6 x 12 Conversion, Rookie Questions

[DaveMann]

I've been lurking for a few weeks and decided today to take the plunge and do a conversion of my 6 x 12.

I already owned the trailer. We closed our thrift store and we kept it. It's been sitting around waiting for something to happen to it. It's a 2004 Express 6 x 12, with ramp rear door, single side door, a 3500 lb rated axle, and total (as manufactured) weight of 1380lbs. No brakes keeps the GVWR at 2990 lbs. Looks like I have 1600 lb to play with, but I'll try and keep it less than that.

rig.jpg (246.52 KiB) Viewed 2915 times

Conversion Plans include shower and toilet in one room at the front, television, AC, twin width bunks for 2 in an L arrangement across the back and along "driver's side" side. A fridge, but no galley. Storage cabinets to fill in the empty space (Yeah, I know. What empty space?).

Usage is mostly urban, suburban. I'd use it on a 2 or 3 day road trips staying in parking lots or rest stops instead of motels, and maybe 3 or 4 day day trips to the FL Keys again staying in parking lots and such as to avoid motels. Probably not much boondocking or camping or KOAs.

If you smart guys will indulge me a bit I'd like your feedback on a few things. Please feel free to argue for or against them. You won't hurt my feeling by disagreeing with me. As far as this new adventure is concerned, I have no ego. I'm too ignorant at this point to have one. Here are my thoughts:

1.As much as I prefer simplicity in design, it seems like some things should be 12v DC regardless of whatever other electrical systems may be in place. I'm thinking interior lighting and water pumps. Pumps and light fixtures seem to be plentiful in 12v models. Do you agree or disagree that even with generator or shore power, 12v water pumps and lighting is the way to go?

2. I'm thinking one room for toilet and shower with a large floor pan, say 36 x 24, shower surround, and a toilet similar in design to a house toilet (To satisfy my wife. She thinks porta-potty / airplane / boat toilets are gross) that would sit one one end of the pan, and all of the attendant water tanks. How do you waterproof the inside of the shower door? What about ventilation in the shower room? General thoughts?

3. Since I'm not a campground camper and more of a city camper do I save money by not worrying about the 30 amp plugs and wiring? I can see myself plugging into 120v AC outlets attached to people's houses and businesses where I'm staying (with permission of course). So instead of there being a 30 amp plug on the outside of my trailer I might have a couple of 120v AC duplex outlets on the outside. Seems like the wiring on the inside would be the same regardless of the type of plug or receptacle on the outside of the trailer, wouldn't it? And what if I did want the ability to get power from a KOA 30 amp tonight and plug into my brother in law's outside receptacle tomorrow night? Is that a wiring nightmare? Oh, yeah. I'll be using a generator for power most of the time when there is no other source. I suspect I'd need a couple of 12v batteries in parallel to power those lights and water pumps I mentioned above. Is this an electrical nightmare or is this everyday wiring?

Thanks for getting this far along in my post. I'd love to hear your thoughts. Feel free to give it to me straight.


Dave

[tucked]

Congrats, and good luck. Still a rookie here too... but on my build I plan on keeping everything 12V with occasional generator use. Looking forward to seeing your build.

[McDave]

Well let me start with Welcome.
I am in the process of a similar build. 6x12, Harley Hauler with shower/toilet combo, refrig, A/C, heat, insulation, LED lighting, microwave, sink, black/grey tank, fresh tank, on demand hot water and pump.
For me, most everything will be 12volt or/and propane powered except A/C and microwave. I will have a generator as well as 30 amp service and a WFCO 8955 converter/charger power center. Hoping to have 400 watts or more of solar maybe next year if funds allow.
These projects can really add up quick if you let them, but also you can get a lot for you money as compared to a manufactured camper. If you are not in a real hurry, shop around, check e-bay and amazon and craigslist etc.
Hang around here for a while and get some clear ideas of what you want and how far you want to take it. Most any question you have can answered here.
I plan to have a shower curtain as well as a door, pull the curtain when showering. This is what I have for vent/ light in bathroom...http://www.ebay.com/itm/Roof-VENT-w-FAN ... 4ad365697a
There are lots of adapters available for electrical hook ups so I would go with standard 30 amp and adapt from there.
Here is a good way to find used parts, set up your ebay to follow search and they will email almost daily.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/RV-Trailer-Camp ... SRCHX:SRCH

Good Luck and keep us posted.
McDave

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

I never figure this out with you all's 30 amp service.

20a x 120v = 2400 watts so how can this not be enough for a CT .... it's a lot cheaper than 30 amp wire.

Cheers ottct

[DaveMann]

I never figure this out with you all's 30 amp service.

20a x 120v = 2400 watts so how can this not be enough for a CT .... it's a lot cheaper than 30 amp wire.

Cheers ottct

In my case the reason is air conditioning. Pretty much anywhere I go, If I'm in the trailer I'll be using the air conditioning. Add to that any other AC voltage necessities and I think I'd bump my head on 20 amps.

The expense of 10 gauge (30 amp circuit) wire versus 12 (20 amp circuit) or 14 (15 amp circuit) wouldn't be significant as the 10 gauge wire is only necessary from the plug to the distribution box. Then you do your runs in 12 or 14 depending on the circuit size.

[Wolfscout]

I didn't go the 30amp route on my first build and with a portable ac I continually had breakers flipping. Eventually I ran a separate shore power line JUST for the ac which worked ok. btw I had a 20 amp WFCO.

On my new build I went with a 30 amp WFCO and 30 amp supply line from an Amazon seller. $79.00 I figure with all the electrical I run... That it's well worth the cost.
And yes, I have kept my lights and water pump on 12v in both builds. Never know when it will come in handy to stop for a night at a Walmart parking lot. LOL
Another thing.... IF you're going to have a 12v pump with shower, you'll probably have to have a water tank and a gray water tank. That's a pretty good amount of weight when it's loaded. not to mention if you put the shower up front and the tanks there beneath - you add to the the tongue weight and over all handling of the light trailer.
In reference to a 6x12 with two bunk beds and shower stall... That's about all you're probably going to get in it. My 6x12 had no room for a inside shower after I put the wife's cooking area inside (grill outside). I had decided to put one of those outside box showers on it but we decided to move up to a 8x20 trailer and build another.

[DaveMann]

. . . On my new build I went with a 30 amp WFCO and 30 amp supply line from an Amazon seller. . . .

Thanks for your input, Larry

If you please, what is a WFCO?

My research showed me a company called WFCO that makes several products. You must be referring to one of their products. Which one, please?


Dave

[Wolfscout]

. . . On my new build I went with a 30 amp WFCO and 30 amp supply line from an Amazon seller. . . .

Thanks for your input, Larry

If you please, what is a WFCO?

My research showed me a company called WFCO that makes several products. You must be referring to one of their products. Which one, please?


Dave

In my second build I'm currently working on... I put in a http://www.amazon.com/WFCO-WF8945PEC-WF ... 1_4&sr=8-4 (WF8945PEC) WF-8900 Series 45 Amp Power Center Converter Charger.

[walkrdg]

Just wondering... you said no brakes?

[DaveMann]

Just wondering... you said no brakes?

Yes, no brakes.

I called the manufacturer and found out that: in Florida if a trailer is under 3,000 pounds it does not require brakes. The axle is rated at 3500 pounds and I suppose if brakes could be retrofit my GVWR would then be 3490 lbs instead of 2990 lbs.

As it stands I have a 2990 lbs GVWR trailer with no brakes. However, the F-150 just got new pads, and it's pretty flat down here.

[DaveMann]

In my second build I'm currently working on... I put in a http://www.amazon.com/WFCO-WF8945PEC-WF ... 1_4&sr=8-4 (WF8945PEC) WF-8900 Series 45 Amp Power Center Converter Charger.

I researched this piece. Let me see if I understand its purpose. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

AC power comes in from somewhere (let's say a 30 amp cable plugged into a socket on the outside of the trailer) and goes into the WFCO 8945. From there the power center does three things.

1. It provides a 30 amp main breaker and 5 AC circuits with individual breakers.

2. It provides 11 DC circuits (I'm not sure if this has fuses or breakers)

3. It provides a charging system for the battery.

Would you say that about covers it or is there more (or less) to it than that? Thanks again, Larry for your valuable input.


Dave

[Gonefishin]

Welcome Dave. I also have a 6X12 with no brakes and tow it all over the Rockies with an F-150. No worries.

For what you've described, I'd use 12 volt wherever you can, especially lights. Makes stopping and staying easy and quiet. Nice to go out and turn on the lights inside anytime, anywhere.

I don't have AC power on mine, so can't help you there. Be careful about using "parking lots" in the Keys. The Monroe County sheriffs and other enforcement people down there keep a close eye out for campers and trailers not in designated sites. I've seem 'em raise a big stink and write tickets even for an occupied RV in a private driveway or yard.

Look forward to seeing how yours ends up.

[m.colley]

In my second build I'm currently working on... I put in a http://www.amazon.com/WFCO-WF8945PEC-WF ... 1_4&sr=8-4 (WF8945PEC) WF-8900 Series 45 Amp Power Center Converter Charger.

I researched this piece. Let me see if I understand its purpose. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

AC power comes in from somewhere (let's say a 30 amp cable plugged into a socket on the outside of the trailer) and goes into the WFCO 8945. From there the power center does three things.

1. It provides a 30 amp main breaker and 5 AC circuits with individual breakers.

2. It provides 11 DC circuits (I'm not sure if this has fuses or breakers)

3. It provides a charging system for the battery.

Would you say that about covers it or is there more (or less) to it than that? Thanks again, Larry for your valuable input.


Dave

Hiya Dave,
Yes you have it right. It is a simplified way to include both 12V & 110V into your build. Your 12V will need ATC sized (auto size) fuses in the proper amp range.

Martin

[DaveMann]

Be careful about using "parking lots" in the Keys. The Monroe County sheriffs and other enforcement people down there keep a close eye out for campers and trailers not in designated sites. I've seem 'em raise a big stink and write tickets even for an occupied RV in a private driveway or yard. Look forward to seeing how yours ends up.

I've heard that too. To that end I believe I'm going to integrate the stealth technology I've been reading about. Leave the signage on the trailer. No roof-top a/c, one of the little Honda or Yamaha low noise generators, and have the permission of the owner of the business (in most cases a dive shop) to be there.

I'm not sure there are laws against it anywhere except Key West. They're the sticklers. The rest of Monroe county seems to like to discourage it, but from what I've read it isn't technically against the law. I read it on the internet so it has to be true, right?

[DaveMann]

In my second build I'm currently working on... I put in a http://www.amazon.com/WFCO-WF8945PEC-WF ... 1_4&sr=8-4 (WF8945PEC) WF-8900 Series 45 Amp Power Center Converter Charger.

I researched this piece. Let me see if I understand its purpose. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

AC power comes in from somewhere (let's say a 30 amp cable plugged into a socket on the outside of the trailer) and goes into the WFCO 8945. From there the power center does three things.

1. It provides a 30 amp main breaker and 5 AC circuits with individual breakers.

2. It provides 11 DC circuits (I'm not sure if this has fuses or breakers)

3. It provides a charging system for the battery.

Would you say that about covers it or is there more (or less) to it than that? Thanks again, Larry for your valuable input.


Dave

Hiya Dave,
Yes you have it right. It is a simplified way to include both 12V & 110V into your build. Your 12V will need ATC sized (auto size) fuses in the proper amp range.

Martin

Thanks, Martin. I'm guessing other than some wire, some fuses and breakers, some fixtures and outlets, that is pretty much all I need. Well, batteries too, I guess. I get it. And, not too terribly high priced for the simplicity it provides.

Dave