BabyAir may be happening...door & wheel ?'s

[StanDahl]

I'm starting to get serious about this BabyAir idea. http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=49030 I really want this to be an enclosed wheel design, but I don't know anything about calculating real world numbers for measurements for the wheels and wheel wells. I can get aluminum wheels that match my Ranger in 14" or 15", but I have no idea if the trailer guys can work with them. I'd probably rather have skinny wheels with baby moons anyway.

This model is 1:12 and so the trailer will be 5.5' wide and 10' long (not including tongue), and with the wheel wells I put in the model, there isn't even 4' between them inside. The solid partition in the back isn't for real, I'm still working on the cabinet planning.

I'm not sure how to attach the doors, how difficult are gull-wing doors?? I'm thinking a hurricane hinge above each and gas-pistons, and it wouldn't be too hard to pull off. Side clearance could be an issue though.

Once I get this model worked out, I'll look into getting a custom trailer and I'll be off and running! (Or limping back here with my tail between my legs.) Whaddaya think?

[Larry C]

I really like your design. How will you skin the front?

[droid_ca]

this is a very interesting design

[StanDahl]

I plan to skin it in aluminum. In looking at the earlier Airstream models, they didn't really seem to have compound curves, and instead layered thinner strips of aluminum sheeting over straight sections that only curve downward. It looks like a curve, but each section is actually flat side-to-side. You can see that in the link in the original post. I figure that if I get the spars close enough together, this could work. I'm thinking about laying down a layer of EDPM under the aluminum to try to minimize the chance of leakage to the wood. I thought about using that rolled self-adhesive waterproof flashing, but I suppose it would be way too sticky to safely work with.

[48Rob]

Stan,

I like the design!
I would reasearch the rubber a little more.
It doesn't last very long, about 15-20 years.
If it was covered up, it might last longer, but a lot of extra work.
Installing a metal skin with care will give you a leak proof exterior.

Rob

[StanDahl]

That's nice to know about the rubber. I hope I can do the aluminum right! Here it is with gull-wing door, I think I like the idea:

[droid_ca]

I like the gullwing door idea that is pretty cool have a pocket screen door on the inside and you wouldn't need an awning

[doug hodder]

Cool to see you making some progress on your project. You could go wider with it and have no problems behind the Ranger. I pull a 77" wide standy with my Ranger and the stock mirrors on it, not the same trailer you've seen. It's right at the upper limits for width without aftermarket mirrors, but you could easily get by with a 6' wide and be fine. That would give you the extra width on the interior that you need. Of course, the narrower your wheel/tire combo is, also adds to that interior area width.

As a side note....since your metal panels are going to be flat pieces....you could skin it with something like a 1/8" baltic birch, give it an epoxy coat and then top it with the aluminum skin. That's what I did on the Nomad, you would just have a lot of smaller pieces. What's your plan for windows? Doug

[mezmo]

Interesting design.

If you do the hurricane hinge, don't forget to have it extend at least an inch
beyond both sides of the door opening to help deflect water. You'll also need some
kind of gutter on each side of the door opening or water will run in down the
curved roof to at least where the roof transitions into the vertical side wall.

You could use small aluminum angle or U channel for a diverter/gutter on
each side - like car roof rain gutters used to be.

Cheers,
Norm/mezmo

[StanDahl]

Doug, re: the idea of skinning it with 1/8" birch, that has come to mind, but I figured that it would result in the same number of punctures to be sealed and lots more work. I think it would be pretty hard to do the seams without overlapping. (Then again, thinking about it for a minute, maybe that wouldn't be too difficult.) I will keep it in mind if you think it will make this better. Another danger would be me stopping at that point and saying "good enough!" and leaving the aluminum off. Windows? I really haven't thought much about that yet. Portholes came to mind, or maybe a pop-out square would be nice, alongside the doors.

As for a gutter, I thought the hurricane hinge would do that job, I guess not? There will definitely be gutters on the inside with a rubber seam on the door. I like the aluminum angle iron idea for that, it would be easier than what I was thinking (which wasn't much as of yet).

I forgot about screens. A pull-down screen in a track could be workable? Maybe not with the curve involved?

I'm probably diving into the deep end of the pool here with my first project. I thought about settling for a more traditional (and easier) style, but I think I'm up for it. I've got lots of help here already!

[doug hodder]

The wood substrate would be sealed to start with,(would help if it were to ever leak in the future), then when you laid down the aluminum you'd overlap 1 piece with the other in a shingle type effect work from back to front. The advantage to the ply substrate is that it would give the aluminum some backing and not want to punch so easily, depends on the thickness of your skin however. I used .025. Sink the fasteners into the overlap on your rib. Staple the first piece, overlay with the butyl tape, then screw the overlapping panel to it. You'd seal the overlap with butyl tape, available at any of the local RV shops. Then trim the excess squish. The butyl will seal around the screws when you sink them.

Another option would be to use the 3M 5200 sealant, but it's much more hassle to clean up on raw aluminum. It's an adhesive made for underwater use, but is much more difficult to remove or work with post build. If'n it were me, I'd get some thin cheap masonite to make up templates for the pieces and trial fit before you cut them in the aluminum. Just my opinions. Doug

[StanDahl]

Yes, the underlay would be worth it for puncture resistance. I like the masonite tip too. With those, I could go into production - my sister-in-law saw the model and announced that I'd have to make four more for the family!

I may cut off the top of the bulkhead in the front and lay it down flat for a shelf above the cabinets. Then I could open up two sections for windows, it seems like it would be kind of dark in there.

[doug hodder]

The reason I ask on the windows is that you have a lot of curved surfaces and while poly windows would work, it might really be a challenge to get an opening window that will work with your profile. It all sort of depends on how you camp and what you want, but I'd be willing to bet that any curved opening window will run you plenty of dough, if you can find one in the same radius. From my experience....opening windows are nice to have, aids in ventilation and cuts down on the claustrophobic-ness. Your over all radius will make it tough to do a ceiling/roof vent on it, probably some side vents will help with the ventilation. Doug

[StanDahl]

Yes, you're right. I thought about putting a window in, flush on top and bottom, but recessed "below grade" in the center. Or...this may end up looking cheesy, but maybe a kind of dormer window that is flush on the bottom but protrudes an inch or two on the upside. That would make for some challenges with trimming, but could probably be done?

By "poly", do you mean something like plexiglas?

[doug hodder]

Nope...polycarbonate....it is around 30x more impact resistant than plex, however, it does scratch easier, and does want to expand and contract more with heat than a plex, but in the sizes you are maybe thinking, that won't be a real issue. Check the specs on poly VS plex. The poly carb that I'm most familiar with is the GE brand, but there are others. Plexiglass requires some heat and pre-forming to get it to fit a curved opening correctly, depending on the radius and is more likely to shatter than a poly with impact. Poly can bend on it's own and can be actually put in a break and bent, depending on thickness. Just my experience with it all in the sign industry....others may disagree.

Your approach on the window might work for you, if you kept your windows to a minimum on height, and really sealed up the edges of the frame well. The taller you go, the deeper your recess will need to be. On the Nomad, I cheated...I kept the outer edges of the trailer curved, but laid in some flat windows. I'd bet no one even noticed that the center portion between the windows and the outer edge of them was flat but the edges of the trailer were curved. Part of being a custom trailer builder is hiding all sorts of stuff like that.... Doug