Teardrops n Tiny Travel Trailers

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:29 am**

Ive read much more about converting leaf to torsion, but yeah.. Does anyone have knowledge about converting a cargo from torsion to leaf?

I imagine they build the frame differently between the two? Or do they just add a few structural members for the torsion axle to bolt to and the frame rails are in the correct same place as the leaf spring frame?

This is the trailer in question..
https://bn.craigslist.org/tro/d/haulmar ... 10503.html

Thanks!

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 6:18 am**

rebar, Howdy;

I'd contact the maker;
http://haulmark.com/contact-us
Can't think of anyone that would know any more.
They might want to know year and model/size.

hank

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 6:55 am**

It may be as simple as a C channel to hold the springs. Bolt the C channel with the springs/axle to the frame.

The trailer will be higher with leaf springs.

Ad says needs wheel bearing. The spindle may be damaged by the bad bearing rendering the axle unusable. Maybe that is why the question?

Tt

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 7:36 am**

Seems like a fair bit of work to swap the axles from torsion to leaf. I ordered leaf from the factory over torsion, to gain 4" ground clearance.
Here's a kit to lift a factory installed torsion axle set. You get the benefit of torsion suspension, and some more ground clearance that you are after too. Seems a pretty straightforward install.
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f437/dexter-torsion-axle-lift-kit-102393.html

a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=7QVstjocHps

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 7:49 am**

some of the better torsion bar axles employ replacable spindles

they are simply a taper fit unit that is nutted on the inside of the arm

if on a tandem i'd just remove the wheel n tyre and drag it home for replacement of the spindle or complete refit w/ leaf spring assembly

if replacing w/ leaf springs i'd look at the way boat trailer spring assemblies are made for being able to move the assembly fore n aft for proper balance

QUITE SIMPLE

you can see in this pic of the port side(fwd to the left) the black angle iron brackets that the spring perches are welded to is bolted to the galvanized frame and the leaf springs are hung from them

: fullsizeoutput_f7e.jpeg (97.43 KiB) Viewed 6282 times

i made this assembly in 1991 and other than repacing the axle last year w/ an EZ-LUBE(lubes the bearings thru the spindle) unit it is still going strong

did the same thing(replaced torsion w/ leaf) on an old Starcraft tent camper to gain ground clearance for back country camping

first order of inspection of proposed trailer would be to crawl under it to see if the spindles are bolted thru or welded into the trailing arm

here's a pic of what i am thinking you might find

: Unknown.jpeg (5.87 KiB) Viewed 6282 times

now you have options

¿ replace a spindle ?

or ¿ replace a set of tandem axles ?

i'm thinking a spindle is about $75 - $80 ±

a set of axles would be several $100's...

just my 2¢ worth this morning

sw

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:18 am**

Tomterrific wrote:It may be as simple as a C channel to hold the springs. Bolt the C channel with the springs/axle to the frame.

The trailer will be higher with leaf springs.

Ad says needs wheel bearing. The spindle may be damaged by the bad bearing rendering the axle unusable. Maybe that is why the question?

Tt

No.. Id rather have leaf springs because I can install heavier axles on lighter springs.

NO David! wrote:Seems like a fair bit of work to swap the axles from torsion to leaf. I ordered leaf from the factory over torsion, to gain 4" ground clearance.
Here's a kit to lift a factory installed torsion axle set. You get the benefit of torsion suspension, and some more ground clearance that you are after too. Seems a pretty straightforward install.
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f437/dexter-torsion-axle-lift-kit-102393.html

a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=7QVstjocHps

Yeah I built the same thing for my old featherlite..

swoody126 wrote:Did the same thing(replaced torsion w/ leaf) on an old Starcraft tent camper to gain ground clearance for back country camping

I want to do the same thing. Gain clearance and replace both axles with 5200 lb axles 8 x 6.5 lugs.

The owner says he towed it across town without the rear wheels, but I'm wondering if I can tow it 180 miles home..

And then the price, with no ramp door... lol

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:20 am**

rebar wrote:Ive read much more about converting leaf to torsion, but yeah.. Does anyone have knowledge about converting a cargo from torsion to leaf?

I imagine they build the frame differently between the two? Or do they just add a few structural members for the torsion axle to bolt to and the frame rails are in the correct same place as the leaf spring frame?

This is the trailer in question..
https://bn.craigslist.org/tro/d/haulmar ... 10503.html

Thanks!

I've got four trailers. Two with torsion axles and two with springs. The torsion axles ride much better than the bouncing springs (both loaded and light). So my question is, why?

Tony

Posted: **Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:03 am**

If you want a fast way to convert to a leaf spring suspension, using std. length 25 1/4" spacing leaf springs (available at just about anywhere that trailer suspension parts are sold), and a heavy-duty axle, then you could remove your torsion assembly, and just bolt-on a set of these, found at https://www.sturdybuiltonline.com/Boat-Trailer-Leaf-Spring-Slider-Single-Axle-PAIR-For-25-14-Double-Eye-Springs_p_1415.html

: bolt-on spring hanger assemblies (sturdybuiltonline.com).JPG (61.1 KiB) Viewed 6228 times

these pre-welded hanger assemblies would've been ideal for my application

I made my own assemblies from 1/4" angle + 3/16" flat bar stock, and welded/bolted them on to my existing frame. http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=58985 I chose a 3500 lb axle, and used 3000 lb springs (per pair), anticipating a trailer weight above 2k lbs. These springs worked out just right for me, combined with my spring-dampening bumpstops, and in conjunction with larger LT tires that I bought later. But, the beauty of using a standard-sized leaf spring is that I could replace the current set with lighter or heavier rated springs for around $60-70 (at Northern Tool or E-trailer, for instance) in a hurry, if needed.

Though I spent considerably more time and money (buying 2 welders and working many hours in fabricating--it was my first from-scratch welding project) than if I had bought these, it was worth it just to make it myself. But, I was also strengthening my frame at the same time...if your frame is strong/intact, then the bolt-on assembly would be perfect for you to use, IMHO.

: completed 3500 lb Dexter axle assembly.jpg (165.88 KiB) Viewed 6228 times

Posted: **Thu Oct 18, 2018 6:19 am**

tony.latham wrote: The torsion axles ride much better than the bouncing springs (both loaded and light). So my question is, why?

Tony

Leaf is more reliable for off road and you can mix and match springs and axles and upgrade modify later. Ive read some discussions inducing a few successful off road trailer builders who said they tried torsion, but leaf was less likely to fail. But then went independent.

working on it wrote:I made my own assemblies from 1/4" angle + 3/16" flat bar stock, and welded/bolted them on to my existing frame.
Though I spent considerably more time and money (buying 2 welders and working many hours in fabricating--it was my first from-scratch welding project) than if I had bought these, it was worth it just to make it myself. But, I was also strengthening my frame at the same time...if your frame is strong/intact, then the bolt-on assembly would be perfect for you to use, IMHO.
completed 3500 lb Dexter axle assembly.jpg

Thanks and nice work you've done there..

Problem with a tandem off road is your limited to 25" leafs and the balance bars do little for equalization. If the trailer was 16' Id be tempted to convert it to single axle (longer leafs) but not 20'

The owner of the trailer said the door was 6.5' tall.. Looking at the picture I wonder though..

Posted: **Thu Oct 18, 2018 6:36 am**

Is there really that much difference in the frames for torsion and spring mount? I would think a frame would have to be just as strong(if not stronger) for torsion axle mounts versus spring. Shouldn't you be able to just weld some spring hangers on?

Posted: **Thu Oct 18, 2018 6:50 am**

My budget was tight, but I became frustrated looking at used trailers, priced nearly what I could get a new trailer for. Used ones needing rehab, by the time I added parts, even with my free labor, I usually exceeded the cost of a new one. When I found a dealer willing to process a custom order at a decent price,I got exactly what I wanted for about $ 500-$1,000 more than the used market pricing.

Example: Maybe these guys could order you one like this, with leaf spring axles installed already, (might cost a bit less than torsion). While you're at it, see what it costs to get two big slider windows, and an RV door. You may be surprised. Then you just finish the inside to suit you. This 8.5 x 16 has 2 x 5,200 lb axles.
https://www.i80trailers.com/2018-h-h-trailers-8x16-cargo-white-flat-top-v-nose-tandem-5-0teg|sOd.html

Another option, this 7x18 has 2 x 3,500 lb axles. This looks like the kind of shop that might be able to cut you a deal on a slight custom order.
https://www.snappystrailers.com/2019-h-and-h-trailer-7x18-tandem-flat-top-hh-vnose-7k-cargo-92Eg|Hff.html

FWIW, the 8.5 wide does create mirror issues on the tow rig, fenders intrude into the interior space, etc. My 7 x 16 tandem is way overbuilt for my use, I'll probably never get enough stuff in there to approach the 7,000LB rating. I do really enjoy the benefits of the tandem ride, especially on the occasional forest service road. Nice to have the "extra" tires if I lose one, also I can drive one axle up on a ramp, and change the other one. Ive considered adding one of the aftermarket shackle kits with equalizer "shock" bushings too.

Edit: Information overload...
http://www.hhtrailer.com/files/3215/2709/0173/HH-CargoOptions_0118.pdf

Anyhow, just wanting to toss out the idea. Good Luck either way.

Posted: **Thu Oct 18, 2018 6:58 am**

That Sturdybuiltonline.com website also has a kit for tandem axle bolt-on hangers, but it probably wouldn't be truly off-road rated. But, if you have the money to do so, and really want to take a tandem axle trailer off-road, then perhaps a Timbren Silent Ride tandem https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Suspension/Timbren/TSR7000T04.html
Timbren silent ride tandem.JPG (73.45 KiB) Viewed 6142 times

will be what you need? More expensive to do than a leaf spring set-up, and replacement parts wouldn't be as readily-available as leaf spring parts are, but like other Timbren pieces, would be tough enough for off-road. Especially since you could utilize complete axles (like my 3500 lb Dexter, w/brakes) matched to the Timbren bolt-on "walking-beam" tandem hanger set.

Posted: **Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:32 am**

Leaf is more reliable for off road and you can mix and match springs and axles and upgrade modify later. Ive read some discussions inducing a few successful off road trailer builders who said they tried torsion, but leaf was less likely to fail. But then went independent.

The Army apparently disagrees with the reliability argument. All new U.S. Army "utility" trailers are built with Dexter Torflex torsion axles.

I've driven hundreds (thousands?) of miles on rough roads with my torsion axle without a hiccup. (Off-road? What does that really mean? Off the pavement? Dirt roads? Two-tracks? Or running through the cactus?)

There are some folks that weld torsion axles directly onto the chassis instead of welding on a bracket and then bolting to the bracket. And that has a good chance of causing the torsion part of the axle to fail prematurely.

I was going to go with Timbren on my next build but getting them correctly adjusted is apparently finicky and I don't want to replace tires every 20-30,000 miles.

Tony

Posted: **Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:41 pm**

tony.latham wrote:
Leaf is more reliable for off road and you can mix and match springs and axles and upgrade modify later. Ive read some discussions inducing a few successful off road trailer builders who said they tried torsion, but leaf was less likely to fail. But then went independent.

The Army apparently disagrees with the reliability argument. All new U.S. Army "utility" trailers are built with Dexter Torflex torsion axles.

There's a lot of older discussion about the two options over on ExPo, including some good threads on custom and homebuilt independent suspensions.

What I took away from reading all of them was that Timbrens are good but expensive and independent suspension requires a lot of skill and time to get right and parts...well you have to build them.

I think in off road settings the advantage to springs is that you can cobble together a repair almost anywhere in the world with parts from other vehicles whereas a failed torsion axle in certain parts of the world might mean you need to swap out for a spring axle.

If I recall correctly Martyn from http://adventuretrailers.com/trailers/teardrop/ said that they had tested dexter torsion axles and that they failed when dust got into the axle housing and abraded the rubber cords causing them to fail.

Posted: **Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:50 pm**

Id just weld on some hangers and bolt your springs in.

Here's a good article on the different stresses placed on the frame from the two different axle styles:
https://mechanicalelements.com/trailer-axle-springs-torsion-axle/

Teardrops n Tiny Travel Trailers

Converting torsion to leaf?

Converting torsion to leaf?

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