Knock off airstream build

[Hillmann]

Martin,
She's the girlfriend, so no need to obey her yet. (hope she never reads that)

I clicked on your profile and found a few pictures of you build in progress, but where would I look to see the finished product?

Looking at the pictures of your build it looks like you built your framing to very specifically define where the edges of the skin materiel will end up. On mine the frame on the 3 dimensional curves is only there to give a general idea of the curve and once the skin is on I will put laminated "beams" in place in the front corners that follow the curve that the skin makes to add a bit of extra strength.

After playing with the curves last night I decided I will use one piece of hardboard on the roof for extra rigidity and to hide my uneven cuts on the rafters and one piece on the bottom 32 inches of the front of the trailer to add extra strength in case a rock get kicked up into it. Then the whole trailer will be skinned in unpainted aluminum coilstock using this method http://serroscottycamperenthusiasts.com ... gfinal.pdf for the lower 32 inches and the majority of the roof and then the front and rear 3d curves will be strips of 6 inch wide aluminum riveted together like the wood is in my last photo with my model showing of the camper.

Once the skin is on I will then either have insulation sprayed in or use styrofoam and great stuff to insulate it. For windows I plan to build Wiley windows viewtopic.php?f=2&t=51721

I plan to put a 6 inch drop floor in the trailer so I will end up with 5'10" headroom which I was planing on 6" but somewhere I lost two inches.

I also plan to make it removable from the trailer so I can use it as an iceshack and so I can still have a flatbed trailer. Also I plan on using it for setting up my laser engraving equipment when I go to craftshows. And many times when you set up at a craftshow they give you a 10'x10' foot spot and not one inch more so the body of the camper is 9'8" and the tongue is removable by pulling 4 pins so I will be able to fit in a ten foot spot.

I haven't decided how I am going to hinge the rear cargo door yet, No matter how I hinge it I can see it being a problem in some situations.

I plan to skin the inside with 1/8 inch door skins with a couch that folds into a 3" wide bed in front and a table/seats/bed in the back. The table would be mounted on the rear cargo door so when the table is removed the door can be opened and I will have a 4 foot wide isle way in the center of the trailer that I can us to haul cargo with. Both ends will also have overhead cabinets. On the drivers side I plan to build a small closet/dresser and counter top. I think that the furniture and cabinets will act as bulkheads and add a lot of rigidity to the camper shell.

When it comes to removing the camper shell from the trailer that should be very easy. Here is the plan
Unbolt the shell from the trailer. Lower the tongue of the trailer to the ground so the back of the trailer goes up. Put blocks under the rear corners of the camper shell. Lift up on the tongue of the trailer so the front of the camper shell is about 8 inches higher then it would be when the trailer sits level. Block up the front of the camper shell. Roll trailer out from under camper shell. Then mount the snow skies under the camper before lowering it off its blocks.

[Hillmann]

Also with the camper shell being removable, if I can find a cheap enough pontoon or a pair of float I would think about putting the camper shell on the pontoon so I would then have a house boat as well.

[Martinup]

Hilmann:

My build is called, " The round about" . . . probably page 2 or 3 of the builds section.
I haven't gotten much done lately so I haven’t posted much until I have some real progress to show. Work and cleaning and painting my new shop space has taken me away so I have only been back on my build for the last week

Here is good explanatory pic to help you out and get your neurons firing. I had thought of a similar thoughts about the trailer boat concept like you. Your specific Idea is much better by not having the frame assembly immersed in water . . . you can inter change things and build separate pieces. Cool


Sorry for poor picture but you can see, " Two of 4 Body Jacks" , and One of 4 Frame Scissor Jacks . Our first build will be, " A one use trailer."

LQQk into the longest travel tongue jacks or maybe even modify some " Heavy duty" bolt on, " Truck camper jacks". You'll need the long travel distance to get the body clear of all the trailer frame assembly.

Think carefully about perhaps a Light but strong, "Body Base "; rectangular steel framework to help take the twisting . . . ( bugering up your door swinging & latching properly) ; that will inevitably be there with un even ground . . . SUCH as boat ramps etc. Four independent jacks will accommodate the uneven ground and also let you safely raise and lower your body with ease by yourself. They can also be completely removable leaving only the mounting plates.

Flat heavier gauge tin strips at key framing point loads will tie things super tightly together so they can never come apart. Sort of like how they earthquake proof house framing.

I like your ideas and suggest you plan and incorporate them into your Body framing now. At this stage it is still easy do

Your idea of raising and lowering your frame is easily done if done right. Even using my system took a bit of time as I framed the body tight to fit snuggly down and over the frame to skirt it . . . later I will complete a rounded and flat underbelly.

I would be cussing and struggling the way you described getting the body on and off. It sounds easier than doing it.

Stay tuned I have some interesting ideas for our build and enjoy showing when I have pictures to show and explain it better.

Cheers for now . . . good stuff.

Martin

[Martinup]

Hillmann:

Check out the gear hinge under parts etc.

https://www.socalteardrops.com:444/contact.php

Might work?

Also maybe

" sos hinges " Google it or try sos.com Lots of really neat hinges.

Martin

[Martinup]

[code][/quote][quote="Hillmann"]Martin,
After playing with the curves last night I decided I will use one piece of hardboard on the roof for extra rigidity and to hide my uneven cuts on the rafters and one piece on the bottom 32 inches of the front of the trailer to add extra strength in case a rock get kicked up into it. Then the whole trailer will be skinned in unpainted aluminum coilstock using this method http://serroscottycamperenthusiasts.com ... gfinal.pdf for the lower 32 inches and the majority of the roof and then the front and rear 3d curves will be strips of 6 inch wide aluminum riveted together like the wood is in my last photo with my model showing of the camper.

Once the skin is on I will then either have insulation sprayed in or use styrofoam and great stuff to insulate it. For windows I plan to build Wiley windows viewtopic.php?f=2&t=51721

I plan to put a 6 inch drop floor in the trailer so I will end up with 5'10" headroom which I was planning on 6" but somewhere I lost two inches. [code]

Hi Hillmann:

Just a couple ideas that have been kicking around inside my brain:

1) Framing:
I like the removable wood idea and the running of the horizontal studs inside skin of the Cruisset. Dig through those pictures to find it. I at one point thought of not using 1/8" plywood at all. If in leau of a sub skin like my build you were to use heavy gauge strapping . . . say 1 1/2" wide. You could run the strapping flat over some of the temp wood framing . . . just run screws from the inside pointing out , . . make them run right through and run long . . . then grind the points off flush to the outsideof the heavy gauge tin. Once the exterior cladding is all done you achieve a very strong structural integrity without all the weight. You could add a rock gaurd reinforcement to certain places outside . . . on the front.
The reason I bring this up is the whole warm side cold side thing ... R-2000 ... DRY ROT and WET ROT is tricky to overcome.

2) Insulation:
Using high R-value tarpaper covered roof sheet insulation was TIME CONSUMING, ( over a week of work ) and hard to fit in tightly to achieve. The cost of the sheets was only around $100 ish, but the time made it a mistake labor wise in the end.
Call around , ... find an insulated refrigerated Truck plant . . . make an appointment with the insulator to meet them there and spray yours at the same time. Even, " the Froth Packs ", suddenly economical, ( they are $800 ). You achieve the best R-value and.
Another thing try and seal what wood you frame with . . . use with a cheap alkyd paint to seal things at every layer and even in between things . . . In a few years the musty mold smell caused by wet / dry rot will make for one stinky trailer. Interior condensation from our breath is inevitable and air changes are important.

3) Don't overlook the, "body base", structural. Yours is a unique application.

4) I'm told there is a reaction . . . an oxidation or somthing like rust between aluminium and steel.

Cheers,

Martin

ps: see a really cool place to buy all sorts of goodies in trailers . . . lots & lots:

pss: I would like to know how others are doing that nice variation in clors to highlight previous peoples posts.

http://www.outwatercatalogs.com/home/index.cfm

[Hillmann]

I didn't get a chance to work on the camper last night but I did manage to make a sample piece of the siding from coilstock, I screwed it to the camper then put a piece of styrofoam bead board behind it between the studs. The foam being behind the aluminum makes it much more dent resistant than if I used fiberglass insulation between the studs. Even the girlfriend gave the siding her seal of approval. She thought I was just going to nail 20" wide strips of coilstock to the studs and call it good so she was pretty happy with the siding looking like "real" camper siding.

I don't think that spray foam would work for me, I think it would cause the siding to bulge out.

I will have to look into putting some type of re enforcing straps where the sidewalls and curves meet. And as far as keeping everything square so the doors don't bind when it is not sitting level, I haven't given that any thought. All the hardside iceshack I have built always ended up rigid enough that it wasn't a problem but with all the curves on this it may become an issue. I will have to think about adding corner braces on the doors.

As far as metal corrosion from dissimilar metals touching, I plan to use aluminum nails meant for fascia and soffit instillation. And another quick warning about aluminum corrosion, you cant have aluminum in contact with modern(within the last 10 years) treated lumber, it will get eaten away.

[Martinup]

HIllmann:

A helpful trick from the Truck box manufacturer was to use double sided sticky tape (comes in all different roll sizes and thicknesses).

Very useful when holding aluminum pieces in place nice and snug and the fore drilling for the rivet holes and provides a good seal. I've found once one piece of metal moves everything wrinkles and doesn't sit right.

Don't count the rivets until they are all in and the fat lady sings.

Off to my own build,

Martin

[Hillmann]

I will have to look into the the tape. I have no idea how I will get the the 3d curves laid out in the aluminum to rivet them. The two sided tape may be the answer to my problem.

I had planned on naming the trailer "Vagabond" I did some searching online and found that there was a camper made in the 60"s-70's and my camper looks more like them then and airstream, only turned around backwards. So now I think I may have to come up with a new name for mine.

[Martinup]

Hillmann:

I don't think that spray foam would work for me, I think it would cause the siding to bulge out.

How you deal with this is easy: If you staple in some plastic on the inside fairly well the foam guys will tell you, “that the foam will expand inward not outward". It sets up quickly and then pull out the plastic and use an electric planer ( sort of like a rasp ), to shave it back to flush with the interior walls studs . . .

The choices and methods of doing things is endless. Keep thinking it through and settle on what suits you best.

Martin

[Martinup]

Hillmann:
There are two ways you could lay out your curved star burst which you mentioned earlier.
Do an accurate drawing pretty much as explained below, onto a transparency and use an over head project like the ones in meetings and at schools. You could project this right onto a piece of plastic or perhaps right onto the trailer roof in darkness. I am not sure that projecting it right onto a curve surface might not give you a true read or representation. This last statement will make sense later

How to layout a curve starburst template to scale

1) Get a nice big piece of clear 10 mil plastic; say at least 10 feet square. Check your overall Dimensions on your trailer with a flexible 50' foot tape measure or something like a tailor’s cloth measuring tape.
You need find out what circumference and the radius you will need or want to use. Think about what that needs to be in relationship to your trailer. In other words at what point does your wall become truly vertical, (flat sides of your walls).

2) You need a large flat surface to tack down and hold the plastic so it won’t move for the next steps. Make sure it won’t move around.

3) With magic markers ( fine tipped Sharpy’s ) ; draw up an X axis line and a Y line. In other words a large cross in the middle of the plastic. Make it plus sign, or cross as big as the sheet of plastic. Take care that all of these lines are accurate. Use a good and true square. Make a long straight edge by ripping a piece of hard board 1 ½” wide. You might need to make it longer than 8’ feet long. This same straight edge will double as a compass to draw a large radius just under 8’. Drill two holes as an example 7’ a part. Drive a nail into one hole and put a pencil in the other end. Presto, a compass, to draw a circle.

4) With a good geometry set style compass . . . The clear plastic kind showing all either 180 degrees or 360 degrees in some cases. Try and buy or use a larger sized one; say 6 or 12” wide. This will be a lot easier to read and more accurate because the separation between the degrees will be greater. Anyway Place this on the centre of the X and Y axis you drew out.

5) Decide on the number of rays, ( layman’s term ), your star burst will be. Play around with what works for your needs. I would start with even increments. 15, 30, 45, 60, 75, 90, degrees . . . continue on right up to 180 degrees and mark dots at the outside of the plastic compass. Take away the compass and draw between the centre point through the dots and continue to the out most edges of the plastic.

6) The above increments in step five are your POTENTIAL CENTRE LINES of your star burst. I will try and explain this later.

7) Remove the piece of plastic from its tacked position. Somehow establish the center line on the width of your trailer flat wall. Then transfer this straight up to the roof of your wall. Place the plastic over the centre line on your trailer and align the Y axis line or mentioned in STEP # 3 on your plastic.

To close this long post I hope this is clear. Perhaps some of the cad literate guys can post an image. It is my opinion that your aluminum will lay much nicer if you make triangular arrays in your star bust with elliptical shaped lines on the two longer lines. How I know this is from practical experience on my own trailer build. If you don’t do this you will struggle to get it to lay well.


Just sharing what I have learned from my own build.

Good luck with your build,

Martin

[Hillmann]

A few pictures of the camper with the skin being put on. The coilstock I used was pretty thin and is dimpling like crazy which isn't what I wanted but no one else who has looked at it has commented yet so I am just going to go with it and see how it turns out.




As it sits I would guess it weighs a little over 300 pounds(the trailer weighs 200 pounds and my 10 year old son and I were able to lift the body on to the trailer by ourselves with no problem, so it can't be over 120 pounds). I hope to keep it under 500 pounds empty.


I also want to put the axle on the other side of the springs, that will allow me to drop the body of the trailer about 4 inches. The problem is there is a bracket in the way that will cause the trailer to bottom out. At this point I haven't looked close enough to see if I can cut the bracket without taking away strength from the trailer.

[Martinup]

Looks good Hillmann:

Check what angib found

viewtopic.php?f=52&t=52164

Martin

[wagondude]

notching that bracket for axle clearance is standard practice. Go for it.

[Hillmann]

Wagondude,
I know I have seen a thread in the past about notching that bracket but couldn't find it when I did a search. My concern is that on a teardrop the sidewall adds rigidity to the trailer but the way I am building it the cabin just sits on the trailer and doesn't add much if any strength to it. Although I won't notch it until next summer. Right now my goal is to get it insulated, two beds, and heat in it by the middle of November for deer hunting season.