I hope Castro doesn't die--tonight.

[madjack]

Kurt, believe me the folks in Miami were not cheering for Castro's return to good health...quite the opposite.......

MJ, I hope you know I didn't think they were cheering for his recovery. I'm not sure Raul is much of an improvement though. Oh well, he's not young either. It's a matter of time before things change Bigtime in Cuba.

...my reading indicates that the power structure of Cuba is pretty well entrenched far beyond the Castros, I wouldn't look for major change for a while yet...heaven forbid the neo-cons do something stupid (yea right, I'll hold my breath on that)
madjack

[Laredo]

I'd take issue with Kurt if I thought he'd understand me on this point ...

"never had a dictator" is arguable IMHO since 2000's so-called election.

But that wasn't what brought me to this thread.

I know we have our share of folks who like nothing better than picking fights. I'm one myself sometimes.

I was just pointing out that yep, the US has been interfering with Cuba, since well before WW2. The thing is, it ain't just Cuba. But the Castro brothers are in their "golden years" already, and change in Cuba in the near future is as inevitable as it was in China after Mao.

I do hope the people who live there end up better off.

[Ira]

I'm hearing a lot more of the local/Cuban news on this than a lot of you guys, and while that sure doesn't make me an expert and sure doesn't mean what I'm hearing is correct, this is the direction I think it's going to go based on what I've heard and who I heard it from:

Once Castro is gone, it's all over for the old system, and it seems to lean much more heavily on it getting a lot better from a democracy/"U.S." standpoint. And the administration has a pretty good plan to push it along.

Raul doesn't have the charisma (plus he's a super-conirmed alcoholic), and the country has no STRUCTURE to support any kind of smooth transition to life after Fidel. And while Cuba is considered communism, it's really more like fascism--just like Peron in Argentina.

I mean, Raul didn't even show his FACE today.

And once Castro is dead, a lot of other guys don't have to kiss ass any more, and they're looking to settle scores.

You think the average Cuban, plus those in authority, still give a crap about some stupid communist ideal? Heck, all they want is a Pet Cool for their hut and a dependable power supply to RUN it! (See how how I so cleverly brought this back to the subject of TDs?)

And as far as bad-mouthing the U.S. George...that it's all our fault and everything's ALWAYS been our fault...I'd like to introduce you to about 800,000 Cuban-Americans living 25 miles from me, as well as a million or two of their friends and relatives still in Cuba dying to get out.

And let's get THEIR opinion on the subject.

They're the only ones that matter. Not the ones Castro parades in front of a TV camera because he's going to give them an extra chicken that month for doing it.

[alaska teardrop]

But what does any of that have to do with Ira having to drive into Miami?

Driving to Miami

[Kurt (Indiana)]

I'd take issue with Kurt if I thought he'd understand me on this point ...

"never had a dictator" is arguable IMHO since 2000's so-called election.

Laredo, I hate to argue politics and religion (learned that at an early age). I don't know about you, but I voted in every National election for the past 40 years. I remember having a choice of leaders all that time. Do they have the choice of leadership in Cuba?
Regardless of how much political mischeif goes on, we still have a vote. As bad as it seems, it could be a lot worse.
Too bad a lot of us won't be around to read the history books in 30 years.
Enjoy the freedoms we have and enjoy the teardrop. That's why we're all here.

[GeorgeTelford]

Hi Ira

I dont believe all the bull Castro put out either, but to even Imagine that the USA is totally blameless with regard to Cuba is stretching the known fact's

I dont think you can base the Collective Cuban viewpoint on what a few disaffected Cubans say.

The USA only supports democracy when the democratic elections are not going to elect a communist leader/goverment and there are many many examples of the USA actually supporting dictatorships (when it suits them) How many times as the USA supported terrorist's? (except they are usually called freedom fighters then...)

America is a great great country, but Americans do rather tend to bury their heads in the sand over what their goverment is doing abroad, sometimes openly and sometimes it takes years to come out.

[Mook]

In the "for what it's worth" column......

George, and anyone else who wants to read.

It's pretty easy to sit back and second guess and point fingers about who is wrong and who is right.

My guess is that while we in the US have a less than stellar legacy stemming from "Gunboat Diplomacy" I don't see where the UK is any less guilty of meddling in affairs that they have no clue about.

RE: That whole Colonial India thing.

This is my point.

All of the "Superpowers" of the world are guilty of "assuming" that smaller countries need rescuing and would be better off if they would just run the place like we say. In the process, we can exploit they're (insert whatever natural resource here) for our own benefit.

We've (the civilized world, yes the UK included) have done it from the time of the Inca's right up til now in the Middle East. While it has undoubtedly changed the global map, history proves that there have been varying degrees of success, but mostly on the negative side.
Nuff said, I'm out.

[Ira]

But what does any of that have to do with Ira having to drive into Miami?

Driving to Miami

Every so often, a few show up north by me in Boca and Pompano Beach; it's not just Miami and the Keys.

It's hard to properly navigate a Goodyear tire.

And if a guy is going to risk his life doing that, things must be really GREAT on that island!

[alaska teardrop]

Ira,

I'm really not sure to which part of Florida that these Cuban refugees were headed. Maybe you remember the story? They never made it. The Coast Guard sunk their craft and returned them to Cuba.

I saved the pictures, because I was intrigued with their rig. Always wondered how it was propelled. It was driven across the beach & into the water. So it must have had all four wheels. Maybe a propeller off a PTO?

BTW. I posted the pic to lighten up on your thread. Hope that was OK.

Fred

[angib]

Mook,

I don't argue with anything you've said.

But "Now it's our turn to be as selfish as the Spanish, the Dutch and the Brits were" is not a great moral justification!

Andrew

[Mook]

Andrew,

I think you're rading too much into my post. My point is that NO ONE is guiltless ourselves included.

There IS NO JUSTIFICATION for meddling the affairs other soverign countries.

It appears the only motivation for "help" from other richer more developed countries to smaller ones is greed.

[Ira]

Fred--I don't remember that image.

99% of the time, they're not powered at all--but you're probably onto something with this one. They probably rigged some prop onto the drive shaft.

In Key Largo, there's a big bar/restaurant called the Caribbean Reef Club, or something like that. (Don't exactlly remember.) It's where they filmed a lot of the movie Key Largo, and rumor/legend has it that Lauren Bacall goes there every year to drop a rose in the water on Bogart's birthday.

Anyway, when you walk in, they have a raft leaning against the wall that was used by Cubans. It's pretty weird/shocking to see something like this first-hand, to think that maybe 10 people loaded into this tiny little thing and took their chances to escape the island.