water proofing your wood

[GPW]

We can’t comment on what we can’t see.

[dancam]

1. It doesn’t really NEED paint , but if you leave it bare it would look nice with some full strength poly as a “finish” ...
2. Probably ... depends on the glue ... GG would stick ... T2 , I don’t really know ... Time for a test sample ...
3. You let the thinner DRY thoroughly , it evaporates ( couple days ) ... I painted Latex ext. house paint on my Big TD after the mix ... no problems .... stuck just fine ...

When ever in doubt ... test first ...

was the latex paint water based or acrylic enamel? is there a need to prime before painting? I had heard that latex paints don't stick well to oil based products. Thanks

[GPW]

Dan , I’ve been a professional Artist for 47 years now and I Know paint .. It’s my Job !!!

was the latex paint water based or acrylic enamel? ( It’s the same thing , Latex/Acrylic is water based… not to be confused , ALKYD paint is solvent based) is there a need to prime before painting? ( Priming prepares the surface providing good adhesion and a uniform base color to paint over… I always prime first, and if you let it dry a bit , you can sand it smooth ) I had heard that latex paints don't stick well to oil based products. ( True !!! You can paint Oil paints over Acrylics , but never Acrylic over Oil paint ( It will peel off, won’t stick) , unless it’s completely dried, still , not recommended !!! With the mix , the Mineral Spirits is allowed to flash off /evaporate , and the poly once completely dry is plastic and seems not to mind whatever you put on it . That and there’s no Film formed when used as a waterproofer … on a regular poly finished surface you’d have to sand it to create some ”tooth” for the paint to adhere to ... ) Thanks ( you’re more than Welcome)

Dan , apologies if I appear to be “short” sometimes , but there's only so much information to building a Foamie , and we’ve repeated it so many times over and over now , we’re starting to sound like a broken record (a Parrot ) … Apparently just presenting the material to read is insufficient … It was always assumed ( and amply demonstrated) that the individual builder would “ know better” interject their own ideas and methods as they saw fit ( encouraged) … A Foamie is the “Thinking Man’s “ trailer …

The old Foamie motto : when in doubt , TEST it !!!

[QueticoBill]

I suspect dan meant the difference between latex paint with a combination of vinyl and acrylic resins versus the 100% acrylics, which are amazing. I painted my 110+ year old house with oil primer and oil - semi-gloss - top coat (after removing aluminum and stripping the original wood clapboards) 20+ years ago and it lasted great, but with the availability of 100% acrylic, wasn't going to do oil again, and I have no concerns about it peeling. No doubt the Mad Dog primer (that seems a lot like Glidden Gripper but can't say for sure) helps that. I've first did house painting over 50 years ago and the improvements and developments in water based paints are amazing. I know several professional painters and I don't know one that wouldn't put good quality water based paint over oil today. In my professional life I specify 100% acrylic - PPG Breakthrough - for wood stage floors - whatever the previous finish is - even spar. Does pretty well under rolling loads and continual applying and pulling up tape.

Related to "the mix", I'm surprised I see no mention of the the USFS's Forest Product Laboratories preservative, which is basically "the mix" with paraffin added. At end of this page: https://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/finl ... 13_002.pdf.

[GPW]

Great find Bill !!! parrafin … we’ll have to try that , although it does sound a bit dangerous … Odd, at first thought it seems like the wax (oil) and poly Plastic wouldn’t agree, and that would hinder drying …

We tried the Gripper after a most thorough surface sanding /prep of my balcony porch and then an expensive latex “porch paint” ( PPG ) , and it lasted a couple years , then is peeling off now … Thinking of trying oil based now , only on that porch .

[QueticoBill]

The original instructions for the FPL preservative I saw in Old House Journal in 1980s or 1990s just said to mix it on a warm day in the sun. Mineral spirits in a 5 gallon pail, and drop in a pound of paraffin, let sit in sun til lit melts/dissolves, than add spar. Didn't seem dangerous that way. Very "aromatic".

Can't help with your porch floor. I did mine same way - Mad Dog primer and a Benjamin Moore porch paint - has been fine. I stopped DIY house painting a few years back - just not as steady on a ladder at 65 and I fell off a scaffold 5 or so years ago - and have a pretty highly regarded painter in this area filled with historic houses - and he seems pretty well versed and closely connected with the paint manufacturers' reps.

[dancam]

Dan , I’ve been a professional Artist for 47 years now and I Know paint .. It’s my Job !!!

was the latex paint water based or acrylic enamel? ( It’s the same thing , Latex/Acrylic is water based… not to be confused , ALKYD paint is solvent based) is there a need to prime before painting? ( Priming prepares the surface providing good adhesion and a uniform base color to paint over… I always prime first, and if you let it dry a bit , you can sand it smooth ) I had heard that latex paints don't stick well to oil based products. ( True !!! You can paint Oil paints over Acrylics , but never Acrylic over Oil paint ( It will peel off, won’t stick) , unless it’s completely dried, still , not recommended !!! With the mix , the Mineral Spirits is allowed to flash off /evaporate , and the poly once completely dry is plastic and seems not to mind whatever you put on it . That and there’s no Film formed when used as a waterproofer … on a regular poly finished surface you’d have to sand it to create some ”tooth” for the paint to adhere to ... ) Thanks ( you’re more than Welcome)

Dan , apologies if I appear to be “short” sometimes , but there's only so much information to building a Foamie , and we’ve repeated it so many times over and over now , we’re starting to sound like a broken record (a Parrot ) … Apparently just presenting the material to read is insufficient … It was always assumed ( and amply demonstrated) that the individual builder would “ know better” interject their own ideas and methods as they saw fit ( encouraged) … A Foamie is the “Thinking Man’s “ trailer …

The old Foamie motto : when in doubt , TEST it !!!

I know, thats why im asking you

With the being short and everyone should be able to find the info they need because its been discussed for 10 years- this is the thread thats supposed to be for pointing people to when they ask a question about it so they can read it and have no more questions. I read it and had questions. I couldnt click on that hyperlink for some reason on my phone but this is supposed to be the concise thread on waterproofing wood right?

I read it through the first time and thought you all did the 4 different mixes. I read through it again yesterday and i am not sure why i thought that even though it would make more sense, so that was my fault.

I also wasnt and still am not sure about the coats thing- if people are just layering it on all at once until the wood wont soak up more, then when it dries its done. Or if people are doing 1 coat, letting it dry, another coat, letting it dry and so on until the wood wont soak up more. Im hoping its the first since i did about 6coats yesterday all in a row but 4hts later it wasnt dry yet so i went home without applying more.

With the acrylic latex enamel there is some difference since it melts foam and seemed to soften tb2 whereas regular latex didnt. But good to know there is no difference for over this stuff. And thanks for the explanation as to why.
From what you had said before i had assumed no primer, so im glad i asked. Ive never had luck with exterior latex primer and paint over wood before so hopefully it goes better onto wood with the mix.






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[GPW]

"but this is supposed to be the concise thread on waterproofing wood right? “

ER, Not really !!! We’re all Volunteers here … not scientists or Experts that one could hold accountable … ( why we recommend so much individual testing)

JMHO, putting all the waterproofing coats on at one time .. May ( or may not) be the best way … alla prima , yes, that will take some time to dry because the outer coats dry first, sealing off the surface , leaving the inner mix to remain wet longer … ( good or bad ? I dunno’ )

Old school , one would paint on one coat, let it dry , and repeat till sealed to satisfaction.

[lthomas987]

So, if I use the mix on some wood, do we think contact cement will still bond with it? I know we've talked about not sealing parts where we want to glue or paint for better bond, but contact cement is sort of a different animal. This is for a plywood surface that will end up having to live outdoors. And I'm going to glue a rubberized surface to the top it with contact cement.

[tony.latham]

So, if I use the mix on some wood, do we think contact cement will still bond with it? I know we've talked about not sealing parts where we want to glue or paint for better bond, but contact cement is sort of a different animal. This is for a plywood surface that will end up having to live outdoors. And I'm going to glue a rubberized surface to the top it with contact cement.

I see no reason it wouldn't work since contact cement is the choice for glueing formica which of course is non-porous. (And I would argue it would be a bad idea with wood glue.)

If it were me, I would run my random orbital over the wood with some 220 grit just to give the cement some "tooth" to grab.

Tony

[dancam]

So, if I use the mix on some wood, do we think contact cement will still bond with it? I know we've talked about not sealing parts where we want to glue or paint for better bond, but contact cement is sort of a different animal. This is for a plywood surface that will end up having to live outdoors. And I'm going to glue a rubberized surface to the top it with contact cement.

Wont the contact cement and rubber keep water from getting in? Using it on exposed surfaces sure, but im not sure why you want to use ut under contact cement and rubber.

"but this is supposed to be the concise thread on waterproofing wood right? “

ER, Not really !!! We’re all Volunteers here … not scientists or Experts that one could hold accountable … ( why we recommend so much individual testing)

JMHO, putting all the waterproofing coats on at one time .. May ( or may not) be the best way … alla prima , yes, that will take some time to dry because the outer coats dry first, sealing off the surface , leaving the inner mix to remain wet longer … ( good or bad ? I dunno’ )

Old school , one would paint on one coat, let it dry , and repeat till sealed to satisfaction.

Thanks. With the water drop test- i tried it. Bare wood took about an hour to soak up the drop of water. An hour and a half after putting some drops on various places on what i waterproofed they were still there but smaller. But i dont know if that was from soaking into the wood or evaporation :/ seems like a bit of a strange test or im doing it wrong. Ill try a drop on something like metal and see how much evaporates after an hour and a half.
Also, is having chalky white powder spots normal after its dried?



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[lthomas987]

So, if I use the mix on some wood, do we think contact cement will still bond with it? I know we've talked about not sealing parts where we want to glue or paint for better bond, but contact cement is sort of a different animal. This is for a plywood surface that will end up having to live outdoors. And I'm going to glue a rubberized surface to the top it with contact cement.

Wont the contact cement and rubber keep water from getting in? Using it on exposed surfaces sure, but im not sure why you want to use ut under contact cement and rubber.

Because it's not really a trailer thing. It's a teeter for dog agility and the rubber is a bit of heavily textured conveyor belt that isn't solid but more open and is present for dog grip, not for protection of the wood. But I'm gluing it to some plywood then screwing that to the steel frame.

[GPW]

Dan , once you prime and paint it you should be OK … All that goes a long way to slowing /preventing water intrusion .
The control is a piece of untreated wood , try the drop test on that . Then you can see the difference .

[tony.latham]

Wont the contact cement and rubber keep water from getting in? Using it on exposed surfaces sure, but surely not sure why you want to use ut under contact cement and rubber.

If there's any separation of the rubber cement, water will enter if it has a chance. If the wood isn't sealed, it could easily enter the wood through the sides, get under the glue and cause delamination.

Camp trailers see all sorts of weather events and spills. I'd absolutely encapsulate with the mix.

T

[Fiddlin'Billy]

So, how does the wood look after waterproofing? Does it look blotchy or is it a nice wood look. Or do you need to stain it to look nice?