How do you Keep It Simple?

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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby Oldragbaggers » Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:20 pm

Brandy, how do I look at your TDD?? I do not see a link in your posts and your photo gallery does not have any pictures in it. :thinking:

As far as keeping it simple..... When I was researching for my build I poured over all these build journals here and just drooled over all the beautiful trailers with full galleys, all the lights, fans, outlets, hot and cold running Coca Cola, disco balls, entertainment systems, and etc. and I wanted it ALL. I started buying parts before I had even made my first sawdust. By the time I got around to cutting out my walls I already had a sink, water tank, manual pump faucet and all the related plumbing, a drop in counter top propane stove, a vent with fan, electrical boxes, RV lights (DC), and more. The pile of parts I had accumulated took up a space about equal to my whole galley, and I didn't even have a house battery, charger, or a dozen other things that would have been required. (I ended up either selling or returning most of it in the end. The rest of it will probably be for sale at the CRA.)

But after I got into the build a ways, had started getting anxious and fearful over how complex the project had become, had begun to doubt that I would ever complete it (or be able to afford it) and had begun wondering if I was even going to have room left to store a bag of chips and a can of soda after it was all in, I started thinking about the fact that we had lived for 5 years on a variety of sailboats that had very simple systems, and had boat camped extensively (and quite comfortably) on even smaller boats that had NO permanent systems, so I knew that none of it was essential to have fun, and that sometimes complicated systems (and the maintenance of them) can be an absolute impediment to fun. The reason I say that they can be an impediment to fun is because when you have them, and you become reliant on them, it can really throw a wrench in your gears when they don't work for some reason. And any time at all that you spend working on fixing them is time you are missing out on doing other fun things. Our philosophy was always, the less parts, the less things that can fail. In the end we decided that the K.I.S.S. philosphy had served us well for years, why do anything different now? Once that decision was made my stress level came down 10 notches in an instant.

As for the plumbing.....we had a sink, hand pump and tanks on most of our boats. The sinks were barely big enough to wash a coffee cup in, the manual pumps were slow and needed to be rebuilt constantly. On a boat where you may be away from land and a source to refill your small water tanks the slow pumps can be a good thing because it keeps you from wasting water, but whenever we were anywhere that I could hook up a garden hose I always ended up doing dishes in the cockpit in dishpans. I had more room to work and wasn't taking up space and splashing water all over the counters inside the boat. I decided dishpans and the hose or portable jugs would suit me just fine in the teardrop as well. And the dishpans take up no room in transit because you can store other things in them.

Electrical....We decided to go with the Caseydog Super Simple electrical system and will enjoy running whatever we wish with 110 when it is available (which for us will probably be most of the time.) But we are prepared to have no electricity and still be able to camp in comfort.....

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For lights we have several Coleman lanterns, battery operated flashlights and LED stick-up lights, candle lanterns, and solar walkway lights for outside the teardrop . The vent/fan was replaced with a straight vent. (If the weather is sufficiently hot at night to require a fan in order to be comfortable we will make sure we camp in places with shore power available and we will carry a small 110 operated fan that we can just plug in. A battery operated boom-box type radio or our iPods suits us just fine for music or listening to a ball game. If 110 is unavailable the only inconvenience might be charging the phones with the car if necessary. Everything else we can do just fine without.

The drop in counter top propane stove has been replaced with Coleman 413D, 425C, and 502 stoves . I was especially happy with that decision after I read a few threads recommending that you keep the stove out from under the hatch, which will keep your galley grease free, odor free, and easier to clean. A folding Coleman camp kitchen and possibly a hibatchi grill will complete the galley equipment. (We were originally planning to tow with a car, but have since purchased a truck so gear storage is no longer an issue.)

I really admire all the elaborately done trailers. Being able to flip a switch and have anything you want is very nice, and there may be times I will wish I had it all. I will also admit that wiring scared the heck out of me and if my skills were such that the wiring was easy for me, I probably would have done it "just because I could." But I know from experience that I will not miss out on anything important because I don't have it.

That's just my 2 cents. Other's opinions will most certainly vary. Good luck with whatever you decide.
Life is sooooo good.........
Sail...camp....bike...repeat
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby Shadow Catcher » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:03 am

One thing to remember is that a "transformer" will not work with DC, however there are DC to DC buck converters that will. I was playing with a very inexpensive one I found on ebay from China that has a digital voltage meter and it was dead on even when I varied the source input. LED's in most cases have a built in "driver" that can limit voltage and or current and this may be one of the problems trying to use battery powered lights ward wired into a circuit that does not have this built in. I can speculate but have not tested the 12V LED's in our trailer. I know they see 14+ volts when the battery is being bulk charged and we have had them for a number of years with no problems.
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby Brandy » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:12 am

My litle TD is on page 3 of Teardrop construction tips& techniques. Should explain itself. If you need to know anything just ask.
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby Dirke » Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:22 am

Oldragbaggers wrote:[i][b]
I really admire all the elaborately done trailers. Being able to flip a switch and have anything you want is very nice, and there may be times I will wish I had it all.


I agree. I do like having all the extras because it is cool and would of course help with the resale value. However, you don't need it all to have fun. I am planning my build so I can get out camping as soon as there is a roof over my head. From there I will add things little by little. I already have a lot of stuff I can install, sink, stove, battery. solar panel. All stuff that I had scrounged years ago before I thought about building a TD. I may add them and then again I may not. Mostly I just want a dry place to lay down. Sure, I want it to be pretty, but that may take a little time to get things just right.

I really like your electrical system. I figure I will start with an extension cord out the back of the galley. It would be easy to add the outside plug later.
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby wagondude » Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:30 am

Brandy wrote:My litle TD is on page 3 of Teardrop construction tips& techniques. Should explain itself. If you need to know anything just ask.


viewtopic.php?f=21&t=52188

So others may find it easily. It bumps back it to page one when it gets a reply.
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby Lgboro » Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:06 am

I didn't keep my camper build simple. The extra time in the initial build is well worth the convenience of not having to lug and load items that could have been built in the first place. Much easier to plan and build in than to retro fit into the limited space of a tear. I haven't found one item yet I wished I had built in and didn't in over 17,000 miles and 80 or so nights out since last May.
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby Dirke » Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:52 am

Lgboro wrote:The extra time in the initial build is well worth the convenience of not having to lug and load items that could have been built in the first place. .


I agree, that is part of the reason I want to build a TD, so I can just hook up and go whenever the mood hits me and not have to haul boxes up out of the basement. I do feel there are ways to include the comfort items and still keep things simple. For example, I plan on installing all my plugs, lights, etc, on the wall between the galley and the bedroom area. In such a small space, I won't need more than a couple of lights to do some reading, etc. That will also simplify the build as I won't have to run any wiring in the outside walls. If I am smart (and remember to do it), I will make sure I have easy access to the wiring in case of any repairs or improvements. A couple of screws in the panel between the two areas should work just fine.

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Simple lock door handle

Postby Dirke » Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:03 am

I found this door handle for my build. It was $11 at Lowe's and comes with a lock. It has the nice feature of unlocking when you close the door so you won't lock your keys inside your camper. (A handy feature for a guy like me). It was very easy to install and works great.

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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby grantstew8 » Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:33 pm

Hi
If you are considering a foamie that uses EPS you could run chases through the sheets. By heating a ball bearing with a blowtorch until its red hot it will melt its way through a sheet of eps. Gravity makes sure its a vertical line. If these chases are at known centres then you can run a wire from under the chassis up the wall to a new socket at a later stage.
By rotating the eps sheet 90 degrees you can run horizontal chases.

Corners are a challenge but these could be pre-wired. The cost of cable is buttons. It may be worth running two obviously different cables : one for 12v and the other for 110/240v.

Having a detailed drawing with tags on the exposed wire tails will help for any future additions.

In the USA and Australia they run electric cables within SIPs walls using this process. In the uk they think the plastic coating of the wire become brittle so building control does not permit it.

I may add some more wires for future additions in my build now I've though about your question. :)

Perfect timing!
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby pchast » Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:06 pm

grantstew8 wrote:Hi
If you are considering a foamie that uses EPS you could run chases through the sheets. By heating a ball bearing with a blowtorch until its red hot it will melt its way through a sheet of eps. Gravity makes sure its a vertical line. If these chases are at known centres then you can run a wire from under the chassis up the wall to a new socket at a later stage.
By rotating the eps sheet 90 degrees you can run horizontal chases.


Great idea! What distance did it work for you. Just 4 ft or all 8' ?
:thumbsup:
I'm going to need to test this with my blue stuff too.
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby RandyG » Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:24 pm

As far as having the solar panel and another charging system in place, instead of disconnecting the panel, just put a switch to break the circuit. An off switch for your solar panel.
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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby ksmack01 » Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:00 pm

If I could do it all again , I would run 3/4" pvc pipe under my floor from front to back and side to side. To have a chase for wire would have saved me lots of trouble in my remodel. I put all my electrical on the wall between the gally and cabin. It worked out well and was easy to make changes. I have tv and dvd player and running water and solar power and lights front to back and plenty of other stuff I really dont need , but its exactly how I want it. Ive never had anyone take a tour of my rig and say, boy thats a lot useless crap you put on that thing. Here's a shot of all my 110 volt and my incabin 12volt wireing. Access from the galley is painless. :thumbsup:

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Re: How do you Keep It Simple?

Postby grantstew8 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 4:05 am

The majority of panels are 8x4 sheets and typically a wall height is 8'. The weight of the ball bearing probably is significant to heat loss however we were able to use a 1" ball bearing and drop it through a 16' panel.
Red hot, (according to tinternet) is anywhere between 500-1000C. EPS melts at 240C so you've got plenty of energy.

Another option is to drill a hole in the EPS where you want an outlet/switch. Insert some scrap cardboard into the hole and then use a plumb line and drop the hot ball. Have a tin cup to catch the hot ball, or it will disappear under a work bench..... :lol:

The panel can be rotated in any direction in order to get the direction you're after once the hole/chase is done. The heat obviously melts the eps which forms a hard skin. This makes it easier to feed cable through the hole.
(I found this link to my SIPs in OZ my brother is one of the directors there) :thumbsup:

http://sipsreadycut.com.au/docs/panel_chasing_guide.pdf


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