Questions on fender construction...help requested!!!

[cracker39]

Yep, the connectors I found would serve a lot of useful purposes. Sometimes, I get lucky and find something that makes building easier.

[grant whipp]

Dale wrote:

" I need the #9 as my TTT will probably weigh in at areound 1500 lbs or maybe a little more when loaded for camping. I had planned on using the same white spoke 13" (ST175/80D13 tires) as on my boat trailer so I could use the same spare tire. The tire diameter is 23.75". Are you saying that the 13" wouldn't be a good choice for the #9? When I talked to a rep at Redneck trailers about the axle, I said I was using the 13" wheels and he didn't seem to have a problem with that. I can get the same wheels in 14", but then, I'd have to buy a third for a spare, and decide on a tire size before I ordered the axle."


Dale!

Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner - when you have a birthday folloing Christmas, you can bet there is gonna be a par-tay!

What you didn't give us in those dims above is the backspace on the wheel (measurement from the hubface of the wheel to the INDSIDE lip of the wheel). From the sound of that wheel, I'm guessing it is probably no more that 5" wide with a 0 offset, so the backspace is about 2-1/2" maybe? If you only want 1" between tire and body, that means you'll have to spec a short spindle with no brake mounting flange (perhaps NOT a good idea with the weight you are planning?). I also think that with that little backspace, you can probably get away with a #9. I run 14" wheels with 3-3/4" backspace, and when mounted on a #9 with short spindles (my standard), the clearance between trailing arm and rim is pretty close - I don't think a 13" rim with the same backspace would work.

Without knowing ALL the figures, I'm going to be hardpressed to suggest full specs. But I do think that if you want to stay with those 13" boat-terailer wheels and keep the option of adding brakes at a later date, you'll probably have to live with quite a bit more clearance between tire and body than you originally planned.

Before ordering, have that rep at Redneck quote you a hubface-to-hubface measurement, with and without brake mount flanges, and ask what is the shortest spindle they can get you and still KEEP the brake mounts. I've HEARD that some of Dexter's dealers just want to make things simple, easy on themselves, and not really try to get the customer what they NEED. I'm lucky, I guess - I've been dealing with the same wholesaler for close to 20 years, and they KNOW how to get what I want from Dexter (as long as it is physically possible, that is ... ;-} ;-} ...!).

Before I leave, though, Dale - with regards to your your proposed fender construction, might I suggest only using 1/2" plywood for the perimeter shape? ... maybe even only 3/8"?

Good Luck, and as always ...

CHEERS!

Grant

[cracker39]

Grant, thanks for replying. I too have a birthday close to Christmas, but apparently not as close as yours. Mine is Jan 1. Here are some replies to your comments with (I hope) more info.

What you didn't give us in those dims above is the backspace on the wheel (measurement from the hubface of the wheel to the INDSIDE lip of the wheel). From the sound of that wheel, I'm guessing it is probably no more that 5" wide with a 0 offset, so the backspace is about 2-1/2" maybe? If you only want 1" between tire and body, that means you'll have to spec a short spindle with no brake mounting flange (perhaps NOT a good idea with the weight you are planning?). I also think that with that little backspace, you can probably get away with a #9. I run 14" wheels with 3-3/4" backspace, and when mounted on a #9 with short spindles (my standard), the clearance between trailing arm and rim is pretty close - I don't think a 13" rim with the same backspace would work.

The Redneck tech did say that my wheel has 0” offset. I went out to the boat trailer and checked again, and drew up a simplified diagram below. The wheel is 6” rim to rim, and the tire sidewall is ½” outside the rim edge front and back. I am not familiar with “backspace”, so I can’t comment on that. The clearance between tire and body doesn’t have to be limited to 1”. I would like to have only 1”, but more would not be a problem. Your suggestion of making the fender frames with thinner plywood would help increase the clearance.



Without knowing ALL the figures, I'm going to be hardpressed to suggest full specs. But I do think that if you want to stay with those 13" boat-terailer wheels and keep the option of adding brakes at a later date, you'll probably have to live with quite a bit more clearance between tire and body than you originally planned.

Before ordering, have that rep at Redneck quote you a hubface-to-hubface measurement, with and without brake mount flanges, and ask what is the shortest spindle they can get you and still KEEP the brake mounts.

I have reason to believe that my bass boat and trailer weighs more than my TTT will weigh. It’s tongue weight is 250lbs and it’s a real effort for me to move it by hand parked on pavement. I checked the tongue weight, when using a bumper hitch and my bumper started bending down in the middle. I put on a receiver hitch that supports 300 lbs. My tow vehicle is a Nissan Frontier truck and it has pretty good brakes and have no problem stopping with the boat attached, so I don’t plan on putting brakes on my TTT. Florida doesn't require them until the trailer is over 3000 lbs.

I've HEARD that some of Dexter's dealers just want to make things simple, easy on themselves, and not really try to get the customer what they NEED. I'm lucky, I guess - I've been dealing with the same wholesaler for close to 20 years, and they KNOW how to get what I want from Dexter (as long as it is physically possible, that is ... ;-} ;-} ...!).

I’ve talked to the dealer in Tampa a couple of times, and will ask more detailed questions when I order the axle to make sure it will work…or at least, be as sure as I can be with my limited knowledge of axles. Your info will help. Thanks.

[Ira]

Here's my confusion with those taper connectors:

They come 4" and 6" long. But even at 4", that means you have to mount the top of the fender at least 4" above your frame/the bottom of the wall.

Know what I mean? Isn't that way too high? Or is there an inch or so that can hang below the bottome of the side?

4" just seems too high to me. Maybe I'm not visuallizing it right, but looking at what I want to do (I changed my mind guys; I'm going with standard rounded fenders with a ship's wheel mounted on the face), I don't know if these would work for me.

[cracker39]

Maybe this diagram will make more clear. The connectors are mounted on the inside face of the fender and on the body wall.



the connector on the fender is inserted into the connector on the wall from the top.

[Ira]

That's how I thought it was mounted, but here's the thing with your diagram:

Now maybe this is me, maybe I'm totally wrong, maybe I can't visualize it because of the way MY axle is mounted BELOW the springs, but...

Does your diagram accurately show the wheel position in relation to the bottom of your wall and frame? In other words, you're showing the center of your wheel and axle position as it would sit WITHOUT a frame.

Doesn't this make a difference, or did you already crunch all of the numbers precisely?

[cracker39]

No, the position of the wheel may not be totally accurate, but it's close. With my torsion axle, I plan on the center of the wheel hub being about centered on, or at the bottom edge of, the frame. My wall side skin will extend down to the bottom of the frame. With the 13" wheels, my tire is about 23" in diameter and my ride height at the axle will be about 11" - 12". With the torsion axle, my hub doesn't have to be below the frame like it does with springs.

[Ira]

That's where I was a total retard with this:

You're using a torsion axle.

But do you see how these brackets may not work for ME? That they would be too high in relation to my wheel position?

Also, can't you find these brackets in stores, too?

[cracker39]

I haven't looked in stores, but I will. If not, I'll order a couple of pairs from Rockler.

My shed has just been inspected, now I can get outside and finish up my shelving and start putting stuff in it. Later...

[grant whipp]

Hi, Dale!

RE: axle - I've just done some number crunching, and here's my suggestions. If you can get the axle with 61-1/2" between the trailing arms (3/4" clearance each side, as you would like), ask for a 71-1/2" hubface and spec short spindles with no brake mt. flanges. With your wheel/tire combo, that should give you 1-1/2" between your tire and trailer sidewall.

Basically, that works out to a hubface measurement that is 5" from the back of the trailing arm, or 10" total wider than the width between trailing arms. This is a combo I get all the time, though of course I have to order it. Several years ago, I was able to special order spindles that were 1/2" shorter, but in recent years the company engineers have been too reluctant and won't build 'em like that for me (they say it has to do with wheel clearance at the trailing arms, even though I keep telling 'em my wheels for that application are custom made and won't have that clearance problem potential ... go figure!).

Anyway, see if that works for you. Good Luck, and as always ...

CHEERS!

Grant

[cracker39]

Grant, I really appreciate your help with this. I am about ready to order the axle, so now, I have something definite to ask for.

[cracker39]

Grant,

Well, it's done...I've officially started my TTT...at least, ordered the Dexter #9 axle with EZ Lube hubs (not sure I really needed them, but ordered them anyway. I have a couple of days before I get the confirmation sheet I need to sign, and can cancel the hubs if you don't think they are worth getting).

Armed with your information, I talked to a rep at Redneck Trailers in Tampa a few minutes ago, who seemed to know what he was doing. I gave him the specs I wanted, and he did the calculations and I ended up with this:

Clearance between trailing arms and frame is 1". I'll have 1/4" of plywood extending down the frame face, so that will give me a final clearance of 3/4".

Hub face of 70 1/2". That will give me 1 1/4" clearance between tire face surface and the side wall based on his info that the tire is 7.4" wide. My boat trailer tire appears to be slightly less than that. He first said 69 1/2", but that would only give me 3/4" clarance from the side wall, and I asked for a half inch more to be sure.

Outside tire to outside tire, he estimated at 78". That will put my overall width between outside fender faces at 80" to 81", probably the latter. But, I don't think I'll have the DOT checking my fender widths to see if I am over 80" or not. But then, I may add the extra lights just for safety sake.

Thanks to your info, I may have even sounded like I knew what I was talking about...

I found a pair of 13" white spoke wheels with 6 ply tires onine for $185 with shipping. I can't beat this price by ordering the wheels and buying tires locally, because the mounting cost drives the price over $185, and this way, I don't have to go anywhere and shop for tires. They'll come to my house.