question for car enthusiasts

[Aaron Coffee]

I have a 1967 Dodge Dart GT Convertible, it is in good condition I have pulled the engine and rebuilt it. The car was repainted(outside body minus engine compartment and door jambs, etc)in the early 90's. Ihave 3 estimates on repainting engine compartment, and can't decide which to go with.
1. $1,200, this one he was kind of sketchy on details, but would either just sand and paint or blast to bare metal(my choice engine compartment and underside of hood and trunk, and patch in steel in the battery box area that is rusted through. This is a body shop.
2. $1,300-$1,800, another body shop. This one would remove the chrome trim, separating the vertical from the horizontal surfaces and paint the entire upper surface(blasted to bare steel)including the engine compartment and trunk, trunk lid top and bottom, replace replace rusted battery area with patch panels from a donor car, blast and paint k-member, and even go as far as smoothing out spot welds, to give the engine compartment a smooth look, and blast wheel wells(covered with undercoating now)and repaint. This shop has done quite a few show cars.
3. $500, this is a guy that operates out of his garage and would be engine compartment, and underside of trunk lid and hood.
The money is not a major issue, but with 1 or 3 I would have the car back sooner and could get it back together yet this summer. Didn't really get a timeline on 2.
Doing it myself is out of the question, as I don't know anything about the different hardeners, additives, etc. I would just as soon let experts do it.
Thoughts, opinions?
Here are a few pics



Thanks
Aaron

[Creamcracker]

I have a 1967 Dodge Dart GT Convertible, it is in good condition I have pulled the engine and rebuilt it. The car was repainted(outside body minus engine compartment and door jambs, etc)in the early 90's. Ihave 3 estimates on repainting engine compartment, and can't decide which to go with.
1. $1,200, this one he was kind of sketchy on details, but would either just sand and paint or blast to bare metal(my choice engine compartment and underside of hood and trunk, and patch in steel in the battery box area that is rusted through. This is a body shop.
2. $1,300-$1,800, another body shop. This one would remove the chrome trim, separating the vertical from the horizontal surfaces and paint the entire upper surface(blasted to bare steel)including the engine compartment and trunk, trunk lid top and bottom, replace replace rusted battery area with patch panels from a donor car, blast and paint k-member, and even go as far as smoothing out spot welds, to give the engine compartment a smooth look, and blast wheel wells(covered with undercoating now)and repaint. This shop has done quite a few show cars.
3. $500, this is a guy that operates out of his garage and would be engine compartment, and underside of trunk lid and hood.
The money is not a major issue, but with 1 or 3 I would have the car back sooner and could get it back together yet this summer. Didn't really get a timeline on 2.
Doing it myself is out of the question, as I don't know anything about the different hardeners, additives, etc. I would just as soon let experts do it.
Thoughts, opinions?
Here are a few pics



Thanks
Aaron

If as you say "money is not a major issue" then you really need to ask yourself one question......who will do the better job? With car restoration patience is paramount...I can understand the "need" to get the car back asap but if you get it back and the job is less than what was expecetd then you're going to spend the next couple of years "kicking yourself".......so as I say "who's going to do the best job" answer that question and then go with them...if the answer turns out to be number 2 then you really should get some kind of a commitment on a timeline ...preferably in writing.

Philip

[Woodbutcher]

I think you need to look at the body itself closely. I would be afraid to over restore under the hood etc. I may be more inclined to go with the garage guy as long as I saw his work and was comfortable with it. If the body is show quality go with # 2 and do it after the summer season when the car is stored, then you don't lose drive time.

[parnold]

I vote for #2!

[Mark72]

#2 sounds like the way to go with one change. Instead of repainting the k-member I would completely remove the k-member and have the suspension components completely disassembled and have the parts blasted and powder coated which is the most durable and corrosion resistant procedure. then have all new bushings and steering components installed in the assembly process.

If you are going to have the car apart for this work there is no reason to cut yourself short on the repairs just to have it come back apart for another round to correct something else in a few short years.

Just my opinion of coarse.

Mark

[hotrod]

Im in favor of #2 , if you can swing it having stuff powdercoated is awesome!
I did a similar job on one of the impalas a couple years ago. lots of monkeywork when you start changing/repairing sheetmetal. Engine was out...POR 15 is also some awesome stuff!!

[caseydog]

I work for classic car auction companies, and looked in my books for value. That car in stellar condition is worth 20 grand on a bad day, and 35 grand on a good day.

So, my question to you is, are you looking to restore the car to sell for top dollar, or is it a weekend driver you plan t keep forever?

If I owned this car, and wanted to make it an auction day winner, I'd take the body off, take the engine compartment, frame and suspension down to metal, and do a top notch paint job on both, staying as close to how it was originally done as possible.

BTW, powder-coating is great, but it wasn't done on that car when it was new. So, you could actually lower the value of the car by doing that. When it comes to getting maximum value out of a classic car, staying true to original build techniques is important.

But, if I really just want a cool car to drive to cruise nights and take for Sunday drives, then I would just aim at eliminating as much rust as possible, and paint it to look nice to the average car guy at hose cruise nights. Then, I'd keep it out of the weather and enjoy it when the sun is shining.

Your car is nice, and it is also worth some somewhat serious money. Talk to some specialists, not just people on a forum. If you want some names, PM me and I'll see who I can find for you to talk to about that car. I do have one serious Mopar buyer/seller in my address book. He would know who to talk to about restoration.

CD

[Aaron Coffee]

I've always considered it a cool cruiser(because I knew all of the flaws, and besides its just a little Dart), and my original intention was clean up the engine compartment so I wasn't embarresed to open the hood at car shows. After getting these estimates and hearing the body shops look it over and tell me how straight the car is, has really got me thinking of leaning more towards a resotration rather than a spit and polish. Mostly use it as a weekend toy, and have never really considered it an investment. Right now my plans are to keep it and enjoy it.
I am going with #2, although I don't think I am going to have them go as far as smoothing out the spot welds on the engine compartment, and I am debating the inside wheel wells (tire side) being blasted and painted body color (heavy undercoating now). Have the engine out and almost finished assembly after a rebuild.
I didn't realize the values had gone up that much, I bought it in 1993 pretty much the way it is now (except the motor was in it) for a then premium price of $7,000. I used to follow the values out of curiosity but have stopped over the last few years.
Thanks
Aaron

[kennyrayandersen]

if you plan on keeping it, and maybe passing it on to family I'd spring for the restoration. These older cars, and especially straight ones, are getting harder to find all of the time. I'd skip 2 and go to the restoration (not over restoration!), bu that's just me. It's your car and your money so you have to decide what it's worth. The main thing is don't do anything half-a$$ed with a collector car.

[caseydog]

Aaron, you may also want to look into collector car insurance. Regular car insurance will pay you next to nothing if the car gets wrecked -- they'll call it totaled for a minor fender-bender, and give you a small fraction of it's collector car value.

Companies like Haggerty work out a policy based on a pre-agreed value, and base the premium on things like where it is stored, and how many miles you drive it. Premiums are not that bad, and you are properly covered. Whether it's a Dart or a Duesenberg, collector car insurance is worth looking into.


And, again, if you want to maintain maximum value, you need to keep the car as close as possible to how it rolled out of the factory as you make these improvements to the condition of the car.


CD

[Aaron Coffee]

Have collector car insurance, cant remember the company right off hand, switched a couple years back so i could cover the teardrop, towing it to car shows, etc. Will need to get a new appraisal after I get all of the work done, kind of let it slip, had it appraised in 95 for $8,000.
Some people think I'm nuts for wanting to keep it stock(2 barrel carb, single exhaust...), my brother offered me a bored and stroked 340 to put in it and I turned him down. the only modifications I have are 70-73 Chrysler ralleys wheels with whitewall radials(been looking for stock 13" rims to no avail, have the hubcaps), petronix electronic ignition, early 70's Panasonic underdash eight track tape player. May put a set of cal Custom aluminum vlavle covers (circa mid 70's) on it until I can find the correct original valve covers and a few easily removable chrome goodies, and a set of dealer option child safety locks.

[kennyrayandersen]

Have collector car insurance, cant remember the company right off hand, switched a couple years back so i could cover the teardrop, towing it to car shows, etc. Will need to get a new appraisal after I get all of the work done, kind of let it slip, had it appraised in 95 for $8,000.
Some people think I'm nuts for wanting to keep it stock(2 barrel carb, single exhaust...), my brother offered me a bored and stroked 340 to put in it and I turned him down. the only modifications I have are 70-73 Chrysler ralleys wheels with whitewall radials(been looking for stock 13" rims to no avail, have the hubcaps), petronix electronic ignition, early 70's Panasonic underdash eight track tape player. May put a set of cal Custom aluminum vlavle covers (circa mid 70's) on it until I can find the correct original valve covers and a few easily removable chrome goodies, and a set of dealer option child safety locks.

you definitely want to reevaluate the price... CD has a good point on the insurance

[eamarquardt]

Lottsa considerations. Sounds like you're not looking for a show car but want to stop the deterioration and not "be embarrased" to open the hood.

I agree with CD that stock is better. Make no changes that can't be undone later (I don't think I'd get rid of the spot welding marks). If you're not ready/not interested in a total restore, just do a nice/cost effective job now to arrest any rusting and keep it in good shape for a future full restoration that may or may not be in your plans.

In short, keep your long range goals in mind in making any decisions on what to do today.

Cheers,

Gus

[caseydog]

Have collector car insurance, cant remember the company right off hand, switched a couple years back so i could cover the teardrop, towing it to car shows, etc. Will need to get a new appraisal after I get all of the work done, kind of let it slip, had it appraised in 95 for $8,000.
Some people think I'm nuts for wanting to keep it stock(2 barrel carb, single exhaust...), my brother offered me a bored and stroked 340 to put in it and I turned him down. the only modifications I have are 70-73 Chrysler ralleys wheels with whitewall radials(been looking for stock 13" rims to no avail, have the hubcaps), petronix electronic ignition, early 70's Panasonic underdash eight track tape player. May put a set of cal Custom aluminum vlavle covers (circa mid 70's) on it until I can find the correct original valve covers and a few easily removable chrome goodies, and a set of dealer option child safety locks.

If you want to change the engine, or make other changes of that kind, just be sure to keep the original stuff. The number one way to cut the value of a classic car is to "hot rod" it. I've seen cars that would be worth six figures reduced to chump change because someone thought it would be cool to customize it.

If you want to hot rod a classic, start with one that isn't worth anything. For example, start a custom retro-mod GTO with a six cylinder Pontiac Tempest, not a real GTO.

About a year ago, I saw a 1959 Eldorado convertible with a modern Corvette engine, four-wheel discs, and all kinds of "show car" customization. The builder sold off the original engine and parts to pay for the project. He basically turned a car with a $150,000 or more potential into a $25,000 bucket of bling.

CD

[rebapuck]

I can't believe you had the car painted 20 years ago and are now looking to have only the engine compartment done.

My car was painted in 1990, 2000 and is getting ready for it's third. Hopefully this guy can do a better job.