Trying to weld for first time

[skinnedknuckles]

Bob,
I like how you are thinking with you're decisions about welding equipment. I have been welding for over 30 years with everything from oxy-acetylene, spot, stick ,mig and tig. Once you learn how to do it you will find more and more projects to do. Just get the best equipment that you can afford. I will never forget the first mig machine that I bought, it had a cheap roller mechanism and it would not keep tension between the rollers on the wire and it was very frustrating trying to weld. Classes are helpful but the big thing is practice practice practice and throw some patience in the mix too, it can become very frustrating learning the right technique. Aluminum is tricky to weld, cleanliness is VERY important. One thing to think about , get some cheap long sleeve shirts so your arms are protected. Nothing too thick and heavy, that makes welding a bit more tricky, the more you weld the more you will notice the weight of the torch/gun that you are holding and any kind of heavy clothing. A big reason for a light shirt is when that big weld berry burns thru your sleeve you want that thing to be able to burn back out and not get stuck inside burning a hole in your arm - ouch. The same goes for shoes, tennis shoes are a no no, berries just burn right on in and that hurts. If you have some kind of leather boot that would be better just make sure that the tongue has a flap that attaches the tongue to the side of your boot so berries don't find their way inside. Denim material can be a concern too, if you have any holes where the material is stringy I have found that the little strings act as little burning fuses that can hurt . Don't forget that there may be some good used welders for sale in your area, check around.
Have fun burning wire and melting metal and yes throw some pictures on here both good and bad we maybe able to help you with some tips,
Paul

[lrrowe]

Bob,
I like how you are thinking with you're decisions about welding equipment. I have been welding for over 30 years with everything from oxy-acetylene, spot, stick ,mig and tig. Once you learn how to do it you will find more and more projects to do. Just get the best equipment that you can afford. I will never forget the first mig machine that I bought, it had a cheap roller mechanism and it would not keep tension between the rollers on the wire and it was very frustrating trying to weld. Classes are helpful but the big thing is practice practice practice and throw some patience in the mix too, it can become very frustrating learning to Northrn Toolthe right technique. Aluminum is tricky to weld, cleanliness is VERY important. One thing to think about , get some cheap long sleeve shirts so your arms are protected. Nothing too thick and heavy, that makes welding a bit more tricky, the more you weld the more you will notice the weight of the torch/gun that you are holding and any kind of heavy clothing. A big reason for a light shirt is when that big weld berry burns thru your sleeve you want that thing to be able to burn back out and not get stuck inside burning a hole in your arm - ouch. The same goes for shoes, tennis shoes are a no no, berries just burn right on in and that hurts. If you have some kind of leather boot that would be better just make sure that the tongue has a flap that attaches the tongue to the side of your boot so berries don't find their way inside. Denim material can be a concern too, if you have any holes where the material is stringy I have found that the little strings act as little burning fuses that can hurt . Don't forget that there may be some good used welders for sale in your area, check around.
Have fun burning wire and melting metal and yes throw some pictures on here both good and bad we maybe able to help you with some tips,
Paul

Thanks for the tips. I will keep all of them in mind as I venture into this endeavor. I was thinking of heading out to Northern Tool tomorrow with the plan at maybe getting the Hobart. But we are expecting up to 30" of snow here in SW Virginia Friday and Saturday, so I may be preoccupied with getting ready for it. Maybe early next week. I anxious to try my first weld. I have local advice on where to get my supplies such as a gas tank. Next I need to find the scrap/metal dealers.

[lrrowe]

I am really still quite indecisive on my purchase of a welder. I have reached a lot of good thoughts from this thread and I appreciate all of them. Although right now I think I will bump up my list price from the $499 Hobart 140 to the Lincoln Easy Weld 140 Amp model at $529. Both are from Northern. My final cost after discount and gift card would be $399 versus $429. While the product specs are similar, I think I will resign myself to go for the perceived better unit, the Lincoln. I reached this final thought after talking today to my retired welder neighbor down the road. So now as I am sure others would say, "get off your butt, stop thinking about it and just go do it". As soon as the roads are a little better, I will head into Roanoke (35 mi) and get it.

Dales133, I thought about what you said about the "Asian" units and I could buy three of their 170 AMP (HF) units to the one Lincoln. But I guess I am going for the long range value and that I am supporting to a degree, a US model (assembled in MX darn it).

[justageorgiaguy]

I've been following this thread as I plan to start teaching myself to weld as well. My dad has a Millermatic 135, will that be sufficient to weld .125 and maybe a little thicker square tubing?

[lrrowe]

Obviously I am not the one to give advice given I am the OP. But from what little bit I have learned so far is that "yes" that unit should suffice. That is if I am right in thinking the 135 means 135 amps. I know there is more to the story then just amps. I am going out on the limb w/o any further research and say for .125" that welding it should be no problem.
I can only offer further add is that you read about welding and watch you-tube for as much tutorial stuff as you can stand. I have and I think I can do a great job because I stayed at a Holiday Inn last week (joke...hope you recall the commercial).

Good luck.

[justageorgiaguy]

Thanks OP. I believe it will be ok for that as well. I love Welding Tips and Tricks on YouTube. I'll weld a good bit of scrap before trying anything substantial.

[p40whk]

The Millermatic will have no problem with 1/8" metal although you'd be pushing it to weld thicker. The more amps you have the less the machine has to work to penetrate (melt) the metal in order to form a weld. 135 and 140 amp machines are primarily home machines designed for light occasional use but they are more than capable for most jobs, thicker material will take more time to weld but it can be done. If you're in the market to buy your own machine, the best advice I can give is always buy more than you currently need because you'll eventually have the need for bigger projects.

[Dale M.]

I've been following this thread as I plan to start teaching myself to weld as well. My dad has a Millermatic 135, will that be sufficient to weld .125 and maybe a little thicker square tubing?

Yes.... .125 is actually 1/8 inch and it should handle it very well, actually should be good to 3/16 but is getting questionable at 1/4 inch (pretty close to maxing out - single pass) ...

Dale

[lrrowe]

I finally have gotten all the equipment and raw material needed to start learning how to build. I had decided on either a Hobart or Lincoln 190 Amp 230V welder (whichever had the lowest price at the time my credit card was in my hand ) but a friend suggested I buy his 10 year old Eastman 85 Amp 110V unit that had never been used for $50. I could not pass this opportunity up. It provided a very lost cost to start off with and to make sure I can learn how to weld adequately for my needs. Then if all goes well, I will work on getting the bigger Hobart or Lincoln unit.



Now I have a $100 worth of raw material from a local metal supply shop, a HF welding table, a HF metal chop saw and some rebar for my first welding attempt. My wife, who has supported this craziness of buying all this stuff, asked that I make her a bottle tree for my first project. This is where the rebar comes into play.



So now my eagerness needs to be contained while my fingers are crossed.

[KCStudly]

How do your welds look so far?

If the machine can lay good beads than you should be able to, too. If the machine is iffy, then how do you know if it is the machine or you?

Just saying. One thing to do to give it the best shot at laying good welds is to make sure you feed it an adequate supply of power. It may have already been mentioned but those little machines don't usually like being placed at the end of a long extension cord.

[lrrowe]

How do your welds look so far?

If the machine can lay good beads than you should be able to, too. If the machine is iffy, then how do you know if it is the machine or you?

Just saying. One thing to do to give it the best shot at laying good welds is to make sure you feed it an adequate supply of power. It may have already been mentioned but those little machines don't usually like being placed at the end of a long extension cord.

Good questions KC.
I have not started yet. I was the pleasant victim last week of seeing my sister come visit from Chicago after not seeing her for a few years and then having some doctor appointments. I have a tentative plan to give it a try later this week after one more out of town doctor appointment. I guess my definition for being ready is whether my first few projects give me confidence that this is for me. And yes I know, I then will benefit from a bigger more powerful machine such as the 190 Amp 230V units. But now I just moved my awning and solar panels up the $$$$$$ list of things needed before that.

Even when (right now I am saying when and not "if") I have the 190 Amp unit, I see this smaller unit being useful for when I need to weld something small away from the 230V plug. I know I can get pricey 25 foot special cables for a 230V unit, but I did want to avoid that scenario. And I cannot use the Mig gas with this small unit.

I may have mentioned this before, but one way I am cost justifying these dollar purchases is that when I am ready to totally throw in the towel, that I have items that I can pass on to my sons. Sort of like spending their inheritances now and using the purchases way before they get their chance to get them.

[KCStudly]

My misunderstanding. I thought you had already made the bottle tree pictured.

[skinnedknuckles]

Bob,
Here is a little test so you can see what kind of penetration that welder gets. Take 2 pieces of 1/4" steel or maybe a little thinner ( 1/4 x 2 would be ideal ) grind beveled edges on the pieces where you would weld them together, only go about half way down the thickness of the edge. Only do this on the area where you are going to put the weld bead. Turn your welder up to max voltage and you may have to play with the wire speed to get it close to right ( do this on a flat surface not trying to join anything , get it so you get a nice puddle to "chase" ). Now put those two pieces together with a very small gap between and burn them together on only the top surface ( don't cheat and weld the bottom surface too I won't say who did this back in high school for a welding test ) Then put it in a vise and bend it over the weld area, you would like to see a good bend of the parent and weld area of the metal, with weld holding up well and not breaking . I figure the best way to learn to weld is first with an oxy-acetylene gas torch that way you can figure out what metal does when heated and melted together and how to chase your weld puddle. With mig welding you can have a pretty looking weld on the outside and very little penetration and/or porosity in your weld. I like your thoughts on spending your kids inheritance now using the item for what you need and then it can be handed down
Paul in Janesville, Wisconsin
still making messes just like when I was little

[lrrowe]

Bob,
Here is a little test so you can see what kind of penetration that welder gets. Take 2 pieces of 1/4" steel or maybe a little thinner ( 1/4 x 2 would be ideal ) grind beveled edges on the pieces where you would weld them together, only go about half way down the thickness of the edge. Only do this on the area where you are going to put the weld bead. Turn your welder up to max voltage and you may have to play with the wire speed to get it close to right ( do this on a flat surface not trying to join anything , get it so you get a nice puddle to "chase" ). Now put those two pieces together with a very small gap between and burn them together on only the top surface ( don't cheat and weld the bottom surface too I won't say who did this back in high school for a welding test ) Then put it in a vise and bend it over the weld area, you would like to see a good bend of the parent and weld area of the metal, with weld holding up well and not breaking . I figure the best way to learn to weld is first with an oxy-acetylene gas torch that way you can figure out what metal does when heated and melted together and how to chase your weld puddle. With mig welding you can have a pretty looking weld on the outside and very little penetration and/or porosity in your weld. I like your thoughts on spending your kids inheritance now using the item for what you need and then it can be handed down
Paul in Janesville, Wisconsin
still making messes just like when I was little

Thanks. I was looking for a test process. I will give it a try.

[Redneck Teepee]

[quote="skinnedknuckles"]Bob,
Turn your welder up to max voltage and you may have to play with the wire speed to get it close to right


To help a little further, hold in one spot and have another person adjust the wire speed until it buzz's like a bee, your wire speed is then correct for the heat setting. Once you master a steady hand you will be able to do this by yourself.