Monstaliner questions!

[Andrew Herrick]

Would you be able to ask them if it could be applied over canvas like in PMF?

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My thoughts on this (I haven't asked a representative yet): Maybe not so great an idea? Monstaliner, like all bedliner and similar coatings, is a plastic. It needs a rigid substrate or else the potential for fractures and dents skyrockets. Secondly, applying Monstaliner over canvas will almost assuredly leave voids between the canvas yarns, and all voids may possibly collect water. Thirdly, the canvas will soak up a lot of the Monstaliner, and at about $150 a gallon, it's not something you want to waste

I'm assuming you're interested in a canvas-covered foamie build? If so, I would think that fiberglassing the foam and then applying Monstaliner would be much wiser than trying to use canvas. That's not much more expensive than using high-quality canvas, but it'll make the shell much stronger and provide a better foundation for the Monstaliner.

But ... those are only my initial thoughts. We'll see what the rep says.

[Andrew Herrick]

Anyone try Line-X?

I only ask because I drive by their plant in Huntsville AL a lot, decided to look at the website, and I found they make a product that was originally targeted to bedliners but they're hawking for a whole bunch of other applications. Folks even coat their entire trucks in the stuff.

FWIW... http://linex.com/

For a chuckle, it's worth just going to the main site and regarding the Line-X-ed doughnut...

I spoke with a Line-X dealer in my area. It sounds like a great product. It's the industry standard, and for good reason. You can't go wrong with it. Before I found Monstaliner, it was my number one pick. But ...

You have to upgrade to Line-X Premium in order to get UV resistance. With Monstaliner, it's standard. And while Line-X may be stronger (better tensile strength, etc.), it's important to remember that we're putting this on a teardrop, not a truck - just about any bedliner is technically overkill in the strength department. What matters most, to me anyway, is adhesion, durability and UV resistance.

The dealer I spoke with quoted about $10 a square foot for regular Line-X. Depending on how much of the camper you have to tape off, it could be more or less. Anyways, assuming $10 a square foot, that's about $1,444 for a 5x8 teardrop. If Monstaliner lives up to the hype, I'd much rather put the spare $1,000 back in my pocket

[Glenn Butcher]

I spoke with a Line-X dealer in my area. It sounds like a great product. It's the industry standard, and for good reason. You can't go wrong with it. Before I found Monstaliner, it was my number one pick. But ...

You have to upgrade to Line-X Premium in order to get UV resistance. With Monstaliner, it's standard. And while Line-X may be stronger (better tensile strength, etc.), it's important to remember that we're putting this on a teardrop, not a truck - just about any bedliner is technically overkill in the strength department. What matters most, to me anyway, is adhesion, durability and UV resistance.

The dealer I spoke with quoted about $10 a square foot for regular Line-X. Depending on how much of the camper you have to tape off, it could be more or less. Anyways, assuming $10 a square foot, that's about $1,444 for a 5x8 teardrop. If Monstaliner lives up to the hype, I'd much rather put the spare $1,000 back in my pocket

Excellent review, Andrew. Thanks!

[Andrew Herrick]

Monstaliner tells me that applying Monstaliner over a marine epoxy is a no-go and that one of two methods should be used: Either the polyurethane solution (see above thread) or by preparing wood with their Chassis Saver paint.

[Andrew Herrick]

I asked if Monstaliner could be applied over epoxy if polyurethane was used as a barrier coating. Basically, they said maybe. I might have issues, but I should be fine.

[tony.latham]

I asked if Monstaliner could be applied over epoxy if polyurethane was used as a barrier coating.

I assume you are planning on giving your epoxy a coat of poly before the Monstaliner. Why not directly over the epoxy/glass? Is it because of the amine blush issue?

Tony

[Andrew Herrick]

I asked if Monstaliner could be applied over epoxy if polyurethane was used as a barrier coating.

I assume you are planning on giving your epoxy a coat of poly before the Monstaliner. Why not directly over the epoxy/glass? Is it because of the amine blush issue?

Tony

Tony, good question. I didn't go after specifics yet. As far as my personal plans go, I'm on the fence. Epoxy is a good deal more work. I can spray a good polyurethane. It seems, offhand, that three coats of polyurethane (thinning the first coat), followed by two coats of Monstaliner, which builds to a 40 mil thickness, would be more than waterproof. Would saturating the camper in epoxy, followed by two coats of polyurethane, followed by the Monstaliner, be arguably more waterproof and worth the extra $$$? I don't know.

[tony.latham]

Thanks,

T

[Andrew Herrick]

I'll post a follow-up review later (maybe video?), but I just finished applying Monstaliner to the sides of a little project camper (4x7x4). I used three coats of clear gloss polyurethane + three coats rolled Monstaliner. So far, I'm really impressed. Looks great! I splurged on tintable Monstaliner and purchased Dark Burnt Orange. Easy to get complete coverage in just two coats. After the second coat, I couldn't even find any pinholes. The third coat was just because I had a lot left over! Coverage is estimated at 60 square feet per gallon. In hindsight, I shouldn't have catalyzed the entire gallon. Could have saved a 1/4-gallon or so for a different project

Not cheap, of course. Around $160 to $175 per gallon once all things are considered. The 8-oz colorant is about $30 on its own. This reminds me of when I used to see a $15 gallon of paint at a big box store and think, "Wow, what a deal!" Now, I see things the opposite way: The bigger the price tag, the better the deal I think it'll be

Generally comparable to aluminum sheeting in terms of price/coverage. As far as time goes, aluminum requires more trim work; Monstaliner requires more surface prep. So in terms of upfront cost and time invested, from a DIY perspective, I'd say they're roughly comparable.

Will leave further thoughts and pictures until next post. But as of now, I'm a happy camper

[BretMaverick]

Hey Andrew! Thanks for the write up on your project, hope to see pictures! I think I am going to put 3 coats of poly on my camper tomorrow, and once that is finished I'll be reaching out to Monstaliner to order the paint.

[Tom&Shelly]

I'll post a follow-up review later (maybe video?), but I just finished applying Monstaliner to the sides of a little project camper (4x7x4). I used three coats of clear gloss polyurethane + three coats rolled Monstaliner. So far, I'm really impressed. Looks great!

Hi Andrew,

So, re-reading this thread, I'm confused: Did you put the polyurethane on bare wood or over epoxy?

One reason I'm considering epoxy and fiberglass are comments on the forum about bent plywood wanting to form micro-cracks, and that the fiberglass strengthens (and epoxy waterproofs) the wood. But I guess others have not used fiberglass (or PMF) and have been fine.

Until you posted that Monstaliner says not to put their product on epoxy, I was thinking I'd fiberglass and then use their product instead of paint. But maybe the fiberglassing isn't necessary?

Anyway, thank you for trying this! Can't wait for the pictures and/or video!

Tom

[tony.latham]

One reason I'm considering epoxy and fiberglass are comments on the forum about bent plywood wanting to form micro-cracks, and that the fiberglass strengthens (and epoxy waterproofs) the wood.

I think most of these issues come from luan (or lauan) plywood sold in the box stores. Luan is a generic term and you never really know what you're getting other than it's the cheapest stuff the box stores can get.

http://www.wood-database.com/lauan/

You won't have that problem with Baltic birch. 1/8" wants to bend. But it still needs to be waterproofed of course.





T

[Andrew Herrick]

I'll post a follow-up review later (maybe video?), but I just finished applying Monstaliner to the sides of a little project camper (4x7x4). I used three coats of clear gloss polyurethane + three coats rolled Monstaliner. So far, I'm really impressed. Looks great!

Hi Andrew,

So, re-reading this thread, I'm confused: Did you put the polyurethane on bare wood or over epoxy?

One reason I'm considering epoxy and fiberglass are comments on the forum about bent plywood wanting to form micro-cracks, and that the fiberglass strengthens (and epoxy waterproofs) the wood. But I guess others have not used fiberglass (or PMF) and have been fine.

Until you posted that Monstaliner says not to put their product on epoxy, I was thinking I'd fiberglass and then use their product instead of paint. But maybe the fiberglassing isn't necessary?

Anyway, thank you for trying this! Can't wait for the pictures and/or video!

Tom

Tom,

I put three coats of polyurethane over bare wood. I did not use epoxy. I didn't want to deal with any adhesion issues - particuarly my first go-around - and I came to the conclusion that three coats of oil-based polyurethane + two-to-three coats of Monstaliner was sufficient to waterproof the wood. This camper was very small, with solid plywood walls, so I would gain no useable strength by fiberglassing.

With that said, I believe there may be room for improvement? Here is some options, all of which are currently untested to my knowledge:

1. Fiberglass the exterior with marine epoxy, and then apply sufficient polyurethane over the epoxy to guarantee chemical isolation between the epoxy and the Monstaliner.

2. It is possible that CPES, having different resin chemistry than most marine epoxies, would not have the same issue. At this point, I have no idea!

3. As recommended by Monstaliner, you could also use Chassis Saver as a primer for Monstaliner. Perhaps Chassis Saver can be painted onto epoxy/fiberglass?

4. Lastly, Monstaliner is made by Magnet Paints, which also sells a 2k industrial-grade epoxy primer. Again, it might be possible to coat fiberglass with this epoxy primer, and then apply Monstaliner directly over it, and or else coat the epoxy primer with Chassis Saver, followed by Monstaliner. I have to say ... this option sounds very expensive and time-consuming though!

Again, I haven't tried any of these ideas, and I have no idea if they will work. I'll probably bug Monstaliner with some more questions

[Andrew Herrick]

As a PS ... Reading this document at Rot Doctor about CPES (URL: www.rotdoctor.com/products/cpes.html), it claims that any urethane-based coating will adhere to CPES. If that's true, that might be the solution to using an epoxy as a sealer. Doesn't solve the fiberglassing issue, though

[Tom&Shelly]

You won't have that problem with Baltic birch. 1/8" wants to bend. But it still needs to be waterproofed of course.





T

Thank you Tony. We definitely plan to use Baltic birch for the ceiling and roof (and interior). (I'm thinking that's the same stuff they sell for umpteen dollars for less than a square foot in hobby stores, so if we can find it for ~$20 per 5 foot by 5 foot sheet it'll be a real bargain. My Dad built model airplanes and had pieces in his scrap pile. Remember it being easy to work and made all sorts of useful things out of it. Never tried to bend the 1/8" pieces though--the scrap was to small for that.)

I'm at the point in planning our project where, when I read what you wrote, I thought about not fiber glassing--it would save us weight, time, effort, and money. But, thinking about the strength it adds, especially at the wall/ceiling joints, how tough it is and how easy it is to repair, I'm thinking we'll probably still fiber glass. My philosophy is that I'm trying this for the first time, and by more or less copying the methods in Steve Fredrick's book, we shouldn't go too wrong.

Tom