Cargo Trailer Conversions .. New Generation RVs

[GPW]

Guys (and ladies) , owning a commercial TT and reading several RV forums ... I constantly hear of PROBLEMS ... Bad roofs, caulking , leaks , rotting ,high maintenance, aside from the usual assortment of complaints about breaking appliances and shoddy construction practices.. not to mention dealers who charge totally ridiculous labor rates, and parts which seem to be priced much higher than similar products ... and a total depreciation of value that out paces anything else on the market .. It appears the traditional RV industry is in BIG TROUBLE ...

Reading about CargoTrailer Conversions , I hear none of these problems ... Just Happy campers having a really good time doing what they enjoy !!!
With the discontent in the RV market growing exponentially , and the fast growing popularity of Cargo Trailers (there sure are a lot of them around here) it would seem only Logical that these would be the campers to own...especially in this economy , where a Deluxe CT conversion might cost a third of what a commercial " RV would cost ... is made to live outside with no problems , and there are no Greedy RV dealers involved...

PLUS the obvious benefit of lighter weight and greater cargo carrying ability ...

Some of the CT conversions we've seen here are so NICE and rival the Luxury of any commercial unit ... Much more practical , less expensive ... The "thinking man's " trailer ... Expecting to see many more of these soon ... replacing the junk that the RV factories sell ...

Anybody else feel this way , or should i just have more coffee...

[myoung]

Do any folks doing CT conversions commercially have web sites? If so, perhaps you could compile a list for us.

[GPW]

Mike , I have no idea !!! Might be a good little business doing conversions for those who cannot or will not do their own... ?? I guess the cargo trailer manufacturers/ OEM offer a good degree of "custom" options ...

[dudleydoright]

GPW,

enjoy your coffee, but i think you are right, individuals build quality and build what they need to have for them, not a bunch of stuff they don't need for their trailer, rv manufacturers build to make money regardless of the quality. I think most c/t converting companies would do the same.

regards,

[GPW]

DDR, never gave a thought to anyone else doing the conversions... it's so simple , as seen so many times here, amateurs (sorry) getting really Nice results ... and not installing a lot of useless (heavy) cosmetic junk in it ...

[kstephenson]

I agree......those rv dealers make a killing on people. I love my cargo conversion camper. And if something breaks on it ....I can fix it...cause I built it. My air conditioning cost me 92 dollars....so if it broke....no big expense to replace
Happy Camping

[Shadow Catcher]

GPW
One of the things I have learned in the process of being involved in the process of building our MM is the appreciation of those RV manufacturers that do make the effort to produce a quality product.
As you point out the quality on most is some place between sad to terrible. My observation is that they are for the most part producing using 30+ year old technology and materials and the one year warranty tells the story. The problem I see with the CT's is that for the most part you have a shell that is no more advanced, relying on truck body construction, but stuck together better. Were I to go for a CT I would go with a Silver Sport (Wells Cargo all aluminum).

[GPW]

SC, good point ... even a really Nice AL CT is still waaaaay cheaper than even a modest lightweight (?) RV TT ... Much more durable ... I'm kinda' thinking as CTs become more popular , the manufacturers might develop the concept further ... I see Jayco already has a CT conversion ish' V nose thing ... but probably loaded with the same heavy useless(expensive) RV gear they stuff in their other trailers.. and is like $22K + I just Can't see their pricing ... but hopefully it has a good metal roof ... unlike the very flimsy thin plywood roofs on their other "RV" trailers..

[jimqpublic]

Some of the RV companies have a fair piece of engineering in their designs. One thing that I've found by spending WAY too much time surfing the internet for all things RV is that there is a reason for many of the design directions.

Trailers used to have style, with groovy curved shapes. Now they are mostly flat. Low ride height and/or dropped standing areas were common, now they are mostly flat floor. Why?

Many reasons. Four that come to mind are:
-Modern Awnings. These things are very handy. Takes just a minute to deploy or stow. Durable, easy to mount, good quality. The problem is that you need a long, straight roof edge if you want a long awning.
-Holding tanks. Grey and black water holding tanks mounted underfloor allow them to be centered and close to the axles for good weight distribution. Plus they're easy to install and in the event of a failure you don't have sh%& flowing inside the trailer. Unfortunately to get ground clearance you need the floor at least 20" off the ground. The longer the trailer, the more clearance needed.
-Panelized construction methods. FRP skin, Luan, rigid foam, interior paneling is a pretty common wall sandwich. Build them in a stack with a press or vacuum and they bond well. This only works with flat panels (or custom bucks for each curved panel type).
-Standardized appliances and cabinets work great in a square trailer.


And of course price point. People want the biggest trailer for the price. Oddly the same people would pay more for a small luxury car than a base-model van, but don't think the same about their RV's.

One other thing to consider is that all the RV-approved appliances are very expensive. If you add up the price of RV-specific fridge, stove, water heater, furnace, power converter, water pump, water tanks, holding tanks, toilet, and windows it becomes obvious that it's hard to have "all the conveniences" without spending a lot of coin.

[GPW]

Jim , I see your points ... well taken ... My real beef is with all that , is :
The roof on my RV TT is extremely THIN , and requires constant maintenance and inspections, and annual re-caulking (1200USD at the RV dealer, mandatory to preserve the two year warranty. ) ... Just a Thin Metal roof would have been nice ....
Panelized construction ..... so that's what's de-laminating on mine ...
Expensive RV appliances don't last ... and are 10 X as much to replace , especially at an RV dealer ... Even though mine are un used , they're rusting away .... not even a simple coating on the parts to prevent this ...

We spent a lot of coin and ended up with Big repair bills , Roof / siding? window problems , and a TT worth LESS than we owe on it after only 3 years ... and it's only been towed once ...

NOT really a convenience at all ... I could have had all the conveniences at a third of the price on a CT unit that was designed to live outside in the first place...

My wife and I asked my RV dealer many times , before the sale , "will this be OK living outside in my driveway ???" He assured me everything would be fine and laughingly pointed to all the other trailers on his lot ...
and he never mentioned the mandatory re-caulking bit... That was in the "fine print" in the manual ... Just for two caulk jobs , i could have bought a Nice cargo trailer ...

Now I know there are some good makers out there...somewhere... Mine isn't one of them .... not for my TT anyway and the factory was never any help unless it involved spending thousands of dollars at the dealers .. Other readers with similar TTs feel the same way and report similar problems ...

[myoung]

Hearing these tales of woe make me appreciate our Airstream even more. Just a defective converter replaced under warranty in 5 years and about 50,000 miles. Guess we are among the lucky ones.

[jimqpublic]

I may have come across a bit too sympathetic to the RV makers.

I agree on most counts. Of course if you don't like the high prices for RV parts, just head over to the yacht supply store...


I was trying to give some of them credit for better designs than the run of the mill. I will say that when we were shopping for a trailer in 2001 it was amazing how most of the low-end RV's were designed and put together. My wife noted that the interior styling was pure 1970's. There seemed to be no concept of actually using the storage provided. Everything was jammed together with staples.

The biggest sin seemed to be that they hated to leave any open floor space. I think that's part of why a lot of people started buying toy haulers even if they didn't have dirt bikes- that you have a lot of open space to use as you see fit.

Back to cargo trailers. They are designed to sit outdoors for years on end. With one-piece roofs overlapping the siding, you aren't relying on caulking to keep it dry inside. Done right, a conversion looks darn good. So go for it.

[vtx1029]

Only problem I see in doing a conversion is insuring it for what its worth. I've been going thru that now. Our trailer got hail damage and there is no kelly blue book for CT's add in the time and $$ you spent converting it that you may never get back

[GPW]

VTX .... a small limb unleashed in a storm punched 10 finger size holes in my very thin TT roof .. The RV dealer charged my Insurance $5000 to fix it ... (RIDICULOUS!!! for the work performed) He just put a new piece of plywood over the roof ... over the old holes ... Insurance paid for it ... For that kind of money I could have bought a swell CT and converted it .... and I doubt those limbs would damage a CT very much ...

Too bad Insurance companies run this country ... the Old
Protection racket
.... and as Katrina proved, they have many ways to wiggle out of paying you ...
We must all learn to be responsible for ourselves...

[Shadow Catcher]

jimqpublic I understand what you are saying concerning constraints of RV manufacturers i.e. flat sides etc. but contrast that with what is produced by the Ausies i.e. www.bushtracker.com and Europeans but also understand that this comes at a big price difference. Just looking at the components that go into trailers i.e. Eberspächer diesel heaters at over $1000 how many in the US are willing to pay for that extra quality.
At one of the RV shows I was the only one looking to see what the weight of the trailer and how it was constructed, and even how things like the drawers were made. I am sure that there are discerning consumers but they appear to be few and far between but those that are are buying trailers like the Airstream or those made by Forest River.
one of the things that I'm going to be running up against in insuring our MM will be that its replacement cost will be a great deal more than what I will be paying for. I intend to very thoroughly document with pictures and construction drawings exactly what is there.