Electrical plans - Group review please

[BLTillson]

Ah yes, I missed the note in your schematic. Then the concern is whether one part of the switch breaks (opens contact) slightly before the other--maybe just a matter of milli-seconds--when you turn the switch, and how critical is that really to the charge controller? I don't know the answer to that. It might be worth a call to the charge controller manufacturer.

Maybe if I turn the switch really, really fast! That has been on my mind as well. I am not sure how to make the system foolproof without getting into delays and relays or introducing a huge margin of human error. If I put he solar on a separate disconnect switch I run the risk of just forgetting to turn the switches in the proper order. I will call China and see if I can talk to the manufacture can shed some light.

Also, I have changed the schematic to loop through the fuse box and pick up some protection.

Thanks for the great suggestions.

[tony.latham]

Maybe if I turn the switch really, really fast!

You're getting advice from a guy (Tom) that actually knows how electrons create a coherent beam of photons to produce a red beam that goes a long way. He knows stuff that few of us do.



Tony

[BLTillson]

Maybe if I turn the switch really, really fast!

You're getting advice from a guy (Tom) that actually knows how electrons create a coherent beam of photons to produce a red beam that goes a long way. He knows stuff that few of us do.



Tony

I am honored and will elevate his advice way above my febal discoveries or the collective and contradictory clamor that is the internet.

[BLTillson]

I have been melding all this advice (and melting my brain) working at getting it all correct on the schematic. This is my current iteration.

Main Electrical Current State 021023.png (103.03 KiB) Viewed 292 times

I am still working on the solar disconnect issue.

Maybe I need something like this!

DP-Drop Switch.png (64.5 KiB) Viewed 292 times

Kinda has the mad scientist feel.

Emmet.jpg (8.57 KiB) Viewed 292 times

[BLTillson]

Ah yes, I missed the note in your schematic. Then the concern is whether one part of the switch breaks (opens contact) slightly before the other--maybe just a matter of milli-seconds--when you turn the switch, and how critical is that really to the charge controller? I don't know the answer to that. It might be worth a call to the charge controller manufacturer.

I have been racking my brain on this. It occured to me that I could use DPDT switches to guarantee that the battery was always connected when the solar panels were disconnected. That being the warning.

Controller warning.png (35.5 KiB) Viewed 273 times

Then I thought, since the rotary switch I have is not a simple one to many switch, What harm would/could there be if the battery were always connected to the output of the solar controller? Then I could just use those poles to control the connection of the solar panels.

Rotary Switch.png (173.67 KiB) Viewed 273 times

[Tom&Shelly]

Then I thought, since the rotary switch I have is not a simple one to many switch, What harm would/could there be if the battery were always connected to the output of the solar controller? Then I could just use those poles to control the connection of the solar panels.

Rotary Switch.png

Well, there are folks on here who know lots more than I do about teardrop wiring. I believe it was one of them who told me it was okay to connect the solar controller output and converter output to the battery at the same time and leave them connected. In the event, that's what we did, and both the controller and converter are still working fine. It does make sense, since neither knows whether the voltage on that output line is from the other box or the battery.

Anyway, I'd do what you just said.

Oh, about calling China, I might be tempted to call a solar controller company with a US technical rep, and pretend you own their brand, just to see what they say.

Incidentally, as a community, we may all want to think about the stuff we use that was made in China (eg, those Aili meters--made by Hengshan, which I THINK is a mainland Chinese company), and begin thinking about alternatives. Just sayen...

Tom

[BLTillson]

Well, there are folks on here who know lots more than I do about teardrop wiring. I believe it was one of them who told me it was okay to connect the solar controller output and converter output to the battery at the same time and leave them connected. In the event, that's what we did, and both the controller and converter are still working fine. It does make sense, since neither knows whether the voltage on that output line is from the other box or the battery.

Anyway, I'd do what you just said.

From what I have learned and what I have been told that seems to be a great solution. Alos, with my battery disconnect switch the there is no danger of battery drainage when not it use. Are you saying that you have your converter and your solar controller feeding the battery simultaneously?

Oh, about calling China, I might be tempted to call a solar controller company with a US technical rep, and pretend you own their brand, just to see what they say.

Incidentally, as a community, we may all want to think about the stuff we use that was made in China (eg, those Aili meters--made by Hengshan, which I THINK is a mainland Chinese company), and begin thinking about alternatives. Just sayen...

It gets so hard to hunt down the actual manufacturer of any given item. Believe me I have tried! I have thought I was buying made in USA only to find MADE IN CHINA stamped on the part or in the manual. Perhaps that would be a great thread to start here: Really Not Made in China. I am willing to buy many other countries. I even bought a Made in USA E-Bike only to find out the motor was made in, you guessed it, China.

Thanks again for the responses and advice.

[Tom&Shelly]

Are you saying that you have your converter and your solar controller feeding the battery simultaneously?

Perhaps that would be a great thread to start here: Really Not Made in China. I am willing to buy many other countries. I even bought a Made in USA E-Bike only to find out the motor was made in, you guessed it, China.

Thanks again for the responses and advice.

Yes, we have the converter output and solar controller output both connected to the battery simultaneously. The controller also has a built in battery meter that is helpful reading the voltage across the battery (which would actually be coming from the converter, when we are connected to shore power.) I honestly don't remember whether we've ever been connected to shore power and had a solar panel plugged in simultaneously. I suspect I may have done it once or twice. it wouldn't be our normal operating mode, and I wouldn't do it long term because both the controller and converter have charge cycles (on the order of days) where they change the voltage slightly, as that's supposed to be better for our AGM battery. Wouldn't want them fighting each other.

We also connect the aux power from the tow vehicle alternator directly to the battery/converter output/solar controller output, so when we are towing, the vehicle always tries to charge the teardrop battery. I debated adding a switch there (like Tony's) but decided I'd eventually leave the switch in the wrong position and, after a six hour drive, find our battery was still low. Might shorten the life of our AGM battery doing it the way I did, but the last one died a premature death, evidently from mechanical failure, anyway.

Right now, we don't have a solar panel mounted on the tear, and when we camp, we take a folding panel with us and plug it into a jack under our tear. So no need for a switch there.

Incidentally, when we're not camping and in New Mexico, we leave the battery charging via a 100 watt solar panel on the roof of our garage (which has no shore power). When we're staying at my Mom's house in New York, for months at a time in the Summer, we plug into her power.

I think a thread on Chinese made products is a great idea...

Thank you!

Tom

[H.A.]

occured to me that I could use DPDT switches to guarantee that the battery was always connected when the solar panels were disconnected. That being the warning.

Fwiw,
At my equipment shed I keep my tractor plugged into a solar controller. The solar array is never disconnected but often I bring the tractor back in after dark.
To prevent a battery being "connected first" scenario, I have a 4Ah battery what's always connected to the solar controller.
The tractor simply plugs in parallel with that battery every time its parked.

[BLTillson]

occured to me that I could use DPDT switches to guarantee that the battery was always connected when the solar panels were disconnected. That being the warning.

Fwiw,
At my equipment shed I keep my tractor plugged into a solar controller. The solar array is never disconnected but often I bring the tractor back in after dark.
To prevent a battery being "connected first" scenario, I have a 4Ah battery what's always connected to the solar controller.
The tractor simply plugs in parallel with that battery every time its parked.

Thank you for that. We did come to the conclusion that I could just leave the solar controller connected to the battery (+). I would have a selector that disengages the panels while connecting the converter output simultaneously. Since the solar controller and the converter have staged charging cycles I am not going to have them connected to the battery at the same time charging. From my best understanding that just feels like I am going to introduce issues in charging and possibly abuse the batterie$.

I am working on the final schematic updates and will post then when we are at the end of this thread for the good of all future teardrop builders.

[tony.latham]

abuse the batterie$.

Speaking of batteries... It just dawned on me, you're planning on two batteries. What type and why two?

Tony

[BLTillson]

abuse the batterie$.

Speaking of batteries... It just dawned on me, you're planning on two batteries. What type and why two?

Tony

Greetings and good morning.

AGM, 75Ah. Two for more battery life, if needed.

Battery.jpg (45.84 KiB) Viewed 207 times

I am starting out with one and see how that works for maintaining power. If I need it I can add another. I have already setup the tongue box to accept another. If I don't need the second battery I can store jumper cables and such on the other side.

Tongue Box Close.jpg (177.03 KiB) Viewed 207 times

[tony.latham]

AGM, 75Ah

That's the same size battery I'm running, and it's more than enough juice for us if we camp in the deep timber without sunshine for four or five nights.



With sunshine, we can go forever.



:thumbs-up:

Tony

[BLTillson]

AGM, 75Ah

That's the same size battery I'm running, and it's more than enough juice for us if we camp in the deep timber without sunshine for four or five nights.

With sunshine, we can go forever.

Tony

From the green to the gold. That's fantastic. Can't wait!

[featherliteCT1]

Battery life is reduced at higher temperatures .. for every 15 degrees F over 77, battery life is cut in half. This holds true for ANY type of lead-acid battery, whether sealed, Gel, AGM, industrial or whatever.

https://www.intercel.eu/frequently-aske ... batteries/

So, at 92F, the battery life is halved.

In direct sun, when ambient temperature is 90F, the inside of my well insulated trailer routinely rises to 110F. So, at 110F, battery life would be about 25%.

Consequently, when not in use, I store my batteries in conditioned space.