BUBBLE Insulation

[kennyrayandersen]

I thought it was working quite well myself. But then that's just based on my practical experience with an actual trailer which is insulated with the material in question.

not saying it won't work, and if you get a get deal on it like aunty M them whoo hoo.

I'm pretty sure though if you compare it to 1 inch thick poly styrene it won't have quite the same insulative ability that all -- not tring to rain on your parade

[studebiker]

I'm sure there are plenty of posts on this subject. I'm brand new to the TD gang and put out this post to just see how many have used it and liked it. My TD is still in the planning phase so I will have many more questions to come, I'm sure. When I saw my friends TD in which he used the foil bubble wrap, I thought it would be tons easier to make the curved areas, rather than fighting the rigid stuff.
I still don't quite understand how to insulate the floor. Putting rigid foam on the underside and exposed to the splash elements, even if the undercoating stuff is applied, just seems like problems waiting to happen. I was thinking about a plywood-insulation-plywood sandwich for the floor.

[bobhenry]

PLYWOOD INSULATION PLYWOOD

That's what I did !

[kennyrayandersen]

I'm sure there are plenty of posts on this subject. I'm brand new to the TD gang and put out this post to just see how many have used it and liked it. My TD is still in the planning phase so I will have many more questions to come, I'm sure. When I saw my friends TD in which he used the foil bubble wrap, I thought it would be tons easier to make the curved areas, rather than fighting the rigid stuff.
I still don't quite understand how to insulate the floor. Putting rigid foam on the underside and exposed to the splash elements, even if the undercoating stuff is applied, just seems like problems waiting to happen. I was thinking about a plywood-insulation-plywood sandwich for the floor.

It's good and bad. Because the stuff is rigid it can actually carry some load which is good, but you are right it certainly presents a challenge in construction, which is bad. I'm thinking to glue them up like barrel staves (segmented curve) and then hot wire the curve to match the contour of the trailer. The inside could also be hotwired curved or left segmented depending on how someone wants it to look.

Your idea of making a SIP floor is a really good one. You can close out the edges with a 1x foam thickness piece of wood which you can subsequently also use to attach walls, shelves, etc. to. It's been done before and would eliminate any condensation concerns as well. I'll be making mine that way and using fiberglass rather than plywood, but the principle is the same. You could try a litle experiment, but 1/8 plywood is probably plenty, or you could go 1/4 inside and 1/8 outside if you waned it a little more robust.

You would probably want to reinforce the floor locally for any load introduction, like axle or tongue attach etc.

[Larwyn]

My floor is made up of 1/4" plywood on the bottom of a 2x2 frame, filled with rigid foam insulation, and topped with 1/2" plywood. The bottom and edges are coated with asphalt roof coating and the the floor covering is peel and stick linoleum. I'm not sure all that was really necessary but it was intended to keep the floor being too cold when the temps drop. As many have stated before the mattress itself could provide all the floor insulation needed in some cases. And then Mad Jacks trick of throwing the insulation under the mattress is an excellent idea.

[studebiker]

Yes, I like the Floor sandwich idea too. My friend used this and it seems to be working really well. He also used neoprene pond liner contact cemented to the under side instead of a paint on water proofing. I REALLY liked that idea a lot. So far I have not seen the neoprene pond liner/water proofing idea used on this forum yet. But I am a rookie so I probably just have not seen it yet. If someone out there has used the neoprene under their floor, I'd love to hear your comments. Negative or positive.

[Larwyn]

All this talk got me to wondering about how the bubble insulation actually compared to the pink foam, both of which I used in my trailer. As I did use the pink foam insulation in the walls and the flatter part of the roof behind the roof vent. So this afternoon I went out and turned the air conditioner on in the Escape Pod and let it run for a while. I checked the temperature of the ceiling and the roof just behind and just in front of the roof vent with an infrared thermometer (just like the Ghost Hunters use ). Starting out the roof reading was 91.3 deg f in both locations and the ceiling temp was 84.6 under the foam and 83.4 under the bubbles. The trailer was parked in the shade under an EZup. After running the AC for about 30 minutes the roof temp read 89.4 over the foam and 89.6 over the bubbles, the ceiling temp was 71.3 under both types of insulation. Basically I see no real difference in the ability of the two different types of insulation to do their job in this application. The ceiling is 1/8" oak paneling and the roof is 1/4" luan. the spars allow for slightly less than 1.5" of separation between the roof and the ceiling, I have two layers of 1/2" foam behind and around the roof vent and three layers of the foil bubble insulation from the roof vent forward.

I know this is not a "scientific study" but it does convince me that the two different types of insulation as applied in my trailer are about equal. It would be interesting to know how an uninsulated roof would have performed in a side by side test.

Oh, one more thing. At the end of the test I did notice that the floor temp was 62 deg f, the air temp from a dial type thermometer used to test AC units was 68 deg f at about 3' off the floor. If that AC can get my feet down to 62 deg, I don't think I have much to worry about as far as insulation goes. No ghost were found or harmed during this test.

[kennyrayandersen]

that's a pretty good test. Makes we wonder what the lag time is for it all to become steady state. Guess in the case it gets to 62 F on the inside it don't really matter! Probably the air gap actually has more to do with it than the actual bubble wrap? Who knows but the foam should give you a higher R value, but it's not the only factor. There is plywood both sides, and an air gap, so maybe in the end the overall effect isn't too different.

[aggie79]

that's a pretty good test. Makes we wonder what the lag time is for it all to become steady state. Guess in the case it gets to 62 F on the inside it don't really matter! Probably the air gap actually has more to do with it than the actual bubble wrap? Who knows but the foam should give you a higher R value, but it's not the only factor. There is plywood both sides, and an air gap, so maybe in the end the overall effect isn't too different.

From my construction science days (admittedly 30 years ago), the thermal performance of a wall assembly is/can be very different from the thermal performance of individual materials used in the assembly for a couple of reasons. First, wall studs are thermal bridges that transmit heat/cold directly between interior and exterior sheathing and reduce the efficiency of insulation in the stud cavities. Second, the tightness of a wall assembly from an air infiltration standpoint greatly affects thermal performance. The more air passing through, the lesser the thermal performance.

Air infiltration is probably not an issue in teardrop construction, but thermal bridging probably is an equalizer between different types of insulation.

[Todah Tear]

I used it on both of my builds and it worked well.

Todah Tear

[Mstro]

This is all great information

I have been toying with this insulation question for my build I'm about to start

Looking around the web has shown that the r value of pink insulation runs at about 8 per inch.

this is info from Prodex Insulaion

Technical Data Prodex Total Insulation
ICC-ES Recognized #ESR-2350 (4’x175’ roll only) and Energy Star Qualified

R Values
Heat Flow DOWN Heat Flow DOWN (roof/ceiling)
One (1) layer of Prodex * 15.67
Two (2) layers of Prodex * 21.10
Heat Flow HORIZONTAL Heat Flow HORIZONTAL (wall)
One (1) layer of Prodex * 7.00
Two (2) layers of Prodex * 9.58
Heat Flow UP Heat Flow UP (crawl space)
One (1) layer of Prodex * 6.00
Two (2) layers of Prodex * 8.24

* 1/2-inch to 3-inch airspace recommended for optimal performance. The above testing consisted of applying Prodex with an airspace of 2.64 inch on each side of product.

One Layer of ProdexTwo Layers of Prodex
Test method ASTM 1116. Interior side of Product was exposed.
2x6 Wood-frame Assembly 24 inch.

Hope it helps

[Walt M]

I too used foil bubble foil in my walls and in the roof. It's by far easier to install than Dow foam (I wasn't concerned about any structual value) my walls are 1/4" skin 3/4" frame and 1/4" outside skin with one layer of foil.
my ceiling is 1 1/4" frame member and I put 2 layers of foil there. we camped last fall in about 40 degree evenings and we had to open the window it was getting a bit warm. Walt

[Dewi]

May sound like a daft question, but I'm going to ask it anyway... what is the benefit of the foil backed bubble insulation as opposed to just standard bubble wrap? Ie what does the foil add?

Cheers, Dewi

[Mini Renegade]

insulation? Why? non in a tent.

I only insulated the floor and ceiling.

[Walt M]

I Believe it's reflective qualities.