6x10 Hiway Cargo plumbing

[hankaye]

Trailmate, Howdy;

Sometimes the shortest run isn't the best, connecting the output fitting of the commode to
your elbow then a short "nipple" section then one of these;
http://www.valterra.com/product/wye-3-b ... at_id=1450
and you can connect your sink and the flow is directed to blade valve ... and
yes I meant ABS and ABS glue, sorry couldn't get the correct bits of alphabet out
in the proper order ...

hank

[aggie79]

In my daydreaming about a CTC, I've considered using this type of trap for both the sink and the shower: http://www.hepvo.com/. They are a little pricy, but their compact size and anti-siphoning design offset the cost in my opinion. I didn't realize it, but they also claim to eliminate the need for venting.

[Trailmate]

I've considered one of these too. An elbow is not really a necessity. Wouldn't totally prevent backflow into the sink drainpipe but it should substantially reduce it.

[Trailmate]

That's a good suggestion. I just noticed it after I posted the pic of the sani T I was looking at. I've thought about that style. It might be trickier to plumb but it would definitely be more effective keeping the drains separate. I like that.

[Trailmate]

Trailmate, Howdy;

Sometimes the shortest run isn't the best, connecting the output fitting of the commode to
your elbow then a short "nipple" section then one of these;
http://www.valterra.com/product/wye-3-b ... at_id=1450
and you can connect your sink and the flow is directed to blade valve ... and
yes I meant ABS and ABS glue, sorry couldn't get the correct bits of alphabet out
in the proper order ...

hank

I haven't tried quoting yet in this forum so I think it's time I learned so here goes!

I like that solution Hank. I've thought about that style. I thought it would be trickier to plumb. The underside of my trailer is going to be a challenge to plumb. There is a lot of metal framing in the way and I'm trying to keep everything up as high as possible for clearance.

[Trailmate]

In my daydreaming about a CTC, I've considered using this type of trap for both the sink and the shower: http://www.hepvo.com/. They are a little pricy, but their compact size and anti-siphoning design offset the cost in my opinion. I didn't realize it, but they also claim to eliminate the need for venting.

That's a very interesting alternative. More homework!

[Trailmate]

That is an interesting alternative. http://www.valterra.com/product/wye-3-b ... at_id=1450 It already has the bayonet lugs on it. I like that. Wondering how to get the Wye to 90 degrees from the 3 inch. Wonder if this would work: http://www.homedepot.com/p/NIBCO-2-in-A ... /100343877.

[hankaye]

Trailmate, Howdy;

That is an interesting alternative. http://www.valterra.com/product/wye-3-b ... at_id=1450 It already has the bayonet lugs on it. I like that. Wondering how to get the Wye to 90 degrees from the 3 inch. Wonder if this would work: http://www.homedepot.com/p/NIBCO-2-in-A ... /100343877.

Better to go the entire 90° http://www.homedepot.com/p/NIBCO-3-in-A ... 5yc1vZc8wi
then 45°. Also keeping it in a more rounded configuration, think sweep, is more advisable
then a sharp corner that could possibly create a catchment area.
When I dry-fit the run I like to use a few dots of White-out to mark where the alignments
are so that it comes out the way I planned it when I glue it and twist it together. I'm still
waiting for Sharpie to do a White marker...

hankaye

[Trailmate]

With that Wye you would need a 2" 45 degree street hub. I probably didn't explain it well. The 45 degree street hub connected to the Wye's 2" hub makes the 2" perpendicular or level or 90 degrees to the 3" pipe. I emailed Valterra for a dimension on that fitting. They answered right back by the way. The wye hub is close to 7 inches long. Way too long for what I need. I bought a pvc toilet flange at Home Depot today and I bought a 3" sanitary tee with the inch and a half hub on the side. It was only 5.5" tall. Thought it would work but got it home and realized while underneath the trailer, it wouldn't. I ordered the Hepvo trap too from Amazon. I've got another idea for the toilet drain. It will involve two elbows. The second elbow is not stocked locally. Had to be ordered. It's one of these:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/NIBCO-3-in-x ... /100678004
I'm trying to keep as much clearance as possible underneath. Plan for now is 3" elbow connected to the toilet flange and then connect the 3x3x1.5" elbow horizontally so the 1.5" is facing up and then connect the 1.5" sink drain pipe to it from above. When I get this plumbing project completed, I'm going do a detailed description of it in a separate posting with details, links and pictures. That way anybody considering it for their trailer might benefit from it.
Thanks for the tip about the dry fit and sharpie. That's a good one.

[hankaye]

Trailmate, Howdy;

Are you going to be mixing ABS & PVC ?
Just curious...

hank

[Trailmate]

I wanted to use ABS but nobody seems to stock it locally. I know HD and Lowes does not. I finally decided to just use PVC. It's pretty much all there at HD and that is a big plus. I did have to order one of these because they didn't have it: http://www.homedepot.com/p/NIBCO-3-in-x ... /100678004. I can go with all pvc except for this: http://www.amazon.com/Valterra-T1029-1- ... B002N5T4PM. This termination adapter (according to an email I received from Valterra) will glue inside a 3" hub. Right now I've got to wait for items to come in that I had to order online so that will cause delays. I've gotta drill a 4 inch hole in my floor so I wanna make sure I only have to do it once. It's a crowded space underneath with a lot of steel in the way.

[hankaye]

Trailmate, Howdy;

Good luck, keeping fingers Xed for ya.
Looking forward to a happy result.

hank

[48Rob]

Hi Paul,

Sorry about not responding to your PM's, I've been out camping...


Have you found the answers you needed for your plumbing setup?

I saw a picture of your combination elbow...it would be better to drop your sink line in from above, as in a tee.
All secondary gray water should enter the main drain above the toilet drop, but if it can't, a sanitary tee will work as long as the sink bowl/pipe connection is above the top of the toilet bowl, so that if the system backed up the sewage would not come out into the sink.
Where is the vent in your system, and what size?

ABS is a lot harder to come by (retail) than PVC, and will probably cost more as well.

Rob

[Trailmate]

Hi Rob,
I thought you might be away. I had questions about the Qest fittings but I think I've got them figured out. Only thing on the inlet side I'm not sure of is how to connect the pex to the faucet. Can that be done with Qest or is there a better way. I did order 2 Qest tees. One tee to feed the toilet and the second tee to split the line into 2 for the faucet hookup. I ordered the Qest stuff yesterday.

As far as the drain system, I don't really have a system yet! I've given it a lot of thought. I will not be using any gray/black tanks for this installation. For now, I just want to connect directly to the sewer line with no tank. In the pictures you can see the orientation of the sink to the toilet. It's only a couple of feet away. There is very little room to work with. I ordered a hepvo sink trap for the sink. There is a lot of steel framing under the trailer particularly in that area. My plan was to come straight down from the sink through the floor and put an elbow as tight underneath the subfloor as I could get it and then I think I've figured out a way to connect it to the toilet drain. I'm trying to keep everything up high for ground clearance. I'm thinking of running one 3" 90 degree elbow off the toilet flange with the outlet of that one facing to the rear of the trailer and then glue in a second elbow with a 1.5" side inlet like this: http://www.homedepot.com/p/NIBCO-3-in-x ... /100678004 with the side inlet on top (for the sink drain connection) and then one of these: http://www.amazon.com/Valterra-T1029-1- ... B002N5T4PM. Probably kind of hard to picture. Do you think it's a terrible idea to install a toilet with no holding tank? For the foreseeable future I plan on using this trailer at parks i.e. no dry camping. If you think this idea is unworkable please let me know. I think it will work fine for my purposes but what do I know?! When I get my pvc supplies together I'll try and mock up and photograph what I intend to do. The information you've given me so far is very helpful giving me a better perspective. The only vent I thought I would need with this configuration was for the sink. I ordered a hepvo for that: http://www.amazon.com/Waterless-RV-Sink ... ords=hepvo. I figured water in the bowl of the toilet would keep gasses away. I think maybe I only know enough about this to make me dangerous! I think you are saying that my sink connection to the toilet line should be above the flange? So, if the toilet got backed up (clogged) you don't want the sink drain to be below the toilet drain. That makes sense. Pretty unlikely that the toilet would get backed up. There won't be a holding tank and the toilet will pretty much never see solids but I definitely see your point.

I don't expect you to spend time trying to envision what I'm trying to do but if you think I'm gonna do something really dumb then please, by all means, let me know! The only way I could think of to connect the sink drain to the toilet from above would be on the interior and that I cannot imagine.

I've got the toilet where it is shown in the pictures (not installed yet) and the sink. No holding tanks. I want to tie those two lines together underneath the trailer and connect the park's sewer line directly to the toilet. If you think it's a really dumb idea to not go with a holding tank please let me know. Thanks for the help.

Paul

[48Rob]

Paul,

Faucets are 1/2" pipe thread.

You can use a 1/2" quest coupler to adapt the faucet thread to quest, or use a female to male adapter.

No matter that you have a holding tank, or none, you should have a vent.
If you have a holding tank, gas will form. If connected to a city sewer, gas will be present in their pipes, which will want to vent through yours.

I understand your thoughts of using the 90 with an end outlet, but you can do better with regard to height by placing a 3 x 3 x 1.5 tee in a horizontal run and dropping the sink line in from above.
You are starting with the toilet, dropping straight down into a 90, then running horizontally to your outlet point.
The sink line can be run above the floor to the area you can best locate the tee, where it can drop down. In this way you can avoid all the steel framing.
Another consideration is placing a 90 so close to the toilet outlet. The 90 is generally 12" or more below the toilet. It may or may not be an issue if closer.

For the sink connection, not above the flange, but above the top of the toilet bowl, as if the toilet backed up, it would spill out once it reached the top of the bowl.

Do you "need" a holding tank? I can't say. If you do, now is the time to consider it as the two systems are completely different and not compatible.

Connecting to a sewer is far easier and much less expensive. Flush and it all goes away.
Using a holding tank is nice if there is no sewer, but you trade flushing and forgetting, to flushing now and mopping up later.
Portable toilets are a good compromise, for many.
Holding tank or portable; you flush and then later empty and flush out. Either one is not a lot of fun, but nothing is free...
With a sewer, you will still have to connect a pipe or hose, and upon leaving, remove the hose and store...somewhere... Flushing doesn't always get them sparkling clean...

Rob