Removable Trailer Tongue - Jan 2012 update

[HometownHockeyFan]

Hi there. I'm in the early design/build of a non traditional TD that I call the 'Tear Hauler'.

My concept is to have a trailer that would be usable for tailgating and motorcycling/camping...but, unlike traditional Teardrops, I would NOT have a sleeping area.

Key features are an outdoor kitchen (Based on traditional Teardrop gallery design), inside storage for tailgating, camping, or whatever activity you are doing, and room to carry 3 Motorcycles (Offroad bikes) in the outside bed of the trailer

Here is a very crude side view drawing. The rear of the trailer is similar to a std utility trailer (5x8 plus a tailgate/loading ramp)

Front of the trailer is a reverse TD design like the Jim Dandy, which houses the outdoor kitchen and the storage. TD part of trailer will be 5' wide, 5' tall, and 5' deep.



A key feature I need is to have a removable tongue...since the gallery area is up front. Here is a rough sketch of the frame I am building.



Frame is 12' x 5' and is constructed of 2x2x1/8 square tube. Cross members are spaced at roughly 18".

Idea for the removable tongue is to mount a 3 foot section of 3x3x3/16 tube to the first 3 cross members, then insert a 7 foot section of 2.5x2.5x3/16 tube inside of the 3x3 tube.

This design would allow me to slide the tongue under the trailer when I am using the Gallery.

I think the max weight of the loaded trailer will be just over 2,000 lbs.

I've stared at Andrew's tongue strength charts till my eyes hurt. :-)

Any and all advice is appreciated.

Thanks...David

[CARS]

I don't see why you couldn't just keep going with your "opposite" tear theme with an "opposite" receiver.

Just as you can pull a pin and remove your hitch from your vehicles receiver, pull a pin and remove the tongue.

Of course, make it as heavy as it is on your vehicle. Just think backwards. If it holds under your rear bumper, it should hold under your trailer too. It may add a little bit of slop but other than that I don't see why it wont work.

[HometownHockeyFan]

Chris,
Thanks for your reply.

That's pretty much what I'm thinking of doing, but using a 2.5x2.5x3/16" tongue going into a 3x3x3/16" 'receiver' tube. (Based on the reading I've done in Andrew's tongue strength guidance, I need to use something larger then a traditional 2" receiver)

I'd like to keep the design as simple as I can as long as it is strong enough.

Thanks...David

[Bikerman]

Those are the deminsions I used, then the head was welded on the smaller box tube. I put a pin through the tounge and a safety clip through the pin. The same hole in the larger tounge allows the lawn tractor to pull the trailer. Taking the head in prevents theft too, someone might have a hitch, they don't have what is needed to haul it off!

[Wobbly Wheels]

Hey all,

Just a thought here, but why not have the tongue retract along the centerline over the axle ?

One could weld a longitudinal sleeve under the framing like a long receiver. With a collar welded on the back end of the tongue to take the towing loads, you wouldn't be relying on a mechanical connection in the load path.

I had something similar on a boat trailer and it let me lengthen the tongue so I didn't have to take the truck so far down the ramp.

You would still need to secure the receiver part from sliding up the tongue under braking and to keep it in place for moving it around manually. Some sort of a cam or a captive wedge might work well...

[azmotoman]

Trail Manor uses a "swing-away" tongue to reduce depth. What about that?

[HometownHockeyFan]

Thanks for the feedback!

Here is a crude drawing of my current concept.



When not in use, the 7' 2.5x2.5x3/16 SQ tube will slide back towards the axle so that only the hitch part of the tongue will be sticking out.

I think it will be strong enough...I'd feel better if I could use a Composite Tongue design...but, I don't see a way to do that and still make it easily removable.

Thanks...David

[eamarquardt]

I think it will be strong enough...I'd feel better if I could use a Composite Tongue design...but, I don't see a way to do that and still make it easily removable.

Thanks...David

Think a bit differently. Your galley/storage box is going to be about 4 feet long and 5 feet wide. Why do you have to access it from the end? A four foot wide galley is very doable. Put storage on one side and the galley on the other side. Then there is no need to have a removable tongue with the attendant compromises. You could also then utilize the tongue area for a wedge shape box, improve your aerodynamics, and have more enclosed storage. You'd have plenty of frame right along side to mount a removable table (using receiver tubes under the frame), and maybe some other advantages to boot.

Not that I have any concrete data but I just think a single tube tongue on a trailer that will weigh 2K# or perhaps more is not the optimum design.

I'm not predicting disaster but the tubes will not be a snug fit with one another. In my experience, sloppy fits bang themselves to death over time and lead to problems. I think it would be "good form" to minimize the slop (if you go with a removable tongue) and make custom, snug fitting, receptacles/sockets for the tongue tube.

See the comments in this string:

http://tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?t=22538

Cheers,

Gus

[HometownHockeyFan]

Gus,
Thanks for your feedback. :-)

I have not really considered a side gallery...I'll do some tinkering with my drawings and see what I can come up with.

One of the reasons I'm interested in the removable tongue, is the trailer is 12 foot long already...and with my planned use for tailgating in parking lots...I have more options if the trailer is not another 4 foot longer because of the tongue.

I do agree with you on the potential weakness of a single tongue design.

Here are two other options I've dreamed up that allow me to use a Composite Tongue, but still have it removable.



This does not look to hard to make, and I think it would add quite a bit of strength, and still be removable.

Option C


I like this option because it does not interfere with the stabilizers I plan on putting in each corner of the frame. I don't think it is strong as option B because the angle steel will be made of two pieces welded together in order to get the angle I need to get it into the receivers. My other concern is how hard it will be to weld the receivers so the alignment is near perfect so the tongue will remove cleanly.

I appreciate any and all feedback on the two designs

Thanks...David

[Loader]

David,

Warpony had a removable/retractable tongue on his Jim Dandy Build. Might want to ask him about it.







Good luck with your design and build.

[greekspeedoman]

I've got a removable tongue on mine. I can take it off and pull my trailer backwards if I am in a tough spot off-road. I like it. Adds some weight to the chassis but it saves room in the garage. It also minimizes the shin damage when walking through the garage.

I have some fixed tongue off the front to attach the battery. If I did it again, I'd make my removable section the bulk of my tongue like Warpony's (still with the fixed battery tray.

[Wanna Be]

Heres another idea.
Place the tubes on the sides like illustrated with the angle iron.
Then you can use a pin to disconnect the whole tounge.
You would then eliminate a possiable problem point with connections,
easy enough to fabricate too with not much loss of strength.
Wanna Be

[HometownHockeyFan]

Thanks for all the feedback!!

I'm glad to see a few successful projects with removable tongues...means there is some hope for my design. :-)

Wanna Be, thanks for the idea on the Angle Steel instead of the tube...I agree that would be easier to line up.

Thanks...David

[Wanna Be]

NO I didn't mean to use angle iron, But to use the tube steel
at a angle to the frame and tie into the first 2 crossmembers
Kinda kitty corner across the front corner so that you will have the
pull pin in the front corner.
Like a regular "A" frame tounge, but detachable at the front all the way
across with 3 pull pins.
Nice straight lines, so no complicated angles to find.
Remember the K.I.S.S. principal !!!!

Wanna Be

[WarPony]

David,

Warpony had a removable/retractable tongue on his Jim Dandy Build. Might want to ask him about it.

Yes, the pictures Earl showed are mine. I bought a 36" reciever at the place I bought all my metal and used 2X2, 3/16" walled square tubing. I wasn't sure of the length I needed so I just got a 5 foot piece at the time. After I got the coupler welded onto the 2X2, I slid the 5 footer into the reciever, hooked it up to the truck we had then took it out into the parking lot and drove in a circle. I got out to see how close the corner of the trailer was to the bumper and then slid the tongue til there was about 6" of fudge room and marked the tongue. Pretty good engineering, huh?

It always worked great and got alot of compliments on it.

Jeff