Kudzu's Karavan - Project canceled

[kudzu]

The big sheets of 2" foam are so expensive I am leery of experimenting with them but enough folks have glued cracked board back together & used them that I may try the scored sheets before doing the layers of 1". A broken scored sheet wouldn't have to be a waste. It could just be shifted to become part of a side wall.

GPW, wanted to add that I keep going back to your Very Simple design. Construction would be so much easier if I did it that way.

[KCStudly]

I assume you are referring to score board, the stuff that is pre-scored (scores on both sides at 16 and 24 inches on center), and not some other pre-kerfed bendy board.

If possible, I would stay away from the score board, at least the type that came when I ordered it.

On 1-1/2 thick board there's only about 1/2 inch in the middle holding the joints together, and the scores are not kerfed, so they won't flex like you might expect.

Also, there is a slight rise on each side of the score, and a shallow spot at the edges that will likely telegraph through the canvas; makes for even more filling and sanding to smooth things out (at least on the flat sections).

The layout looks good. My only comment is a personal one, I don't like the idea of sleeping crosswise because the inside person would have to crawl over to get up in the night. Though that is always a compromise on using the space efficiently.

[atahoekid]

Less messy than Kerfing ... my foam bits are still hanging around , slowly dispersing ...

Tru Dat! Those foam bits are indeed annoying and I think the white bead board was even worse than the pink board. And I'm still digging pink pellets out of the corners of the garage. Funny thing too... when you use a circular saw to cut kerfs in foam, the foam dust sometimes burns into small black mouse turd looking things. The wife was very freaked out until I demonstrated the production of imitation mouse turds.

I like the idea of heating the foam to get a bend except the thought of using water hot enough to bend the board just didn't sit right in my safety professionals mind and I couldn't apply heat from a gun evenly enough to get it to bend. Has anyone perfected the heat method of foam bending? Would using a heat gun to heat up water soaked towels placed on the foam work? Just thinking of a way for Kudzu to bend the foam without the need to cut lots of kerfs and end up with "mouse droppings" everywhere.

[GPW]

Mel, we’ve bent a Lot of thinner Blu foam in the past ... Generally , we put the foam in tension and heat the outside surface of the bend... (heat gun ) For thicker foam , I’m thinking Two heat guns , one heating the outside , one heating the inside ... The trick is to keep the guns moving , so as Not to burn or distort the foam ... We only have to get it to 190F so it’s possible the hot towel/boiling water idea might work ... We’ll have to experiment with this ...
It sure would be Nice to be able to bend the foam rather than kerf ... once the heated foam is cooled it stays in that shape , so is easy to use and attach ...

[kudzu]

KC, thanks. Scores not kerfs, eh? So it's scored on both side with a solid (well, solidish in a foam way) on the inside. Wonder what the intended use is. Doesn't sound like it was meant to conform to curves. Well, sound like a couple layers of 1" would be better.

Thanks, guys, for brainstorming on the heat molding. That would be a lot of work but so will kerfing. Heat molding, provided I could make it work, has a lot of advantages over kerfs. Too bad I can't fit the panels through the access panel to the attic. All I would have to do is lay the panels on molds & let mother nature take care of the rest. The power of the heat in a Georgia attic in Summer time is amazing. Might require a temp alarm to warn me if it got too hot. ... hmmm... my sister has pull down attic stairs... Nah, the angle would make it impossible to wrangle anything bigger than 1/4 sheet. My parents' attic maybe... Perhaps? If I did it one panel at a time I would only need two molds, one for the midsection & another for the end. Right? This idea is too crazy to really work.

Lots discuss the hot towels idea further. We've got an old microwave. I could soak the towels, heat them in the microwave & lay them on the foam. Could I use wire molds? Put a layer of preheated towels on a wire mold, lay foam on top, then add another layer of preheated towels. Could run ceramic heaters underneath & use heat gun or blow dryer on top. Or pour bowling water over it?

Is any of that sounding feasible or even rational?

[GPW]

Here’s an article by one of those crazy RC guys ... http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthre ... ndfoam+gpw

...and a picture of the jig ... The advantage being , you only are bending a little at a time , so only have to heat a small area at a time ... a bigger jig similar to this would work ... and you don’t need a big form to bend over ...

Bowling water? .. hey , that’s Beer

[kudzu]

Concerning the design - Have already purchased three windows. Just need to determine where those will be placed. Might add a window in the door or might use one I already have.

Yes, putting the bed lengthwise across the width of the trailer is a compromise. It's all a function of need & personal preference. To keep the maximum amnt of open floor space necessary for our needs this arrangement just made sense. Though I want the ability to fold up the bed when necessary, the truth is we will rarely want to do that once we get to our destination. The folding bench/bed on the side would allow an optional sleeping arrangement if someone didn't want to or simply couldn't crawl over the other occupant. Since I'm a klutz with a knack for getting injured that need is a very real possibility.

[kudzu]

Well that seems a bit better than bending an entire panel at once. Thanks, G!

Bowling water? .. hey , that’s Beer

I'm not nearly as illiterate as I seem, really, honest.

[GPW]

Sorry , was just trying to be funny ... I just associated bowling and Beer... I must be going “mental” ...

That sleeping consideration is always a BIG concern ... Maybe the one who’se up all night might sleep on the outside ...? Maybe two narrower beds are better than one ... stackable for a “sofa” by day .... that’s what we’re thinking about for the FS ... I just keep thinking of it from camping experiences past ... "where would I put my sleeping bag" ??? Which brings up another point ... Do we really need beds and sofas ??? It’s "CAMPING” eh , not the Big 6 ??? ... Couple bags' and pads and you’re good ... Do we bring too much ??? Spoilers?

[kudzu]

I just associated bowling and Beer... I must be going “mental” ...

No worries. I got it. You made me laugh. But my posts always embarrass me. Have no idea how my fingers end up bowling instead of boiling.

Maybe the one who’se up all night might sleep on the outside ...?

Yep, that is exactly how it works out. Since it's very rare that I need to get up during the night it all works out fine.

Which brings up another point ... Do we really need beds and sofas ??? It’s "CAMPING” eh , not the Big 6 ??? ...

YES! We absolutely, totally, utterly, 100% do NEED a bed!! In fact I need a bed even more than I need but not quite as much as I need Feel free to keep using your sleeping bag & camping pad. More power to ya! Mine though have already gone to the dogs.

[GPW]

OK, beds it is ( my wife insists too ) .... but what are you going to use for a bed ? So many choices , I’m always so confudsed '...

[atahoekid]

I was thinking you could lay the towels over the section of foam you wanted to bend (a form or jig to bend it to would make things a bit easier) and pour boiling water on the towels. I figure the water will cool pretty quickly once it hits the towel(s) so hopefully it won't melt the foam before you get the bend done. Again I think 1" would be easier to bend just because of the insulation properties of the thicker foam. I recommend you try it on a scrap first... pretty much how we came up with most of our methods... trial and error and TLAR engineering

[GPW]

Mel, I’m sure that would work .... The model plane guys (myself included ) pour boiling water on our crashed foamies so they repair themselves... (the foam swells up and back into place ) Yet to Melt any foam with this method ...

Another test .... Bending 1” should be easy ... especially with a bending jig ...

[kudzu]

Now have a sample piece of 1" foam. Plan to cut that in half. BF dug out his heat gun for me. I've the kettle for boiling water. Need to build a test bending jig. So will run the experiment in the next day or two.

With my current design:
Front of the trailer starts at approx 80" high then slopes up to the 93" max.
Rear of TV ends at it's max 80" high. (does not include that cursed rear brake light sticking up an add'l 2-3"... dumb design)

Front of trailer starts at 40" wide then widens to 78" max.
Rear of TV ends at 61" wide with a max of 83" including mirrors.

So though the trailer will not have the best aerodynamics it will at least hopefully start within the TV's stream & angle out to expand it. The trailer angles up & out to it's max height/width in the first 18". The rear imitates the front, angling down & in the last approx 12". Again, not great aerodynamics but not the worst either. I won't concern myself with trying to make the canvas smooth but I will try to avoid any unnecessary protrusions from the front & sides.

If we had less stuff (read junk) I could start construction in our drive in basement. Instead I'll likely have to use one side of our porch. That's the side I'm about to start stripping of old paint... if it would just STOP RAINING!!! I know. I know. I shouldn't complain about it. We had drought condition for so many years. But really, did the record high rainfall have to be this year? Really?! Then again I'm saving on horse feed. PJ is starting to look like a big barrel with stubby legs on pasture alone. I swear Haflingers have some air fern in their genomic make-up. PJ just looks at food & gains weight. He's going to have to go on dry lot for 1/2 the day & that will not please the greedy pig pony at all.

[Mary C]

I was not pleased with the kerf job I did. I have decided that 1/2 inch just didn't work too well either . I thought using 1/2 inch it would work but the problem with it was when I was using it . I literally was holding it in place with skews, put glue and canvas on took the skews out and pushed the foam down with the canvas then used weight to help it conform and stay in place. Now it is dry and it is great. But between the high humidity and rain and the glue not drying and being in a somewhat hurry to git er done for CRA I got very frustrated so, Kudzu, you have more time to try things like the towel and hot water, The Hair drier didn't work for me. I don't have a heat gun. now I have a new little problem, I have to wash it down with clorox, seems the high humidity has produced a mold or mildew on it. Fun Fun. I know how you feel about the rain too,

Mary C.