Where to drain the sink.

[doug hodder]

Woody, you are 100% right. It does only take one idiot to ruin things. I think though that most of the people on this forum are smart enough to realize what is appropriate to dump and what isn't. It's the real yahoos out there that are dumping other things that need a swift kick to the head. For me, I have had 4 cars/trucks dumped on my property, in the last 3 years, stripped, filled with household trash, numbers ground off of them, no plates. and I needed to arrange to have them taken away. There are lots of stupid people out there that don't care, I think that everyone on this forum is smart enough not to abuse the environment to that degree. Hey everyone, just use your head, be kind to the environment, and remember if you dump something that isn't degradable, someone is going to have to pay to have it removed. Doug Hodder

[Woody]

I hope everyone is smart enough to understand this concept of "grey water" vs. "black water" and being lazy is no excuse to ruin it for the next guy. Look what happened to The Dave Matthews Band tour bus with the dumping accident they had on the bridge with tourists on a ferry below the bridge, YUCK, talk about being in the wrong place at the wrong time. I have no problem with disposing of grey water in the bushes or dump station. The problem is people, being lazy or ignorant, will dump anything on the ground sometimes without any thought of what it will do to the enviroment or someones shoes when they accidentally track through it

[Guest]

The guy complaining, probably has a motor home, which has a grey tank, which costs money to empty at a dump station.
He takes a look at a teardrop with a dishpan setting under the sink drain and thinks... it just aint fair.
I'd say to him... Better go check them bushes, there might be a bear pissing over there... or go police your own.
I quit fishing the big holes on local rivers when the fish are running, because of all the big RVs that dump their waste right on the river bars right where they are all parked. Depending on how the wind was blowing, sometimes it was downright nasty just to breath the air...
I was taught at a tender age to respect nature... I use biodregadable soap if anything is getting tossed out on the ground, bushes or wherever.
We were allowed to wash our dishes using that type of soap right in the most pristene high altitude lakes on the face of this earth, for crying out loud...
Dumping bio degradable soapy water shouldn't be a problem... IMHO
But I too agree... be discrete about it and don't even give someone the chance to complain.
Dishwater also works good for dowsing the fire when it comes time to break camp...

[asianflava]

Dumping bio degradable soapy water shouldn't be a problem... IMHO
But I too agree... be discrete about it and don't even give someone the chance to complain.

I think we all agree just saves the headache of having to explain to the folks that over react. We use that camp soap for everything, dishes hands, shower. How clean do you expect something to get, you're doing dishes in cold water under a tree!

[Woody]

You know the joke of "coldwater used to do the dishes"

Jim went to visit his 90 year old grandfather in a very secluded, rural area of Georgia.

After spending a great evening chatting the night away, Jim's grandfather prepared breakfast of bacon, eggs and toast. However, Jim noticed a film like substance on his plate, and questioned his grandfather asking, "Are these plates clean?"

His grandfather replied, "They're as clean as cold water can get them. Just you go ahead and finish your meal, Sonny!"

For lunch the old man made hamburgers. Again, Jim was concerned about the plates as his appeared to have tiny specks around the edge that looked like dried egg and asked, "Are yo u sure these plates are clean?"

Without looking up the old man said, "I told you before, Sonny, those dishes are as clean as cold water can get them. Now don't you fret, I don't want to hear another word about it!"

Later that afternoon, Jim was on his way to a nearby town and as he was leaving, his grandfather's dog started to growl, and wouldn't let him pass. Jim yelled and said, "Grandfather, your dog won't let me get to my car".

Without diverting his attention from the football game he was watching on TV, the old man shouted ... "COLDWATER, GO LAY DOWN!!!!"

[IraRat]

I haven't shopped for this stuff since my Boy Scout days, but I know they sell a 100% environnmentally safe detergent. As a matter of fact, there's this one brand--I think it's called Doctor something--which you can use for the dishes, to wash yourself, and even brush your TEETH! The stuff's been around since the 20s.

If you show anyone the bottle, they'll clearly see it's totally safe.

It's not the biodegradabale nature of detergents that's the problem--it's the phosphates (and to a lesser extent, nitrates), which actually PROMOTE plant growth. This is ONLY a problem in and near lakes, where too much phosphates spur too much plant growth in the lake...

The overgrowth of the upper layer of plants blocks the necessary light going to the lower layers (for photosynthesis to occur)...

Those lower level plants die...

And the aerobic bacteria that help decay those dead plants multiply exponentially and use up all of the oxygen in the water--killing the fish and everything else. That's when a lake becomes "eutrophic," meaning a dead lake.

[Chris C]

It's Doctor Bonners Pure Castile liquid soap. When I'm out in the environment, I use it for everything..........yup, even brushing teeth. They're probably newer soaps which are environment friendly, but that's the one I've always used.

[Michael W]

This is a great thread with lots of good dialogue.

Ira does a good job of describing the issue. Phosphates in soaps increase algae growth in lakes and streams which in turn upset the balance of the ecosystem.

When backbacking or camping with our teardrop, we always use biodegrabeable soap. We like the Campsuds brand.

http://www.sierradawn.com/products.asp

This type of soap is made from vegetable-based cleaning agents. Even so, to be truly "green" it should be used sparingly.

To help clarify terms, black water contains human waste. Gray water does not contain waste, but is contaminated by washing up, such as bathing, shaving, washing dishes, etc.

The soap in gray water is, therefore, not the only factor when considering its disposal. For example, bacon grease or food particles in the dishwater may attract unwelcome guests in the night if just dumped in the bushes near the campsite.

We collect our grey water in a bucket and dispose of it at a dump station when available. When dispersed camping, we do our best to dispose of our grey water with care, dumping it in a hole we dig well away from the shore of a lake or stream. We try to tread lightly and leave no trace, not only for the sake of the enviornment, but for the benefit those who will use the campsite after us.

[IraRat]

When backbacking or camping with our teardrop, we always use biodegrabeable soap. We like the Campsuds brand.

http://www.sierradawn.com/products.asp

We collect our grey water in a bucket and dispose of it at a dump station when available.

I have to check that stuff out. And that dump station must smell GREAT.

Yep, Chris. That's the stuff! Tasted awful for brushing your teeth!

[madjack]

...Dr, Bronner's is made from peppermint oil, leaves a wonderful smell in hair and on body. If you know any Amway distributors, get a bottle of their low suds formula L.O.C. it is made from coconut oil and like Bronner's product it can be used for ANY cleaning job, it just doesn't smell as good as that Castille Peppermint soap
madjack

[Chris C]

Actually, I never could stand the peppermint stuff. I always used their almond fragrance. Much more tolerable.

[Shiro]

I grew up summers and weekends in a place without running water. The dish water always was thrown off the porch. My father always made a point of flinging --covering as much ground as possible --- and not pouring it. I do the same with my wash water camping and have never seen a problem with it. It goes over a lot of brush and isn't a puddle of soapy dishwater slowly sinking into the dirt.

[Grandadeo]

This excellent environmental discussion has raised a question that some of you other Florida boys might be able to answer for me. Does manatee taste like chicken or pork?

[TonyCooper]

This excellent environmental discussion has raised a question that some of you other Florida boys might be able to answer for me. Does manatee taste like chicken or pork?

Neither - it tastes a lot like Dog!

[IraRat]

It's called a sea cow, so I guess it tastes like beef.

Funny thing is, you make a pretty good point:

If they protected and raised manatees for consumption like they do for gators, they wouldn't be threatened.

The darn things are just too lazy to get out of the way of the speeding boats and jet skis! And that's basically the only thing that makes them a threatened species. Nothing to do with water quality, food supply, stuff like that.