Hello from the wooden boat world

[jalmberg]

Hi folks,

I own two wooden boats -- a dingy that I built, and a larger boat that I try to keep up with -- so when my wife Helena suggested we drive across the country, I went looking for small camper that could be home-built from wood and, well, discovered teardrops.

I'll probably start my build in about a month, with the goal of finishing before the end of the year (I'm in FL.) I'm *hoping* to rent a storage unit that will allow me to build under cover. Will be aiming for a 'work boat' finish, as we call it in the wooden boat world, which means nice but not too fussy. I expect it to be in pretty rough shape by the time we put a few thousand miles on it, so don't want to cringe every time a stone hits it.


A teardrop has to be easier than building with all curves, right?

I'm sure I'll have lots of questions as I go along. Sounds like fun!

-- John

[Roly Nelson]

John, welcome aboard. With your woodworking skills, you will problably build a one-of-a-kind woody teardrop. Get that trailer frame and start letting the sawdust fly. If your first breakdown trip is to So Calif, swing by and visit, as there is always room for a td. BTW, I hope your construction enclosure is air conditioned, down there in Florida. Good luck.
Roly, the li'l ol' woody td guy, way out West

[jalmberg]

That's nice wood work on yours! I'm not aiming so high as that. Maybe for #2!

The plan is to set sail from southern FL around the 1st of the year and proceed in a leisurely fashion to the Grand Canyon, and on to San Diego. Then we will drive up the coast to Port Townsend, WA, which is the wooden boat capital of the west, where we will stop for a year or so, buy a boat, and sail westward from there.

That's if my wife doesn't come to her senses along the way.

I'm hoping heat is not going to be a problem at that time of year. Cold will probably be an issue in the mountains, but we'll bring warm sleeping bags and maybe a small 12V heater? Not sure yet.

[Kergan]

jalmberg - "Here's one thing I learned: always use the same ruler to measure with. Believe it or not, not all rulers are exactly the same. You can drive yourself crazy by using two rulers that don't quite match up."

Fantastic blog site! I just got started on your site, And this gem jumped out at me.

Glad to have you join.

As a waterproof woodworker, you may soon become a board guru in your field. I am planning on a wood and canvas build which led me to classic wooden canoes and then you show up!

[jalmberg]

LOL... 'waterproof woodworker', I love that!

Do you mean you are building a skin-on-frame teardrop? That would be kind of awesome. Would it work?

-- John

[Alan_H]

Welcome aboard. I'm from Central FL myself.
Haven't started my build, but have been doing a lot of looking at the wooden boat world. I want to build light but sturdy, and I'm thinking that the stitch&glue method looks like it might serve what I'm looking for. It has been discussed here a bit, and CLC built one already, so it must work.
Mine will be a little bigger though, so I'm still designing.
I'm going to check out your stuff, but you have found a nice and friendly place for any and all questions on TD's. Feel free to start a build journal so we can keep up with your progress.

[Kergan]

LOL... 'waterproof woodworker', I love that!

Do you mean you are building a skin-on-frame teardrop? That would be kind of awesome. Would it work?

-- John

I hope so. Others (i.e. rowerwet and others) say they like the results they got. I have not tried yet.

I plan to use 10 or 12 oz. cotton duck and Tightbond II over plywood with a topcoat of good paint for UV protection.

The 'Foamie' crowd inspired me down this path. The wooden canoe sites validated their efforts in my mind.
- - - - - - - - -
Curved woodworking that kept you from drowning? Out of sight of land!?

I'm very impressed. My Viking genes scream for a clinker-built ship and a monastery to pillage.
... But I digress.

[jalmberg]

Oh, that's different from skin on frame. Skin on frame would lose the plywood. What you mean is similar to a canvas deck.

Plain old oil paint would be better/cheaper than glue, IMHO.

Tricky to do correctly, but beautiful. What will you trim the edges with? Teak trim?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kergan]

Oh, that's different from skin on frame. Skin on frame would lose the plywood. What you mean is similar to a canvas deck.

Plain old oil paint would be better/cheaper than glue, IMHO.

Tricky to do correctly, but beautiful. What will you trim the edges with? Teak trim?

Yes, canvas decking. Skin on frame would be awesome and super light but I would need insulation on account of ...Florida.
I have no idea about trimming the edges, I was planning to just use more glue. Not only am I not a boatwright, I'm not even a carpenter. However, I am an artist and have used lots of different paints. Now I have even more things to learn about. I presume oil paint stays more flexible than Titebond. Are there any other benefits?

Valspar Ultra 4000 White Gloss Oil-Based Enamel Interior/Exterior Paint is about $30 per gallon, Titebond II is $18. Not an issue if it is better.

I used these links as a crash course intro what Skin-on-Frame is so I can ask better questions:

SoF links for the non-boaty people (like me):
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/07/howto/frame/index.htm
Is Dacron totally superior to Cotton Duck like this article suggests?

http://skin-boats.com/node?page=3
Have you any experience or knowledge with/about Pine Tar Soup?

I plan to move this subject to the Skinning thread if it grows.

Thanks,

Kergan.

[jalmberg]

You need to sort out the apples from the oranges.

For skin-on-frame, where the skin has to be strong enough to keep out water and take knocks from sharp rocks, stronger synthetics are obviously better, but for a 'simple' finish, canvas should be fine.

I guess the real question is why? Canvas makes a great finish for the deck of a boat, because it's very durable and provides a non-skid surface. I'm not sure what it adds to a teardrop, other than weight and complication. What are you hoping to achieve that you can't get with plain old paint?

-- John

[prohandyman]

John
Welcome to this addiction. It is fun...most of the time!
I started with a boat...sorta. A woodstrip canoe. 17 1/2 ft Redbird

Then Built a woodstrip camper.

Then built 30 more campers

[jalmberg]

Wow. They look great. Is there anything backing up the strips on the teardrop?

[prohandyman]

Yes... 1/4" luan over a 1x2 framework

[Kergan]

I guess the real question is why? What are you hoping to achieve that you can't get with plain old paint?
-- John

The short answer is I don't know. Maybe strength and watertightness.
I have a sturdy trailer with rails that can help support the walls. I wanted to use pressure treated 11/32 Southern yellow pine but am having difficulty locally sourcing it.
The canvas and glue/paint builders here seem very satisfied with their results, they say their wood looks new under the canvas after 4 years left outside.
I then considered using RevolutionPly 5mm Common Birch Plywood (Lowes) with interior framing for the walls and thicker struts for the roof with insulation. I was concerned that paint by itself would not be adequate to protect a thin interior-grade wood.
My design criteria are; weight, cost, and difficulty, generally in that order.

Thank you for your feedback.

[jalmberg]

Maybe strength and watertightness.

5mm is pretty thin. I guess a layer of canvas would strengthen it a bit, but the frame will do far more. A second sheet of ply on the other side of the frame (making a torsion box) would strengthen it even more.

Water protection will come from the paint, not the canvas. What the canvas will give you is a more durable finish than just paint, and it will look great.

I have no idea about trimming the edges, I was planning to just use more glue.

The biggest problem with canvas is it needs to be trimmed, because at the edges you just have ragged canvas.



Teak is nice for trim.



And you need to trim around any openings, like the door, and if you can't find a piece of canvas big enough to cover the whole side, you either need to sew a very neat seam (to hide it) or put a piece of trim over the seam, or just live with the seam.

So, not easy, but if you do it right, it will look amazing and give the wood long lasting protection -- on one side.

If you use a plywood that isn't rated for continuous exposure, and moisture gets into it, there's still a chance you could end up with problems. I haven't done any searches on this forum yet, but I bet there are cases of plywood delaminating or bubbling even with an unbroken finish on the outside. That's because ordinary plywood is usually made from trees with very low rot resistance. You get a small leak, water gets into the ply, and it starts to rot from the inside out.

That's why I'm thinking of using marine ply and either a good UV varnish, or oil-based paint, myself. Marine ply is a bit more expensive, but made from rot-resistant species (pretty much all ply is made with waterproof glue these days.) Just seal the edges with epoxy, and touch up the paint when it needs it, and it will last a very long time. There are lots of boats out there with painted plywood bottoms -- i.e. below the waterline -- so the combo is plenty good enough for a teardrop.

If I were going to invest all the time and work to finish the side with canvas, I would definitely want to be sure of the plywood underneath.