Vertical Hitch Pin??? Any thoughts???

[Sawyer]

I'd say just tow that whole heap to the dump and toss it in the metal recycling bin... Save me the wheels and tires though. However, if you do decide to keep working on said heap, I (without any usable knowledge or experience on the subject) think you'll be more than fine.

To others: I've seen this tear at just about every stage of its progress, and it's so overbuilt, I see no way (short of a tree falling on the tongue) that this sucker is ever going to bend.

It's probably a good precaution to weld a plate on the bottom, but I think the vertical pin idea is as cool as the other side of the pillow. You might also want the top side of the pin to have some sort of rubber washer or grommet or something to keep excess water out of your frame.

PS, let me know when you want to come pick up that wire, I have 400' of green 12awg, and about 100' of black 16awg.

[4123]

Hi #1 son,
I guess I should pipe in here. I think that Sawyer has made a good point about water leaking into the frame through a hole on the top of the tongue.

What about drilling the holes (vertical or horizontal) in front of the diagonal braces? Then the tongue jack won't have an interference problem.

But the most important thing is GET THAT THING DONE!!! so we can go camping!

[brian_bp]

...It seems like having the hole towards the end of the material - where a hitch pin goes, would have a far lesser effect on strength than having a hole somewhere in the middle...?...

Yes, it certainly does matter where the hole is along the length. I'm sure someone has a suggestion about where the highest and lowest stress will occur in this design, but from what I see in the photo I can't tell where a single pin would make anything removable, so I guess I'm not seeing some of the detail and can't comment on the proposed pin location.

[angib]

A vertical pin will weaken the tongue more than a horizontal pin will.

But you can get around this by putting the pin to the back of the 'receiver', where the stresses are low. Back there it is mostly the sides of the tongue doing the work so the vertical hole will have no effect.

Of course putting the pin at the back might not free up as much space for your jack as you want - but you could consider having the pin behind the jack.

Andrew

[oregonguy]

Maybe these two pics will clear up the issue for people. You can see where the clearance issue is a bit tight for where the hitch pin would normally go, hence the vertical idea. Whichever place I put the pin, it needs to go towards the front of the receiver section so that I can extend the tongue length on demand whenever needed.

[Tx River Rat]

Oreganguy
You really don't have a problem at all, sliding one tube inside another
will increase your strength so much that drilling a hole vertically is of no concern
I hate to do this and I am not trying to start a argument ,but I disagree with a couple statements on here ,the top and bottom web of an I beam do two things , the bottom holds tension the top holds compression and they both stop twisting (there main Job) the taller the center web the stronger the beam.
In tubing it is the same. I am building my frame from 2 by 3 rectangular tubing If I lay it down 3 inches wide and 2 inches tall it is much weaker than the way I am going to run it 2 inches wide 3 inches tall, even though I have much more metal on top and bottom with the tubing laid the first way.
Just my opion and not meant to start a war
Ron

[oregonguy]

Ron - I feel the same way you do....I don't feel like strength will be an issue in this situation...and I can't stop thinking you're right about the way the strength orientation works....as I said before, I'm no structural engineer, but I've built quite a few things in my time and feel like I have a descent handle on physics. I can also see some logic in the other argument though....this is a thinker...

I also am not interested in starting a war, and that isn't what this post is about...just wanted input from all you teardroppers....and I appreciate all of it.

I am thinking of doing an experiment just for the fun of it where I'll take two identical lengths of 1x1 .065 square tube and drill a hole in each. then I'll see which orientation fails easier/quicker when exposed to stress...it'll be interesting if nothing else.

[Tx River Rat]

Oreganguy
A 1/4 cable will hold up several thousand lbs this is the same kind of stress the bottom has. It all works together but if you want to play take a 1 by1 and then do the same thing with a 1 by 2
or just get you a piece of 1/4 bye flat iron it want hold its own weight up with out bending layed flat but turn it up on edge and as long as you keep it straight it will hold a ton up.
Ron

[angib]

If anyone wants the numbers:

- a 2"x2" tube with a 1/2" horizontal hole (ie, through both sides) loses 0.1% of its vertical bending strength;

- a 2"x2" tube with a 1/2" vertical hole (ie, through top and bottom) loses 21% of its vertical bending strength.

Of course the same numbers apply the other way round for horizontal bending strength, but I'm not aware of any tongue collapsing horizontally - it always seems to be vertical bending that's the killer.

Broadly speaking, a vertical hole through the tongue anywhere in front of the diagonal braces will lose a significant amount of strength. I believe you would not suffer much loss of strength if you put a vertical hole behind the diagonal braces, as that far back there isn't much bending load left on the removable piece of tongue.

Andrew

[oregonguy]

Andrew,

Even though I can't make heads or tails of the logic, I'm inclined to believe you on the subject...It appears as though you've put significantly more research into it than I.

Although my gut tells me I have way more than enough strength in this tongue to withstand nearly any hole I can drill, I probably still stick to the normal hole orientation. I'll probably just end up modifying the hitch pin itself so that it has one very flat end and will take up nearly no space on the side where things a cramped.

[starleen2]

After seeing the above photos, I’m inclined to drill the hole. I cannot foresee any flexing at that point that would lead to structural failure
1. There are two thickness of metals of two square tubes, The receiver hitch that I have is the same thickness and does quite well even with a sloppy tolerance.
2. The removable part extends well into cavity of the other – the fulcrum point will be at either end of the mating tubes – not at the drill site
3. The angle braces are close enough to the drill site to prevent cracking and bend out. That is where pin needs to go

[bobhenry]

We design engineered floor systems. ( Wood "I" joist floors) It is amazing the size hole you can cut in the center web but do not dare cut notch or drill the top or bottom chord. As you stand on that floor supported by that I joist the bottom chord is in tension and the top is in compression. Failure of the member may occur if weakened by notching either the top or bottom of that joist. The 2x2 steel tongue is experiencing the same tension and compression the bottom may tear from the tension if overloaded or the top may crush. When either happens the load is immediatly transfered to the opposite side ofter with catastrophic results.

" Hey guys some guy lost a trailer it just pased me !

Hey it looks familiar !

[4123]

How about this? Since security is the issue, simply drill the hole horizontally but drill it offset. Closer to the top or bottom or maybe even "tweaked" so you insert the pin at a slight diagonal angle. That would certainly foil a would be thief with a spare removable tongue with the holes in the standard places.

[Sawyer]

Both sides seem to make really good points, but after bobhenry brought up the wood I-beam joists, I finally understand. I always think way more clearly in terms of wood than metal. I've drilled very large holes through the vertical member in TJI's to allow for plumbing and such, but have been warned to never even notch the top or bottom members...

Dad brings up a good point too, just drill the horizontal hole 1/3 of the way down instead of half way, that would definitely solve the security issue. Unless the thief is carrying around a good strong drill with cutting fluid and a set of metal bits along with the extra tongue...

I would be inclined to drill horizontally just for the peace of mind. There has to be a reason why they are traditionally drilled this way...

[brian_bp]

Maybe these two pics will clear up the issue for people.

Yes, that's very clear, thanks!

I had not realized that only the portion which is forward of the diagonal braces that telescopes and is removable; it's not really the whole tongue which is removed (as is common with pole-tongue utility trailers). It looks like a good setup providing both adjustment of tongue length and perhaps more compact storage, very similar to the telescoping setup on the Oliver Legacy travel trailer.