a similar Schumacher Charger/Maintainer - the XCS-15, here http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=55430. I decided to test the overvoltage possibility, so I turned on the inverter next to it, so I could have a digital readout of actual voltage, not just the percentage of charge shown on the XCS-15. I had set-up the system so I could do just that, but didn't test it. From now on, I will use the inverter to monitor actual voltage to the battery, because when going overvoltage, the inverter will sound an alarm. Tested it, and yep, it does!

So the battery charger did put out to many volts?

[working on it]

Yes. I heard the overvoltage alarm, looked in and the inverter display was "HI V". I quickly turned the inverter off, the back on, in order to see the voltage reading (momentarily before it alarmed again). It read 14.5v (which is too much for an AGM (Optima) to sustain for long. Even though I had it on "turtle" (slow charge) and AGM setting, the charger did not shut itself down, at this point (100% charged). I don't if it was going to at any moment, or if or when. So, not wanting to burn out the new Optima, like I had a $200+ racing battery I had 10-15 years ago, I'll just slow charge the battery and use the inverter to alarm me of overvoltage. I don't think I'll let it stay hooked up, for automatic charge/maintenance un-supervised. If this charger goes bad on me, or I find another, better use for it, then I might get the one Bruce recommended.

[bdosborn]

Yes. I heard the overvoltage alarm, looked in and the inverter display was "HI V". I quickly turned the inverter off, the back on, in order to see the voltage reading (momentarily before it alarmed again). It read 14.5v (which is too much for an AGM (Optima) to sustain for long.

I don't think 14.5V is too high, I think your AGM can go up to 15V without a problem. It does seem weird though that the inverter would alarm at that level since that's a very typical charge level.

http://www.optimabatteries.com/us/en/support/battery-care/charging/

Bruce

[working on it]

Yes. I heard the overvoltage alarm, looked in and the inverter display was "HI V". I quickly turned the inverter off, the back on, in order to see the voltage reading (momentarily before it alarmed again). It read 14.5v (which is too much for an AGM (Optima) to sustain for long.

I don't think 14.5V is too high, I think your AGM can go up to 15V without a problem. It does seem weird though that the inverter would alarm at that level since that's a very typical charge level.

http://www.optimabatteries.com/us/en/support/battery-care/charging/

Bruce

I see now where I had remembered the Optima charging info wrong. I thought the 13.8 volts (floating, at 1 amp) was the max allowable for the slow charge mode. But, now I see that I was ok with the 14.5 volts at the 2 amp level ("turtle", slow charge). I guess that with my memory lapses about my charging system, then I need to re-read the book on the Schumacher 410W Inverter. It shouldn't sent the alarm, especially since there was no other battery input/output present to set it off.

[working on it]

Update to my prior posts: Tried an experiment yesterday. The battery needed charging, since I use the interior LED-12vdc only-lighting for hours on end, days at a time, for the interior work (plus the 12vdc stereo), and I had it on while putting in the curtain rods and mattress covering. I plugged in the outside power line to run the A/C and the 110vac lighting, so I figured I might as well charge the battery. Turned on the charger and the inverter (to monitor amperage), I selected AGM and slow charge NOTE: After re-reading the Schumacher operations manual (online, lost my copy), I discovered why I put a post-it next to my XCS-15 charger saying "select turtle". The manual states that the charger gives 3 amperage settings> maintain (2 amps), slow ("turtle"-6 amps), and fast ("hare"-15 amps). And it plainly states that the maintain setting should not be selected for AGM/deep cycle batteries, because it will decrease their capacity over time. That's why my post-it had the "turtle" setting.. Then I settled back to watch the LED displays on both, starting at 49% charge and 12.6vdc battery voltage. The figure both slowly began to climb, gradually, as the A/C hummed along, cycling on and off. (This exposed another problem to me: the charger and inverter are inside the cabin, they are both producing heat, the heat is fighting the A/C, and when the A/C compressor cycles off, the interior heat climbs again, with the addition of my body heat the humidity-as measured on a temp/humidity gauge now installed in the cabin-would rise from 48% to 98% in minutes> conclusion: sealed as tight as the TTT is, I should not [a] run the charger and the A/C simultaneously,[b] if the A/C isn't running, always crack a window or vent!) Ok, back to the charging experiment: when the charging % reached 95%, and the inverter showed 14.5vdc, the inverter suddenly showed "hi-b", and sounded the overvoltage alarm. Again, I switched the inverter off and on again, to momentarily glimpse a battery voltage (input) reading: 15.1vdc. I let the charger continue, and at 96% I turned the inverter on again (this time it read 14.3vdc). I can only assume that the charger is either sending a desulfation pulse as the battery is nearing full charge status, or it and the inverter shouldn't be sharing the same circuit at the same time. I'll have to put a voltage meter in-line to get the true story.

[working on it]

UPDATE After the previous round of discussion about pros & cons of certain batteries and chargers, I was convinced not to trust my charger to be automatic, and to monitor all charging activity closely. Well, that was a month ago, and I've not charged it since (only used the 12vdc LED overhead cabin lights, sporadically). After completing various mods today, I figured it was about time to top up the Optima Yellowtop. I plugged in the Schumacher charger, selected AGM and medium charge (turtle), and the charger automatically came on...as 6 volt. I quickly reset everything, and repeated the start up steps; same 6 volt charge status. I went around to the battery bay, connected my multi-meter, and it showed only 7.3vdc. What happened? The last time I posted about my battery system, it sat at 13.2vdc after charging, and 12.8vdc a day later. Haven't checked it since. I don't understand how a fully charged battery could drop so low, indicating dead cells to me. This is my second bad ownership experience of non-wet cell batteries (Gel, AGM), and I am leaning towards getting the old technology back! Right now, I have the battery on a Century wheel charger, at 2amps/12vdc, just to see what happens. I am wondering if the battery was bad to start, as it has always run down faster than any lead-acid that I've used before? Anyone? Bruce? What do you guys think?

[Dale M.]

For the last few years after OPTIMA moved its manufacturing to Mexico, its had some real sever problems with bad cells... It's not what it used to be....

IF you battery was down to 7.x something volts, seems to me its really bad, or you actually left something on and drained it really bad....Might want to consider master disconnect switch...

I have some brand X (maybe its a EXIDE) AGM battery in my play car, since about 2003 and its still strong... So AGM batteries are not a problem per se... I even throw cheapo 6/12, 10 amp charger on it just like any flooded cell battery and doesn't seem to be a problem.... I think there is a little to much concern about charge rates of chargers and what knot's.... IF you think of battery as in vehicle with its charge system a battery (YES AGM) will pull as much current as it can from alternator/generator till its satisfied internally (chemical balance) it has absorbed all the energy it can and is up to "voltage".. Smart chargers may not be so smart.... IF you want to limit amperage battery can draw from "standard" charger put a standard brake lamp bulb (1157) in series with charge lead from charger... When lamp goes out, battery is at full charge (no current flow to light lamp)...

Might also consider changing brands if you want to stay with AGM battery....ODYSSEY Brand seems to still rate among the best.... See a lot of them in race cars because of their smaller size compared to their output...

http://www.odysseybattery.com/

Dale

[working on it]

Right now, I have the battery on a Century wheel charger, at 2amps/12vdc, just to see what happens.

Thanks Dale, for your input; I haven't completely given up on the Optima yet. Last night, as I posted, I charged it for 1.25 hours @ 2 amps. It read 11.3vdc when I turned the charger off. This evening, before I started the next round of trickle charging, it read 10.75vdc. I don't know if it will ever get back to 12+vdc again (AGM's are an unknown to me). I've brought many "dead" wet cell batteries back to life with a staggered trickle charge (charge, rest, charge), in fact the cheap-o battery in my 2500HD was "dead" twice before, and it's reliable now (kept on float charger). What I don't understand is how such a low reading can get better, if one or more cells are dead? at 2 volts (nominal) per cell, the 12 volt plateau should never be attainable then. If I'm not successful in re-charging this Optima, I think I'll go back to old-school types that I am used to. Between my gel racing battery failure, and the Optima problem, I may have lost $450. That would buy several wet batteries, and throw in a "trustworthy" charger to boot.

[bdosborn]

One of the cool things you pay extra for in an AGM battery is its low self discharge rate. So yeah, it shouldn't self discharge that low in just a month or so. Are you sure you don't have a parasitic load somewhere? Can you put an amp meter on it and see if there's a draw? Otherwise, I'd charge it up, take it in to the battery shop and have it tested to see if it's toast.

Bruce

[working on it]

One of the cool things you pay extra for in an AGM battery is its low self discharge rate. So yeah, it shouldn't self discharge that low in just a month or so. Are you sure you don't have a parasitic load somewhere? Can you put an amp meter on it and see if there's a draw? Otherwise, I'd charge it up, take it in to the battery shop and have it tested to see if it's toast.

Bruce

The only item hooked up inline with the battery, not switched, is the inverter. I'm using its positive and negative posts as the entry point into my power panel. Do you think the inverter may be sapping power, even when off? It's a Schumacher inverter (I may be getting suspicious of the brand, also). I've got a master cut-off after that point, but not before (I have another one, but didn't think I needed it). In any case, I'll put it directly after the battery now.