1982 1500 Play-Mor questions

[papmom35]

OK you guys have totally lost me with the "car talk" LOL!! If i had to choose between brakes and tranny cooler which would you choose? Even with my dad offering to pay for the trailer brakes, I don't think I can afford to get the cooler right now. Why would the dealer say I didn't need it knowing I would be pulling within 500 lbs of my max load? I do plan on taking it very slow and easy and will double the est. travel time needed.
As far as the guage goes, I'm really lost on what you're talking about. I'm going to email your posts to my mechanic and see what he says.
I really really appreciate all of you taking the time to give me your opinions and years of experience. It's hard doing this alone but I'm not the first woman to do so and who knows, maybe in a few years you'll be readig about my first build or rebuild!!
Oh, thanks for the pic of the slide out AC, Thomas-that is awesome and I'm going to ask my dad to build one for me once we see what we've got inside for cabinet space.
Pam

[frank_a]

Subaru says tow capacity of your '01 Outback is 2000 lbs, but only half that if the trailer you're towing does NOT have brakes. See here: http://www.cars101.com/subwarr.html

I am a fan of brakes on any trailer. Otherwise, just think about your car doing all the stopping. With trailer brakes, your car (or truck) stops normally, at times even assisted to some degree by trailer brakes. It's just a safety thing to me, no matter what the state law says. Get brakes first, then consider a tranny cooler. In the meantime don't go mountain camping!

Also, are you sure you need a sway bar, or is it a sway control add-on you're looking for? That generally is used on trailers that are not balanced well (too low a tongue weight is often the culprit), and requires welding a small ball to your receiver. It should only be done by a professional, unless you know someone that is a great welder and could figure it out for you.

Best of luck. Trust me, I know what it's like being on a budget and trying to figure this stuff out!

Frank

[papmom35]

Hey Frank-I see you found me on my new thread!! I just send you a reply on the Newbies thread you replied to today.
Yep, I am really leaning towards brakes at this point. as far as the sway bar goes, now I'm really confused! I'll have to call my mechanic and ask him about the sway control thing you mentioned? How is that different from the anti sway bar?

[frank_a]

I have built and restored many, many trailers, and have never heard of a sway bar for a trailer. That of course does not mean that there aren't sway bars for trailers, just that I've never heard of one. Sway control is a very different thing from a sway bar. Here's a link to one: http://www.amazon.com/Curt-Manufacturin ... B000HLO7QA

Generally they're used for utility trailers with varying amounts of tongue weight as a result of differing loads (from front to back). A factory travel trailer should be basically balanced so it does not need sway control. It should have adequate tongue weight such that it tows nice and easy down the road, NOT swaying. I would take it out for a drive down the Mass Pike or whatever to see how it behaved before I would get involved with sway control. Also, as noted, I would look at brakes as a top priority.

Best of luck!

Frank

[papmom35]

Ahhh. Maybe that's what I was referring to when I said anti sway bar. I'll ask my mechanic when I talk to him this afternoon. He had originally said there wasn't a need for it but I was picturing the trailer going back and forth all over the road like a water skiier and freaking out! I tend to do that . Good to know I can order it for probably have what he would charge me for it if I decide I need it.
Just talked to the RV place and they have my trailer scheduled in for tomorrow so one more day and I'll know the full story.

[frank_a]

What are you having the RV place do? Replacing bearings and seals? If so, ask them if your hubs are also brake drums. If not, ask if there's backing plates behind the hub pre-drilled to accept electric brake installation. Finally, ask them how much they would charge to install whatever you need for brakes for both sides of the axle, as well as an electric brake control for your Outback. If the axle doesn't have a backing plate for brake installation, you would either need to have them welded on (not advised) or buy a new axle that is set up for brakes.

While you're at it, have them take a look at the springs, just to make sure none of the leaves are cracked or broken.

I live south of Albany, but wish we were close enough for me to look at what you have. It wouldn't take but a few minutes to see.

Best of luck!

Frank

[papmom35]

Just got some bad news from the RV place. Seems that there is no brake set up at all, which I sort of figured BUT, the axel and wheels are so obsolete there is no choice but to buy a new axel set up with brakes. With the addition of new tire and wheels to accommodate the new axel, it's going to probably run more than $1000. He's making some calls to the company-Dexter-to find out for sure what it would cost for a new axel. Of course non of this includes labor so I don't know if I can continue on with this camper. I may have to put it back up for sale and hope I can recoupe at least what I paid for it if not the xtra money for the inspection.

[frank_a]

Couldn't you just hold on to it and save your money for the brake stuff? Couldn't hurt, and then you would be all set. Just an idea. Alternatively, how about trying to trade it for something under 1000#s through the buy/sell pages here?

Good luck!

Frank

P.S. Here's a 3500# axle with electric brakes for less than 300 bucks: http://www.southwestwheel.com/store/p-3 ... -axle.aspx

[papmom35]

Problem is it's up in Maine , a 5 hour trip away. I don't even want to attempt to bring it home without brakes for that long a trip. If I decide to sell it, my friend who found it for me will put it in her business's driveway with a for sale sign and we'll put it back on Craig's List. Or maybe her stepdad will buy it for his permanent camp site. He's already expressed interest.

[papmom35]

Thanks for the link Frank-I didn't see it the first time. I sent to the RV place via email. We'll see what they say.

[frank_a]

That is an axle that will be customized for the exact width of the existing one, but it's made for leaf spring axles, which I would think is what you have on an earlier trailer. If it requires a torsion spring axle, that's another story. They are much more expensive, and probably what the guy was quoting your for a grand.

Leaf spring axles take no time at all to change, certainly no more than an hour. Then the thing would be wiring, because you would need at least a 5 wire plug, and getting your Outback wired for an electric brake controller. Brake controllers might be 100 bucks or less, but Outbacks aren't set up to make wiring them easy. I would guess a pro could do it maybe in 2 hours? It would no doubt take me all day or the better part of a weekend!

Frank

[Engineer Guy]

A word of caution... Don't let us conservative-thinking Geezers put you off your TT acquisition TOO soon unless that's the new direction you want to go.

When I saw the 'little' 4 'Spoke' Wheels [like 'Jumping Jacks'] in the Cellphone pix, I'd guessed the Axle was not the ubiquitous 3,500 lb., Brake-compatible Dexter used so widely. That Dexter Axle usually can accept a Brakes retrofit. The Play-Mor Factory put on what they thought was 'sufficient', and your current Axle is. BUT, as noted in the Subaru Forum Thread below, stopping distance does increase.

To repeat my $0.02 worth, Brakes are a better 'investment' than Tranny Cooler as the first consideration IMO. Implicit in my 'Novel' written above, but not stated explicitly, is the fact that you've got an A/T 'Idiot Light' that will signal if the Tranny, sans Cooler, is getting too hot. See your Subaru Operating Manual for details. Heed that warning, if that light comes on, and pull over to cool down the Tranny. Assuming that the Warning/Idiot Light is working, it will save you from possible Tranny damage. As reiterated in the Thread linked below, lower Gear selection and 'easy does it' driving style will prevent catastrophies. Of course, add your new TT on your Insurance before you move it; mainly to save you from Lawsuit-happy Goombahs.

1. Any chance of another Tow Vehicle [TV] being used just to get the Play-Mor 'home'? Like, a good ole Pick-em-up Truck or a larger SUV? Say, when someone really loads up a Pickup Truck with Firewood, that's about the same weight - with the same 4 Truck Brakes - as the empty Play-Mor represents.

2. Any favors you can call in from a Tow Truck-owning pal, or someone at Church? The RV crowd, Rig size aside, are one friendly bunch willing to help.

3. Usually, Trailer swaying is due first to insufficient Tongue Weight. I've had it happen w/my Utility Trailer. I tap the TV Brakes, and the Trailer starts acting 'civilized' again, and falls back into tracking my SUV. As you're likely to learn, I think the whole Sway Bar issue is a bit of misunderstanding re: nomenclature of what they're called. I'll be mighty surprised to learn you need them IF the TT load is properly balanced w/appropriate Tongue weight. It's not as though Play-Mor didn't know at all what they were doing/building for the Market.

1 kiloGram [kG] = 2.2 lbs. So, mentally round off/double kG weight numbers in this Forum to '2 to 1'. Note the various experiences of Posters, and heavier TT loads they have pulled just fine.

What I like about these Forums is that, like Wikipedia, many diverse minds weigh in. So, you can 'average out' the high-and-low of experiences to usually reiterate the old adage: 'the truth [re: feasible Towing weight or stopping] is somewhere in the middle'.

One Poster mentions that Tow ratings are conservatively rated, and represent what the Outback can actually do. Gus nails it above, I think, in showing that you'll be near maximum weight Spec. That's OK; that's what Specs are all about.

My Sister's about to spring for a nice, high-end TT and tow solo w/her Dog. I've met solo Women on the Road while Camping, and they have it down. Don't get overwhelmed just yet!

ESPECIALLY if your Mechanic handles 'lots' of Outbacks, or knows other TVs and issues, you should 'weight average' his opinion as the one to heed vs. a bunch of 'well-intentioned' Strangers! Outback-owning 'Frank' makes some very good points above...

Subaru Forum -> Towing

[frank_a]

The only specs I could find quickly for this travel trailer says (in 1981) the axle is either a Limited Slip Axle or a Mor-Ryde Suspension System. That sounds like motor home stuff to me, but I'm no expert.

I just doubt this small '82 trailer has a torsion spring axle, but all it takes to figure it out is look underneath - are there leaf springs? If there are, it's easy and inexpensive to replace. If not, it's a torsion axle and expensive.

Frank

[papmom35]

gosh Frank, I have NO idea what kind of axle it is-I didn't even know there were different types! I'm so new to this and I'm really counting on the RV guy up in Maine to be the expert and to be honest. Good news if $1000 is the total for the axle w/brakes, wheels, tires, bearings and labor is that my brother has offered to give me an "advance" on the work I do for his website. Considering I've never charged him once in the 2 years I've doing it that's pretty generous of him! Between that and what my dad was going to kick in for the trailer brakes I might be able to swing this. And, as my bro says, just think of the peace of mind I'll have knowing that everything underneath is brandnew (except the actual frame of course). I'll know more tomorrow I hope so I'll keep you all updated.
Thank you again everyone for taking the time to give me such thoughtout and infomative replies. You are all very generous and goldmines of knowledge!!
Pam

[frank_a]

If it's a leaf spring axle, that one I gave you the link for would be everything except the springs (they're probably okay) and wheels & tires. Even if the wheels & tires are 100 bucks each, it's still less than 500 bucks in parts, probably less. I wish I could help more!

Frank