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Texas, New Mexico, Louisiana, Arkansas & Oklahoma

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Postby Todah Tear » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:46 am

Hey guys,

Believe it or not, I am just now reading this thread. It does not surprise me that the Texas flag may be upside down. As I was moving around the graphics in the file that I used for the stickers, all the flags got flipped. It was more noticable on the other flags which explains why I must have missed it on the Texas flag. Definitely no offense was intended to Texans as I am from Texas. :lol:

Sorry about the upside down flag. If you have a plaque with one one it, just consider it as one of those collector's items. If I have a chance before BB, I will make some more plaques...w/the correct flag on them.

Additionally, whatever design that group settles on, I would like to suggest that we do not include a confederate flag, a swastika, or any other historically offensive symbol. This group does an excellant job of fostering an environment that is welcoming to people from all races and walks of life (...except for people who just don't like to have a good time; they just don't seem to stick around) Let's keep it that way. :thumbsup:

Sincerely,

Todah
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Postby Todah Tear » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:55 am

I like both Cindi' and Dooner's (It's kind of funky and reminds me of the vintage truck club back in East Texas) designs. As afar as the truck, goes I do agree that maybe the tires should be inflated. ...or maybe a logo with a car pulling the tear. One of the selling points of using a tear drop is that it can be easily pulled with a regular car; you don't have to have a V-6 or 8, don't need a 5th wheel. My two cents.

One thing to take into consideration with logos with lots of colors is that they become very expensive. Even if a design is origninally done in color, the design should be reproduceable in black and white for other uses.

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Postby Sonetpro » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:05 am

Todah Tear wrote:Hey guys,

Believe it or not, I am just now reading this thread. It does not surprise me that the Texas flag may be upside down. As I was moving around the graphics in the file that I used for the stickers, all the flags got flipped. It was more noticable on the other flags which explains why I must have missed it on the Texas flag. Definitely no offense was intended to Texans as I am from Texas. :lol:

Sorry about the upside down flag. If you have a plaque with one one it, just consider it as one of those collector's items. If I have a chance before BB, I will make some more plaques...w/the correct flag on them.

Additionally, whatever design that group settles on, I would like to suggest that we do not include a confederate flag, a swastika, or any other historically offensive symbol. This group does an excellant job of fostering an environment that is welcoming to people from all races and walks of life (...except for people who just don't like to have a good time; they just don't seem to stick around) Let's keep it that way. :thumbsup:

Sincerely,

Todah

Don't feel bad, I noticed on the way home from vacation last year that the welcome to Texas sign crossing the red river on I35 also had the flag upside down. :lol:
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Postby Ivar the Red » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:30 am

Yeah, I thought about the offencive flag thing after I wrote that, Didn't mean anything by it. It's just something you see alot of down here. Sorry.


Todah, I've bought only one thing for my tear so far, a sign with a fish on it. :lol: Maybe one of your plaques would look good on the shelf next to it. :lol: Just until spring(a.k.a. tear drop building season for those of us who are "shop-building challenaged") then hopefully it will find it's place of honor on a new SCTD! :lol:
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Postby Todah Tear » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:04 am

Sonetpro wrote:Don't feel bad, I noticed on the way home from vacation last year that the welcome to Texas sign crossing the red river on I35 also had the flag upside down. :lol:


* Sonetpro, that is just wild!!!! :lol: Thanks, now I don't feel so bad. If the state of Texas can spend high dollars on a sign that has the flag upside down and no one caught it before it was set in concrete, a small flag sticker is negligible.

* Ivan the Red (Are you a Viking? :thinking: ), no offense was taken. I'll do my best to get some more plaques made...and if I do get them done, one of them has your name on it!!

Beavers Bend or Bust!!

Todah
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Postby Ivar the Red » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:59 pm

Todah Tear wrote:
* Ivan the Red (Are you a Viking? :thinking: ), no offense was taken. I'll do my best to get some more plaques made...and if I do get them done, one of them has your name on it!!

Beavers Bend or Bust!!

Todah


Cool, thanks man. Only a Viking in a former life. :lol: My Great Grandparents were from Norway. See you at the Double B. :lol:
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Postby s4son » Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:41 pm

Miriam C. wrote:
Sonetpro wrote:
Dooner wrote:Starleen2- I like the one Cindy has on the flag like that. If everyone likes that one, that would be great.

I do have one question though; I can understand Mexico being added to the south central region, but how did Kansas and Missouri drop from the north. Look at the region map.
http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?t=7297

I don't mind including people, but we might as well not stop there. Let's bring in the rest of the states and Canada. And let's not forget our frosty friend, Heikki (Classic Finn). Let's take over the world. :lol:


We have so many from Kansas and Missouri that attend our gatherings we adopted them some time ago. :thumbsup:
The gif at the bottom is a picture of the plaques that Todah made for everybody. I display it proudly in my tear.


We have our flag and plaque and display them proudly. It is nice to be adopted. 8)



I thought we adopted them! :D

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Postby 2bits » Thu Feb 28, 2008 10:08 pm

Funny because a swastika is a Native Indian Symbol :? People are always turnin things around haha Not that I would want either of those on a logo personally!
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Postby Ivar the Red » Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:56 am

2bits wrote:Funny because a swastika is a Native Indian Symbol :? People are always turnin things around haha Not that I would want either of those on a logo personally!



I've heard that (about the swastika) before, But wasn't there something about the angle of it? :thinking:
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Postby Dooner » Fri Feb 29, 2008 8:35 am

Here is some history.

The History of the Swastika
From Jennifer Rosenberg,
Your Guide to 20th Century History.
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The swastika is an extremely powerful symbol. The Nazis used it to murder millions of people, but for centuries it had positive meanings. What is the history of the swastika? Does it now represent good or evil?

The Oldest Known Symbol

The swastika is an ancient symbol that has been used for over 3,000 years. (That even predates the ancient Egyptian symbol, the Ankh!) Artifacts such as pottery and coins from ancient Troy show that the swastika was a commonly used symbol as far back as 1000 BCE.

During the following thousand years, the image of the swastika was used by many cultures around the world, including in China, Japan, India, and southern Europe. By the Middle Ages, the swastika was a well known, if not commonly used, symbol but was called by many different names:

China - wan
England - fylfot
Germany - Hakenkreuz
Greece - tetraskelion and gammadion
India - swastika
Though it is not known for exactly how long, Native Americans also have long used the symbol of the swastika.
The Original Meaning

The word "swastika" comes from the Sanskrit svastika - "su" meaning "good," "asti" meaning "to be," and "ka" as a suffix.

Until the Nazis used this symbol, the swastika was used by many cultures throughout the past 3,000 years to represent life, sun, power, strength, and good luck.

Even in the early twentieth century, the swastika was still a symbol with positive connotations. For instance, the swastika was a common decoration that often adorned cigarette cases, postcards, coins, and buildings. During World War I, the swastika could even be found on the shoulder patches of the American 45th Division and on the Finnish air force until after World War II.

A Change in Meaning

In the 1800s, countries around Germany were growing much larger, forming empires; yet Germany was not a unified country until 1871. To counter the feeling of vulnerability and the stigma of youth, German nationalists in the mid-nineteenth century began to use the swastika, because it had ancient Aryan/Indian origins, to represent a long Germanic/Aryan history.

By the end of the nineteenth century, the swastika could be found on nationalist German volkisch periodicals and was the official emblem of the German Gymnasts' League.

In the beginning of the twentieth century, the swastika was a common symbol of German nationalism and could be found in a multitude of places such as the emblem for the Wandervogel, a German youth movement; on Joerg Lanz von Liebenfels' antisemitic periodical Ostara; on various Freikorps units; and as an emblem of the Thule Society.

Hitler and the Nazis

In 1920, Adolf Hitler decided that the Nazi Party needed its own insignia and flag. For Hitler, the new flag had to be "a symbol of our own struggle" as well as "highly effective as a poster." (Mein Kampf, pg. 495)

On August 7, 1920, at the Salzburg Congress, this flag became the official emblem of the Nazi Party.

In Mein Kampf, Hitler described the Nazis' new flag: "In red we see the social idea of the movement, in white the nationalistic idea, in the swastika the mission of the struggle for the victory of the Aryan man, and, by the same token, the victory of the idea of creative work, which as such always has been and always will be anti-Semitic." (pg. 496-497)

Because of the Nazis' flag, the swastika soon became a symbol of hate, antisemitism, violence, death, and murder.

What Does the Swastika Mean Now?

There is a great debate as to what the swastika means now. For 3,000 years, the swastika meant life and good luck. But because of the Nazis, it has also taken on a meaning of death and hate.

These conflicting meanings are causing problems in today's society. For Buddhists and Hindus, the swastika is a very religious symbol that is commonly used. Chirag Badlani shares a story about one time when he went to make some photocopies of some Hindu Gods for his temple. While standing in line to pay for the photocopies, some people behind him in line noticed that one of the pictures had a swastika. They called him a Nazi.

Unfortunately, the Nazis were so effective at their use of the swastika emblem, that many do not even know any other meaning for the swastika. Can there be two completely opposite meanings for one symbol?

In ancient times, the direction of the swastika was interchangeable as can be seen on an ancient Chinese silk drawing.

Some cultures in the past had differentiated between the clockwise swastika and the counter-clockwise sauvastika. In these cultures the swastika symbolized health and life while the sauvastika took on a mystical meaning of bad-luck or misfortune.

But since the Nazis use of the swastika, some people are trying to differentiate the two meanings of the swastika by varying its direction - trying to make the clockwise, Nazi version of the swastika mean hate and death while the counter-clockwise version would hold the ancient meaning of the symbol, life and good-luck.
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Postby Ivar the Red » Fri Feb 29, 2008 10:35 am

So much for the short answer. :lol: :lol:

But back to the logo, I agree it would be easier to omit the controversial, then to try to explain it away. :?

I have a family heritage in the south, the confederate flag is not a symbol of hate to me. But imagine me trying to explain that to a group of Bloods or Crips.
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Postby Dooner » Fri Feb 29, 2008 10:50 am

Sorry about the long answer. Thought it was interesting.

I don't want any symbols of hate on our logo either, but if you think about it, in some places the people see the American Flag as a symbol of hatred. The thing is, they have to have the hate in them first.

And as far as the logo goes, it doesn't seem like too many people care to have a single logo for the SCT. So I wasn't going to push the issue. If the group would like to do it, the should ring in their opinion. If not, we will stick with what we have.
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Postby Ivar the Red » Fri Feb 29, 2008 3:57 pm

I agree with a earlier statement; "sounds like a topic to discuss around a camp fire". See you at Beavers Bend!!! :lol:



P.S. Dooner can I use your truck logo in my sig line?
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Postby Dooner » Sat Mar 01, 2008 3:12 am

Ivar the Red wrote:I agree with a earlier statement; "sounds like a topic to discuss around a camp fire". See you at Beavers Bend!!! :lol:



P.S. Dooner can I use your truck logo in my sig line?


:thumbsup: You betcha. Feel free to use and abuse it. And change the color of the truck if you want. I don't mind a bit.

I'm still working on Beaver's Bend. :cry:
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Postby ARKPAT » Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:39 am

Dooner I like the Logo you made Up could I use It in my Signature Line?

:worship:

:thumbsup:

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