Suggestions for my electrical service?

[Xtremespeed]

I'm trying to figure out what I need for my ac service. I have all the 12vdc pretty much figured out, but not sure what all I need for the ac.

Here's a list of what I plan to run.

Air Conditioner 16A
Water Heater 13A_______only when propane is not available
Microwave 13A?? _____ probably only when Air is off
Hair dryer 13A??______ probably when air is off
Small flat screen ??
Dvd player ??
Battery charger for 12v ??
Misc Outlets for cell
phones, flashlight
chargers, and
walkie talkies ??

I'm planning to use a 4500 inverter type generator most of the time, but I want to be able to use rv hookups if we happen to visit somewhere that has it, and I'd like to be able to run everything from my home service if possible, but I don't currently have a 30A outlet.


I'm assuming what I need is 30A service?

What all do I need?

30A cord?
Breaker panel of some sort? WFCO 8725 maybe?
30A inlet or just hatch using cord?
15A inlet?

Suggestions, pics, and links would all be greatly appreciated.
My apologies for all the questions.

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I would suggest you go to www.park-power.com and download their free catalog, for a start.

I would suggest a 30 amp power inlet, like their #301ELRV and one of their 30 amp detachable supply cords like their #30RPCRV. This has a proprietary, WATERPROOF connector for their power inlet on one end and a standard 3 prong 30 amp plug o the other that will work in any campground with 30 amp service.

This 30 amp plug will probably NOT hook up directly to your generator, but they make adapters that allow this. I would also get the adapter that allows you to plug the cord into a standard 15 amp outlet when this is all that's available.

Internally, yes, I would go with a small breaker panel. The marine panels from places like Blue Sea and Marinco will certainly be more expensive than something you can find at a Home Depot or Lowes, but also more rugged and better able to stand being bounced around.

Finally, houses and commercial built RVs use single strand wires. Boats use more expensive multi-strand wires because vibration eventually causes the single strand wires to fatigue and break at the connection.

It takes years for this to happen.

Regards
John

[Shadow Catcher]

An integrated power center incorporating converter 12V fuses and 120AC breakers is easier to wire i.e. http://www.progressivedyn.com/all_in_one_pd4000.html
Btw just saw another example of failed WAFCO on Irv2.

[pete42]

The two post above should give you all you need to do an install.
I have an old 30 amp cord a friend removed from his travel trailer when he converted it to a hunting camper,
don't really know why he removed it but I'm glad I got it.
several ways to hook a power cord one use a hatch cover and store the cord inside
hard wired to the WFCO converter (they seem to outlast others) cords can be bought at walmart
another way is to use a receptacle on the side of trailer and a loose cord that plugs into it the cost will be more.

shadowcatcher said"Btw just saw another example of failed WAFCO on Irv2."
How many WAFCO convertors does that make? I still haven't seen a WAFCO so I've never seen one fail.

[jwhite]

This is a simple way I did mine

This the largest one I could find at lowes has a 15ft cord that is long enough that is goes through the bottom of the trailer and the end is hanging off the tounge of the trailer.
I have a really heavy extention cord 25ft long that I plug into my honda generator.
I now have my AC at the rear so I am going to run another extention cord from the generator back to the AC.

I haven't had any problems with this simple set up,but you have to shut off the AC if your going to run the hot water shower or microwave.

[capt4903]

your gonna get a hundred different suggestions....keep it simple.....looks like you want to bring in a 30a 120v circuit...you could mount a small 4 circuit breaker panel inside...feed your recepts off of it....agreeing with previous poster on regards to using solid core wire versus stranded....i would go with stranded....however r.v.'s are commonly roped with solid copper romex.....an alternative is to use MC (metal clad) armored cable....you can buy it with stranded conductors...or plastic smurf tube and pull individual stranded conductors....

if you take a peak at my album, i just put a twistlock recept in a weatherproof box on nose of my trailer and fed through with a nipple to a plugmold box on inside.....that has a g.f.c.i. recept that feeds to one more recept......one 15 amp circuit. my generator has a breaker to protect the circuit as well as commercial circuit will be protected.

If you decide to use a 30a circuit, the panel will be necessary to protect the recept circuits at 20a max (provided a #12 conductor). make sure to use plastic bushings when passing through metal studs.

I cring when i see some of the cobbled up messes...fires waiting to happen....

I.B.E.W. master electrician background here....

[Xtremespeed]

Thanks for all the suggestions.

Now, about the grounds? I've seen a lot of info on here about the grounds, but it kinda seems to go in circles a little. There was a post in the electrical section about a boy that was electrocuted when stepping barefoot on the step getting out of an rv. Obviously, I want to make sure this doesn't happen, so do I ground anything to the frame of the trailer to help protect against this? It seem I need some kind of return path should any hot wire end up contacting a metal surface, however it seems some people suggest not to do this. I was reading awful late though, so maybe I misunderstood

[capt4903]

If your frame is bonded to the 120v electrical service, then the circuit breakers will trip, de-energizing the circuit if the "hot" wire comes in contact with the framework....

If the trailer tongue jack is setting on a block of wood and the trailer on its rubber tires, it is insulated from the ground....if the frame is not bonded to ground and the "hot" makes contact, you become the path to ground when you touch the skin or frame while standing outside... I seen it happen on a construction job-trailer firsthand....no electocution but the tingle was enough to almost make me wet myself.....

[capt4903]

If your frame is bonded to the 120v electrical service, then the circuit breakers will trip, de-energizing the circuit if the "hot" wire comes in contact with the framework....

If the trailer tongue jack is setting on a block of wood and the trailer on its rubber tires, it is insulated from the ground....if the frame is not bonded to ground and the "hot" makes contact, you become the path to ground when you touch the skin or frame while standing outside... I seen it happen on a construction job-trailer firsthand....no electocution but the tingle was enough to almost make me wet myself.....

[Xtremespeed]

Ok, so I need to connect the ground on the incoming line to the breaker box as well as the frame of the trailer, and the neutral and ground are not tied together anywhere correct?

[pete42]

Ok, so I need to connect the ground on the incoming line to the breaker box as well as the frame of the trailer, and the neutral and ground are not tied together anywhere correct?

If you hook the power cords three wires to a converter
black is the "hot" white is the neutral wire and green is ground
all will be marked in the converter box.
the converter box will have breakers for the 120 and 12 volts
no need for another breaker box.
converter will have a marked lug that should be grounded to the trailer.

some people don't have or don't want a converter then a breaker box is added for the 120 volts and a 12 volt power-suppy is used for 12 volts some also use a seperate battery charger to recharge their batteries

now some trailers use the trailer as a neutral for the 12 volts, most do not
but everyone I have seen the trailer is also grounded through the plug running from the tow vehicle to the trailer.

all of this is easier if you have the parts before you to observe

[capt4903]

Correct...do not tie neutral and ground together in your panel....they are only tied together at the first panel coming in from the meter.....no other subpanels have them tied...

[Xtremespeed]

Thanks Guy's.

[8ball_99]

If your frame is bonded to the 120v electrical service, then the circuit breakers will trip, de-energizing the circuit if the "hot" wire comes in contact with the framework....

If the trailer tongue jack is setting on a block of wood and the trailer on its rubber tires, it is insulated from the ground....if the frame is not bonded to ground and the "hot" makes contact, you become the path to ground when you touch the skin or frame while standing outside... I seen it happen on a construction job-trailer firsthand....no electocution but the tingle was enough to almost make me wet myself.....

Seems like this is debated about a lot on here and I've never understood why. I see it the same way.. If you don't ground to the frame and you do have a hot wire contact the frame then you just made your self ground when you step in or out..

[k1hog]

Im educated opion is to connect the green or ground wire of the ac to the trailer frame not the white netural wire, and connect the black negitive wire of the 12 volt system to the fram. Us GFI for the ac recepticales.

Johnnie