Talk About A Solid Wall Tent...

[mezmo]

In the Big Foamie Thread recently, it was mentioned about just
trying to keep things simple and do a basic "hard-walled tent" -
or consider the small light builds of a TD or TTT as such.

Here is an actual small lightweight hard-walled tent ! It's called
the Rapido. These were designed and built by a Frenchman/company in
the 1960s-1970s-1980s [I believe, - but not built anymore.]. And they
used sandwich/composite panels of plastic/fiberglass sheets and
plywood/strandboard and foam that were joined and hinged together
with aluminum extrusions. I love the shear ingenuity of it. It is the
most travel-compact camper for the set up space provided that I've
run across. It's one of the most unique folding caravans going and I
understand they have a "cult" status now among European campers.

Here"s one listed on a NZ auction site at the moment. The listing has
nice large pics:

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/caravan ... 889171.htm

Here are some other Rapido links:

http://www.originalrapido.co.uk/
http://www.alfred-johannes.de/06-05-2_rapido_record.htm
http://pliante-rapido.com/start.htm
http://pliante-rapido.com/notice.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAasaJZt ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlALnklj ... re=related

My browser [Google Chrome] always asks if I want to translate the
non-English websites so that is no problem for those.

It just proves that there is more than one or a few ways to build
camping shelter.

Cheers,
Norm/mezmo

[GPW]

That’s very interesting ... Thanks for the info ...

[angib]

My browser [Google Chrome] always asks if I want to translate the
non-English websites so that is no problem for those.

I find that everyone, the whole world over, posts their photos in English.....

[TJinPgh]

Yeah, there are quite a few Rapido videos on youtube.

It's certainly spacious. I'm not quite sure how I feel about the way the roof is setup on that. Can't figure out what stops it from leaking at the seam.

Other than that, while I have seen videos of a single person setting one up, usually it requires two people to do it quickly.

That could be true of the Chateau Mobile I posted last week as well, though.

[loaderman]

The only problem with those types of designs is
Setting up or taking down in rain.

[TJinPgh]

True.

That would be an issue with the Chateau as well.

That, of course, is the benefit of anything that's self-contained, like a TD. But then, a TD isn't going to have that much space, either.

It's all a trade-off, I guess.

The Propert Folding Caravan seemed to be a pretty good compromise. Bigger than a TD. Smaller than a Tent Camper. But, sets up in seconds and is more or less self-contained. Much like a Winter Warrior.

[GPW]

Need more space , just make a Bigger TD ... That’s what I intend !!!

Eagle mentioned the A liner ... seems similar to above ^ .... sorta’ ...

[TJinPgh]

LOL
Well, building a bigger TD certainly is an option. Sooner or later, though, you start running up against weight constraints.

Even with a foamie you're going to reach a point where the frame needs to be bigger to accomodate it. Otherwise, you're going to have to look at something expandable.

The Winter Warrior designs as well as the Kampmaster/Wild Goose Designs... they expend with respect to height but, by and large, you're still looking at something that's restricted to the size of the trailer.

So, something like a Rapido or a Chateau or even a Propert allows you to have more floor space without a larger trailer.

You would be hard pressed to build a TD or TTT with the kind of space this has and still keep it below the 1000 lb weight limit that a lot of today's 4 cyl cars have.

Obviously it can be done but I wouldn't know how, even as a foamie.

[mezmo]

Set-up in the rain would be a problem, but remember, it's
still basically a hard-sided tent, so it does share some of the
drawbacks of tents but still has more of the benefits of a TTT.
The roof panels must have some kind of interlocking aluminum
extrusions that take care of water leak concerns. The travel size
vs set up space ratio is hard to beat.

Yeah, Everything in life is a 'compromise' if you think of it.

Anyway, here's a possibility for a Foamie expanding up and out.
His prototype #2 was a 'fast' build to prove his concept! His
prototype #3 has been in the design phase for a year or so. It'll
be interesting to see if he ever gets it built.

http://www.goldbrand.info/index.html

One other benefit of the Rapido is the small folded size for
storage, especially if space is at a premium. It can be stored
on it's side or end and the tongue even folds underneath
it for storage. Rapido went on to build 'Pop-Top' TTTs-TTs that
had about 5ft high bodies and then large roof sections that lifted
up and had hard-walled infill panels fold up between the body and
the lift-roof. They also built some of the folding caravans/TTTs that
look like our pop-top tent trailers but that had hard sidewalls. They had
one model that was @5ft wide when folded for travel, but when it
was opened, it has one sidewall with about a 1ft+ full length cantilever
[That nested under a 'high-top' style pop-top roof for travel.] that
gave it the extra width needed for side-to-side oriented beds. I had a
pic of it but I can't find it now. Quite ingenious. I believe Rapido
only makes smaller motorhomes now similar to our small class C's.

Properts are neat too, but by far, my favorite small expanding/folding
TTT/caravan is the Australian Expandavan. Not a lot built over the years
but very ingenious I think.

http://vintagecaravans.proboards.com/in ... 060&page=1

They have about 5ft3-6in width and 10-11ft long bodies and 7-8ft height for
travel. Two solid wall bed extensions then fold out once set up. One earlier
version also had a fold-out rear dinette room. The first were made of plywood,
then there was a fiberglass version, then finally a more usual small member
wood frame and plywood interior panel with aluminum exterior sheeting.
You'd have to ensure sufficient strength for the fold-outs somehow, but this
design would make a really nice Foamie.

The boxy one named "Fugly" in the link is not an Expandavan brand, but is a
one-off self-built by a furniture factory owner/manager who only built @ 5 variations
on the theme over time for his own personal use. That's @ 6ftWidex8ftLongx8fthigh
body size for travel. It's made of single wall 3ply high quality plywood [probably @ 3/8in].
It's not very aero though, but scores high on the "neat/kool" scale for me.

Cheers,
Norm/mezmo

[TJinPgh]

Interesting design on that expandavan.

I'm guessing there is another panel on the inside that's the same size as the roof panel that just flips down once it's opened up.

Would need to be fairly heavy ply for the base to hold the weight of a couple of adults without any support from below.

Would think you'd also need to have one on each side if you're making it big enough for a double bed or else there could be a bit of a balance issue.

Cool idea. Just not sure about the weight of the final product. Will have to read through that documentation to see if there's anything in it about that.

[starleen2]

Interesting concepts

[loaderman]

If having to choose what would be better for gas mileage.
Small and expanding up and outward trailer like the rapido or other folding designs.
Or
Larger but probably lighter because of less hardware needed for the folding design?

[TJinPgh]

Well, for me, it was never about MPG but rather weight.

That said, while weight is certainly a factor in fuel economy drag is a big issue as well.

So, I'd think the answer to your question woudl be "it depends."

Once the trailer gets larger than the TV, drag becomes an issue. You can, I suspect, work with that with the design. But, probably only to a certain point.

The trick, though, is to make something expanding that isn't significantly heavier, per square foot in camping mode, than a non-expanding unit of the same amount of space.

I do not believe that you can make a conventional hard walled trailer with the space of some of these expandables without them being significantly heavier.

Although, as I type that, I am reminded of some campers I saw from Canada that are under 1000 lbs yet are still roughly the same size ad my 14" camper which weighs in at around 1700 lbs. So, clearly, if the materials are chosen wisely it can be done.

Prolite Mini 13...



2" shy of 14' and weighs 950 lbs.

But then, I think the Rapido weighs less than that. I know the Chateau does.

[atahoekid]

Not to be a royal PITA but my mind has always stayed away from anything that needs additional unfolding or set=up. As I see it, I've already got to set up the "side tent" so my wife can change while standing upright and the dining fly so the bugs don't interrupt the meal. I don't need one more thing to do or undo, I admire the compact thinking but as I see it, I'll make it slightly larger (heavier) for the extra convenience

[wagondude]

TJ, Thanks for posting that Prolite trailer. They have some cool layout options and are very light. That helps me out with trying to figure out how to layout such a small trailer and still give SWMBO the "must have" facilities.

Bill