Read this quote in a recent news article and......

[Elumia]

I found it pretty interesting... Please this is not about bashing politicians or immigrants, civil discussion only. I was just struck by the comment and wanted to share.

Mexicans fear U.S. immigration plan
full text:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070518/ap_ ... outrage_10

Gilberto Escalante, a 41-year-old fisherman from Topolobampo in Sinaloa state, said the current guest worker program is better than the congressional plan because it gives Mexicans the option to freely enter and leave the U.S. while maintaining their lives in Mexico — instead of forcing them to choose between the two countries.

"We don't want the house or the latest car in the U.S. We want to go and work so that our families can have a good life in Mexico," said Escalante, who came to the industrial hub of Monterrey to apply for a visa to work on fish and shrimp boats off the coast of Mississippi.



Shouldn't the government/businesses in Mexico be doing something to help make sure that Mr. Escalante has an opportunity to live the good life in Mexico? How can he live the good life if he has to travel thousands of miles to work? Doesn't the good life include actually being with your family? Is life really that bad in Mexico? How much sacrifice would you be willing to make to give your family the "good life"?

Mark

[Laredo]

What I know of Mexico is not much firsthand, but I do think they have some serious problems down there -- for example, if you're a journalist, Mexico is the most dangerous place in the world to work except for Iraq.

That's right. Mexico has more violence (related mostly to the drug trafficking cartels, some of which undoubtedly have roots in Colombia, although they are having a revolution led by some indigenous tribes) than any other country in the world except Iraq. Kidnappings and murders, particularly of law enforcement personnel, are a commonplace in the interior and even parts of northern Mexico. Nuevo Laredo is perhaps the most infamous location right now.

And the government in Mexcio historically has not been on the side of the common man or woman in that country. This is a shame. It would not be beyond the powers of a government that wanted to do right by its people to create an economic infrastructure as stable as China's and as clean as Canada's, but the Mexican government seems to be functionally incapable of doing so, if not actively indifferent to the idea.

I get sick of hearing how "illegal immigrants" steal jobs and services in the US. They come here to work; it is no secret that for many of them, the journey to that job is literally a threat to liberty, limb and life.

[Nitetimes]

They come here to work; it is no secret that for many of them, the journey to that job is literally a threat to liberty, limb and life.

Good, a little more so and maybe more of them would stay home!!

[wolfix]

The Mexican violence is generally near the border. Interior Mexico is as safe as most places in the US. Safer then many. But the border towns are dangerous. On both sides of the border.
Most illegals work for the US citizen. So who is the criminal? The man who works to eat, or the citizen that hires them for lower wages?
If the illegals were sent home, we would see meat and food prices skyrocket. When you receive your SS check, remember that illegals pay into it, but receive no money back. Our SS system is barely kept afloat as is.

I love it when Californians/Arizonians say they should send them home...... Maybe they are home, and the Californians need to go back where they came from.....

It's all a matter of perspective.

[Laredo]

Just this week the ICE raided two dairies near Amherst, about a half hour northwest of where I live. They picked up 17 illegals -- 12 of whom they had picked up at those exact same two dairies last July.

Now, you tell me -- did those dairy owners really believe that people who were deported less than a year ago are now US Citizens?

No, they did not.
One of the dairy owners defends the practice by saying working in a dairy is a job no American will do.
That is a flat out lie.
There are US citizens working in other dairies in the same county.

There is a nasty practice on construction sites -- hire day laborers, promise to pay them on Friday, and call "la migra" on Thursday.

It is indeed the US citizens who do the hiring who should be held criminally liable.

[wolfix]

This past summer I worked a jobsite that was in a small development. There were illegals all over. There was just one way into this 2 block long development and one way out.
All of a sudden I looked around and everyone was gone........ Then I noticed a INS car coming down the street. Evidently there was a sentry there watching for INS and for 2 weeks of this happening I finally figured out that INS really didn't want to catch anyone.
Across the street is a Mexican food place. I watched one day as the Illegals left thru the back door. 5 minutes later INS came down the street. They entered and found no illegals. How did the illegals know INS was coming????? They knew........

[Ira]

What do you guys feel about the proposed amnesty program, though they don't want to call it that?

From my ultra-liberal pro-immigration viewpoint, this would seem to be a great thing, right? But I don't perceive it that way--because I know this has become part of Bush's agenda simply because he has a Mexican sister-in-law. This is how this guy operates, and trying to look into any deeper meaning when it comes to anything he does turns up nothing.

Oy, sorry for the rant--but can someone explain to me how Ruper Murdoch was able to become a U.S. citizen IMMEDIATELY (he had to in order to own U.S. TV stations but he wouldn't have otherwise), but poor Hector Gonzalez has to be worried about being deported for cutting your grass or fixing your roof?

Finally, I have no use at all for the send them back where they came from attitude. They're human beings, for Christ's sake.

And as an athiest, I'm amazed at how I hold this viewpoint, yet so many self-proclaimed Christians don't.

[Laredo]

Hey, Ira.

"Send em all back where they came from" is alright by me, as long as all the Italians, Irish, Germans, Swedes, Russians, Chinese, Africans, British, French, Spanish and Vikings have to go back where they came from too.

We're all immigrants -- even the Amerinds -- some a few more generations removed from the journey, some a few less. It's the height of arrogance and cowardice to pretend otherwise, and the height of stupidity and deceitfulness to say a man who makes a living with his hands isn't as good a candidate for citizenship as a man who makes others listen to his filthy money.

In the Star Trek universe, the cardinal sin is xenophobia. Would that we could bring to pass so enlightened an outlook in America (again, because we had it before; it was called the melting pot and it made us greater by far than the sum of our parts) again.

I don't know if you read "Fred on Everything". He moved to Mexico five years ago, and his take in today's column -- and it's a peach -- is all about the difference between the way Mexican people treat each other and the way people in the US treat each other.

We have to stop letting the Murdochs and Bushes of the world divide us, distract us, demoralize us, because if we don't they're going to win. We can't afford that -- as a nation or a people.

[doug hodder]

civil discussion only.

Just be good everyone, there is some serious potential here... Doug

[Nitetimes]

When you receive your SS check, remember that illegals pay into it, but receive no money back.

I'm curious just how they do that without a social security number.
For the most part they work for cash so there is no paper and no way for them to pay into it.
If they had a SS number they wouldn't be illegal.

Our SS system is barely kept afloat as is.

And thus my point.

[Nitetimes]

"Send em all back where they came from" is alright by me, as long as all the Italians, Irish, Germans, Swedes, Russians, Chinese, Africans, British, French, Spanish and Vikings have to go back where they came from too.

Well now that's just about the dumbest remark I've heard in a while.
I'm always amazed by people that always want to compare apples and oranges.

If the immigration isn't slowed down in this country soon..... well you figure it out.

[wolfix]

I'm curious just how they do that without a social security number.
For the most part they work for cash so there is no paper and no way for them to pay into it.
If they had a SS number they wouldn't be illegal.

Most of them have fake documentation. They pay taxes when they work for the meat/food and construction industries. The majority of illegals do work in places that tax them........ That's why the owners of these business's are just as guilty, if not more then the illegals. If a person wants to vent against someone, try venting against the US citizens that created the problem.

Our SS system is barely kept afloat as is.

And thus my point.[/quote]

That is why the government is turning a blind eye to this. The SS is getting a gift from the illegals. And the people who count on SS can breathe a little easier knowing there will be funds available.

Well now that's just about the dumbest remark I've heard in a while.
I'm always amazed by people that always want to compare apples and oranges.

Maybe the Mexicans are where they come from...... At least in the SW USA. They come because there is a enviroment for them to exist. But people don't want to deal with that. They just want to build bigger fences,hire more guards, and want cheaper food. When the illegals go home, and food prices skyrocket, maybe we can have a "Boycott Food Day" and send whoever a message.

* I bet real Americans[Natives] are laughing their ass off when they hear about illegal coming to the US..........

[Steve Nikkel]

The Front Door......Either Ellis or Angel Islands. For years we have ignored the conquest of the western US by those who think they're better than everyone else.....RULES?......We don need no steekin Rules....Oh yeah the $9/hr wages big agri-business pays don't get US workers in that they're correct, however they wont go broke paying $12.50 and they'd find workers at that rate

Hey, Ira.

"Send em all back where they came from" is alright by me, as long as all the Italians, Irish, Germans, Swedes, Russians, Chinese, Africans, British, French, Spanish and Vikings have to go back where they came from too.

We're all immigrants -- even the Amerinds -- some a few more generations removed from the journey, some a few less. It's the height of arrogance and cowardice to pretend otherwise, and the height of stupidity and deceitfulness to say a man who makes a living with his hands isn't as good a candidate for citizenship as a man who makes others listen to his filthy money.

In the Star Trek universe, the cardinal sin is xenophobia. Would that we could bring to pass so enlightened an outlook in America (again, because we had it before; it was called the melting pot and it made us greater by far than the sum of our parts) again.

I don't know if you read "Fred on Everything". He moved to Mexico five years ago, and his take in today's column -- and it's a peach -- is all about the difference between the way Mexican people treat each other and the way people in the US treat each other.

We have to stop letting the Murdochs and Bushes of the world divide us, distract us, demoralize us, because if we don't they're going to win. We can't afford that -- as a nation or a people.

[mwatters]

I've no problem with immigrants.

I've got a big problem however with people who think they can ignore the laws of the country and do whatever they damned well please. That's what the illegals are doing.

The idea that somehow the US is wrong to think that it (like every other country on the planet) should have the ability and right to regulate immigration is galling.

I don't for a second believe that the Washington goons are remotely thinking about the welfare of the illegals. They sure as hell aren't concerned with the welfare of those living here legally. They just see 12 million shiny new potentially grateful voters.

How many here have actually spent time living and working in another country. I have. We lived in Canada for a few years in the late 90's. I was able to get a Work Authorization ONLY when my employer was able to demonstrate that they were unable to find a Canadian to fill the position. My wife however was not able to get a work authorization (my having one didn't automatically qualify her for squat) - so she had to drive across the border every damned day to work. The paperwork involved in our living in Canada had to be renewed EVERY year at rather significant expense as well. It wasn't convenient. It wasn't easy. But it wouldn't have occurred to us to try to steal somebody's personal information for her to get a job or to try to work under-the-table. It's illegal, immoral and those who DO engage in that sort of behavior are NOT the sort of people you'd want in your country anyway.

Does life in Mexico suck? Quite possible.
Is that our fault and/or responsibility? No.

mkw

[Ira]

If the immigration isn't slowed down in this country soon..... well you figure it out.

Gee-- WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN!? What are you AFRAID of?

That your daughter will marry a MEXICAN!?

Give me a break.

Immigration has been and will always continue to be a nation's greatest strength. That's why communist countires restrict EMIGRATION.

I mean, didn't you learn this stuff in the 5th grade? For Christ's sake--just look at those idiots in France.