Fixing the problem - Now more questions...

[Alfred]

*** Addendum *** Originally this thread dealt with my 2x2 floor frame, which did not extend all the way to the trailer rim, and how to deal with this error. Now, I have built a new frame. See most recent posts at end of this thread! Thanks, AL.

Hi Gang,

OK, I've got a few of very specific build questions. Please see the pictures below. I framed out my subfloor frame with 2x2's, leaving 1/2" on either side to attach my 1/2" plywood side walls, which will go between the wood floor frame and the metal lip of the trailer. I know that I need to somehow 'seal' the part of the walls that are going to be sandwiched in down there, but I am not ready to seal the whole trailer yet, so what do I do? Once the walls are down there behind the lip, I won't be able to reach them to seal them.

Secondly, regarding bolting the floor to the trailer, should I just bolt the 2x2 frame, countersinking the bolts, then attach the 1/2" plywood floor on top of the already secured frame? , or should I run the bolts attaching the wood to the trailer through both the subfloor frame AND the 1/2" plywood floor. If I do the latter, can I countersink the bolts in the plywood?

Lastly, what kind of bolts did you use to secure the floor to the frame. I am assuming I just drill holes through the steel trailer frame, too?

See pictures below.

Thanks, Al in Asheville

[Miriam C.]

Alfred, I sealed the bottom edge of my walls with epoxy then glued them with PL construction. (not the blue stripe) I didn't put epoxy on the side where it met the framing. The glue should act as a sealer.

I would glue and attach the floor and the frame to the trailer. Counter sinking is good. That way if you ever need to get to the bolts you can. You can still fill the counter sink holes with something you can remove if needed.

[angib]

Once the walls are down there behind the lip, I won't be able to reach them to seal them.

You've got quite a problem there. As well as sealing them, I'm not sure how you're going to fasten the walls to the 2x2s, as the frame stops access for that too. If you're relying on just glue and a tight fit, you run the risk of wiping the glue off the joint as the ply goes in.

And I reckon this is a very critical area - you've got a water trap where the frame will pool water against the sidewall and 2x2 giving perfect conditions for fast rot. So a really good seal is needed between the sidewall and the frame to stop water getting into this area. If you're skinning with aluminum, it would be good to hang the aluminum down over/outside the frame.

One solution, which I admit sounds a bit drastic, would be to make the floor bolts accessible through the ply deck and once the floor is sheeted, lift the whole thing up on spacers by say 2-3" and build the trailer body 'in mid air'. Once the body is complete, drop it down onto the frame and bolt in place.

Andrew

[Alfred]

Dear Andrew and Miriam,

Thanks for the feedback. In retrospect, maybe I should have framed the wood out all the way to the edge, and planned to attach the walls at the floor - There is the option of adding another 1x2, to one side or the other, to widen the floor frame perhaps? Or I could bite the bullet, buy more 2x2's and start over -

Otherwise, I had thought about the potential problem of water getting down in there as it is, and was planning on caulking and maybe adding some sort of trim over the edges. Was not planning on using aluminum, at this point.

Meanwhile, as per Andrew's suggestion, having not bolted anything yet, perhaps I could build the cabin on cinderblocks until I get the walls on, then drop the whole kit & kaboodle on the trailer after I have sealed the walls?

Al in Asheville

[Miriam C.]

Al, there are a couple of things I wish I could take back. Now is the time to get it exactly the way you want it next year, or if your grandchildren ever camp in it.

[pete.wilson]

Hey

When "angib" mentioned the 2X2's which are presumed to be pine; would something like hickory be a bit better being a hardwood. And what about the plywood floors; I'm kinda fond of 1/2" & 3/4" birch plywood as it's made with more layers of plywood and therefore more stable than your normal plywood sheeting. Same question applies to any final trim outside if not using aluminum, hardwood over pine? Thanks.

Pete Wilson

[angib]

Pete, I think the most vulnerable material there is the bottom edge of the plywood sidewall - those cut edges of plywood are dying to soak up water, even through paint, so almost any other wood in the area has a longer life expectancy.

So I reckon protection is what is required and that means being able to coat that corner after it's assembled.

Though perhaps another idea would be to fill that groove (between the frame and 2x2) with thickened epoxy and just push the sidewall ply into place. There is no human condition that epoxy can't solve!

Andrew

[Mary K]

I assembled the floor and then bolted it to the frame.


Bottom side up in this pic.


Don't forget to countersink the holes big enough for a socket wrench to fit.



Then just fill the holes with wood filler and then cover with what ever flooring material you like. I just went with 12" vinyl tiles.





I can not remember what size bolts I used though Sorry.

I hope this helps.

Mk

[Alfred]

Hi Gang!

I went to my local Home Depot tonight to inquire about water sealing options. Specifically to ask about Epoxy and Fiberglass.

The salesperson recommended Thompson's Water Seal. It is an inexpensive option, but I don't think it will work for this purpose, will it?

There was another paint-on product designed to waterproof concrete, but not wood.

As far as epoxy, they had an epoxy kit to coat a garage floor, but not any marine epoxy.

Would any of these help?

Al Lyons in Asheville

[Miriam C.]

3 strikes. What you really need is marine epoxy. Inexpensive is making the floor frame over not putting a temporary waterproofer on.

Seriously replacing the floor framing with something higher so the sides can be screwed in is an easier and cheaper option. Just a lot of work.

Good luck whatever you decide.

[Elumia]

Just get a 2x3 to replace the 2x2 and build on top of it. Probably cost you less than $10

Are you making a solid plywood wall? If so, you could use an angle bracket to secure the side wall to the base.

If you are making a sandwich frame you can secure the wall to the base through your bottom plate.

I would seal any wood up good in that angle and run alum siding over the angle frame to keep the water out.

Mark

[Juneaudave]

Al...I couldn't tell whether you were building a woody or a aluminum sheeted.

If you are building a woody, I would go ahead and purchase a couple gallons of epoxy from Raka Raka, then use that to seal the edges of the ply and coat the exterior. These are the guys with good prices and service (oh yeah, their epoxy is good too).

If I were doing the aluminum thing, I would definately hang the sheeting over the frame to shield from water intrusion. In that case, ya know, you could probably get by with sealing the bottom of that ply with a good coating of the terrible "black goo", or maybe something like Bondo wood filler with a shot of paint. Epoxy is always better, but if you are sealed tight, water should be minimized. It is a terrible water trap that you have going, so you have to seal it or keep it out.

As far as bolting through the 2x stock, I used these self tapping trailer deck screws that I learned about from some other members. I just screwed throught the floor and framing into the steel. You could just go through the framimg and glue the floor right on.



Hope that gives you some ideas...Juneaudave

[Alfred]

Hi Gang,

Thanks to everyone for your valuable feedback. I talked to the fellow from RAKA today, who was very helpful and estimates about $156.00 for three gallons of epoxy to cover the whole camper. I bought some of those self-tapping trailer deck screws here in Asheville from "Asheville Bolt and Screw". I plan on doing some more work on the camper this week, after having had a few weeks w/no progress. Will keep you posted, thanks for the feedback -

AL in Asheville

[Alfred]

Hi Gang,

So this weekend I bit the bullet, discarded the old floor frame made from 2x2's and built a new frame from 2x4's, extending it all the way to the edge of the trailer rim. This solves the problem described in the preceding messages.

New frame from front.

New Frame from rear.

Close-up new frame from rear. Notice on the sides and front, the trailer rim comes up about 1/2 way.

My plan is to attach the walls to the part of the 2x4 exposed above the rim. I have a couple of questions...

1) I have seen many of you paint the bottom with roofing emulsion. Would I only paint this up even with the rim, since I will be attaching the walls to the exposed part?

2) How do I actually bolt the frame to the trailer? I bought these self-tapping bolts, but they are only 3 1/2 inches long? The guy at the bolt/screw store said these would drill through the wood and right into the steel trailer. Should I countersink and use them to attach the 2x4's before I put the 1/2 inch ply floor on top of the 2x4's?


Thanks for feedback!

AL in Asheville

[TPMcGinty]

I have the same floor and frame as you but I put 1/2" plywood on the bottom and the top before attaching it to the frame. I drilled holes in the frame and used 3" stainless steel hex head screws. I screwed them from the outside of the frame into the 2x4's. I didn't want the sharp screws sticking out the bottom of the frame.