Delamination Lamentation

[troubleScottie]

To the OP, sorry to hear of the damage.


So how should one prevent leakage?

For the bolt holes, you have introduced a clean hole through the floor. You have cut through the inner ply, the wood frame, and possibly another ply. This also includes a wood - wood transition/spacing/hole. There is then a transition from the wood to the metal framing. If you are going through a tube frame, two more transitions. If going into a metal plate or "L" frame, another transition.

It seems difficult to ensure any sealant placed into the hole will not be removed when the bolt goes through.

Do you pour in a sealant as you are placing the bolt?

Do you drill a bigger hole ? Would an 1/8", 1/16", 1/32" bigger reduce the gripping power of the bolt? If the bolt head is inside the cabin/on top, how would that be done. If the bolt head is in the bottom, what do you do about the shaft/nut in the cabin. Would you still get an issue of the bolt rubbing the side of the hole, removing the sealant.

Do you epoxy the hole -- literally filling it assuming the epoxy will permeate laterally into the wood, then re-drill

Do you just assume that the exterior grade ply glue, etc will prevent wicking?

Do you seal the bolt openings? Chalk will fail over time eg drying, vibration. Do you use a sealing type washer like a silicon/rubber/butyl based product? Between the wood layers?


The OP appears to state that the base is a plywood layer over a frame with no second plywood layer. Assuming the wood frame was not treated prior to assembly with the plywood, the entire edge meeting the plywood is a potential point of failure. Under coating could fail. Should one be treating the frame prior to assembly? Or is a good waterproof glue sufficient to seal this area?

Does frame flexing cause issues as the OP stated ? Is this a reason to build a stronger - less flexing frame? Or should the cabin/box "float" relative to the frame, so as to reduce flexing.

[GPW]

Bonnie , let us know if you need help , You know we’re anxious to help make it Better ...

[GPW]

“ Do you just assume that the exterior grade ply glue, etc will prevent wicking? “ Definitely NOT ...


OK, you asked for it .... The Plywood Rant ....AGAIN !!!

“ The real problem with plywood is the wood itself ... Just FYI, wood is made of many little Tubes all weakly glued together ... that’s how a tree feeds , through these tubes. And grows by adding more tubes . Water and nutrients travel from the ground to the leaves. Plywood is sheets of ”tubes” sliced off a log , Then glued together alternating grain sheets laid atop each other at 90degrees ... So while the sheets of tubes are glued together solidly , the tubes are still OPEN , allowing water intrusion , and subsequent swelling (soaked) and de-lamination... Since the log is sliced off an imperfect tree, grain violations , (ends of tubes) , can exist anywhere on the sheet ... hence a water entry ... In order to fully preserve the plywood , it’s Imperative to SEAL the Tubes ... !!! We found the Chuck Felton mixture of 75% Mineral Spirits and 25% Polyurethane varnish ,works well if applied in multiple coats to exclusion (won’t take any more /shiny ) . Being thin it really soaks well into the tubes by capillary action , same as plants ... If it is to be glued to another piece of wood , do that first , then soak it with the mixture ^ once the glue is thoroughly cured. However if the plywood is to be bent or curved, then the tension stresses on the skin of the outer curve tend to pull the “tubes" apart (stretched) , in which case the PMF ( poor man’s fiberglass) comes in handy to take the tension load and keep the plywood grain from coming apart (fabric outer skin does the work) .. We ( and our friends / acquaintances ) have tested this for many years now , and how we made these conclusions. “

In other words, it doesn’t matter what you use to glue the laminations together with , The TUBES ARE STILL OPEN !!! The Nature of the beast ... So you can see my new propensity towards board floors ... Tubes all going in one direction , easier to seal the tubes ... Best no tubes at all, still looking for the Perfect floor material ...

[bonnie]

TC, the tear won't be elevated on 2/4 after I get done. I pretty certain, if the whole frame had had support, this particular damage would not have happened.


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[bonnie]

Also, the new floor won't have any wood to rot. I will use stainless bolts and fender washers on top and lock nuts on bottom.


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[GPW]

QUOTE: “ I pretty certain, if the whole frame had had support, this particular damage would not have happened. “ .... Possibly , but if you notice this was not the original trailer we built the cabin for .... We decided to use this because it looked better than an old recycled boat trailer ,and had to adapt (crossbraces) to make it fit ... the door location was the problem , and the boat trailer was longer ... but ugly ...

[bonnie]

I had forgotten about that! I am almost ready to start the new floor!


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[KCStudly]

Once again displaying the repairable nature of a simply foamie.

You go Bonnie!

[GPW]

Bonnie , we saw KenW’s trailer and his floor was foam with FRP over it, no wood .... That’d been 10K miles with no problems ... Maybe we can get Ken to describe his floor construction again ...

This was one of the first Foamie trailers , a proof of concept , and although I did the best I could at the time , we’ve learned a LOT since then ...
Before removing the floor , I’d take a utility knife and cut through the reinforcing strips on the inside ... Then you could just carefully cut the whole foam cabin shell away from the floor with a reciprocating saw...

KC’s right , Foamies are pretty EASY to repair compared to everything else ... But best to make it right so we don’t have to ... We still Learn every day !!!

[KennethW]

Run a sander over the foam before gluing the canvas to get a good bond (if already done not a problem). If you canvas the top of the floor it will and strength. So the bond to the plastic liner panel will not have to be very strong.
Remember to let the canvas on the bottom run long to rap up the sides after you glue the top on.

[bonnie]

KenW, did you reinforce the bolt areas? Would glueing the fender washers be a good idea? 2nd question, did you run the FRP to the edge, or did you glue foam to foam?


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[bonnie]

I have a 9x12 drop cloth for the bottom. Would a 12" wrap be good, or overkill? Also, Glenn did you take any shots of how you wrapped the bottom?


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[bonnie]

And one last question, for the moment,
How long must the replied shell sit before I can use it? I plan to have the floor finished by this weekend. If I get the cabin remounted, do you think it will be good to go by Friday, the 10th?


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[bonnie]

Repaired. Sheesh, autocorrect.


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[GPW]

Just the shot of the bottom on page 2 ... Around 6" or so wrapped underneath should do it ... just make SURE the under wrapping canvas is THOROUGHLY and Completely saturated with glue ...
Still think a Drip Edge is now a necessity on any trailer ...