water proofing your wood

[scoopburt]

John and Tony. I appreciate the info and thoughts. I actually read through lacofdfireman's trials. I was hoping it was more of a moisture problem and that waterproofing would solve the delamination problem?

Certainly dont want to have to tear my trailer apart.... after building one.

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[tony.latham]

I was hoping it was more of a moisture problem and that waterproofing would solve the delamination problem?

Andrew Herrick over at Boondock Campers https://boondockcampers.biz/ uses Monstaliner over plywood that's sealed with polyurethane. I consider him a craftsman that builds for longevity.

Tony

[scoopburt]

Very nice looking line up they have over there at Boondock Campers.
Monstaliner was my original choice perhaps I need to go back to looking at it.

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[John61CT]

Yes a strong rigid coating like PU or epoxy, fiberglassed or not, would be a very different substrate than ply with just a thin penetrating sealant.

[scoopburt]

Yes a strong rigid coating like PU or epoxy, fiberglassed or not, would be a very different substrate than ply with just a thin penetrating sealant.

John are you suggesting that I could PU (?polyurethane?) Or use fiberglass epoxy prior to the Raptor Liner with better results?

My reading of lacofdfireman's post was he used it on bare wood.

And I'm here asking questions because my experience level with wood is building indoor furniture and workshop cabinets. I know from my limited experience unsealed wood left on it's own with no support in an unstable (temperature/humidity) environment will warp, twist, split, and crack.

Funny story. Poor college kid tries to make a 2x4, 2x6 coffee table...... buys and cuts the wood waits 2 weeks to buy the screws and assembly..... well the wood was ruined after sitting in the garage at my parents for thos 2 weeks... all twisted up.

One last question. I feel like I might be high jacking this post a bit. Should I actually start a new post to continue this conversation in a better place?

Thanks again for your guys help

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[John61CT]

Yes, a rigid strengthening coating like that of course radically changes the properties of the ply.

Not just of the substrate surface, but structurally, especially if the wood is fully encapsulated.

To the point the bedliner becomes redundant, basically a cosmetic surface coating.

And yes a dedicated thread, with the most essential to you keywords in the post title will attract new participants perhaps with specific experience in those specifics.

[scoopburt]

Moving this to skinning Secrets as to not highjack the original waterproofing post. Link below
Thanks for everyone's help
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?url=ht ... are_type=t

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[scoopburt]

1/2 gallon of poly and 1 1/2 gal Min Spirits will make 2 gallons of the mix ... oil based poly is what you want ...

Just pulling this quote to the front. I have been searching for specific product names and cant find them but it appears any oil based polyurethane with mineral spirits (paint thinner)

Typically 25% poly /75% Mineral Spirits
Exterior Poly if you want UV protective additives.


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[Hamilton Felix]

When I bought oil based (clearly marked) Varathane polyurethane varnish yesterday, the warning section on the can said in bold print “contains mineral spirits.” That was all I needed. Bought a gallon of that, and three gallons of mineral spirits.

[GPW]

That’s it !!! That will treat a LOT of wood …

[Hamilton Felix]

Wow, that waterproofing mix soaks in - thirsty wood! I found a plastic 300 ml cup in the shop, measured 300 ml of varnish, then 900 ml of mineral spirits, mixed it in a can. That’s 1.2L or just over five cups. I put all of that on the upper surfaces of two 4x8 sheets on sawhorses. Gave them a little time to soak it up, then flipped them and did it all over again. This wood ought to be well preserved.

Wow again, that was yesterday. Did it again today. That’s a total of 4.8L or 5 qt. of mix soaked into two sheets of plywood. I think we’ve about hit the limit.

Now, will this count as primer? Can I paint over it? I read that you can paint Rustoleum onto wood, but you want a primer. I was thinking to paint the plywood deck the same as the steel frame.

[tony.latham]

I read that you can paint Rustoleum onto wood, but you want a primer.

I'm not a professional painter, thankfully.

But it's my understanding you need a primer on wood so that the wood doesn't suck out the thinner (water or spirits). I think the answer is, no.

T

[Hamilton Felix]

I was wondering if taking the wood pretty close to ultimate saturation level with 3/4 mineral spirits and 1/4 varnish would seal it enough to count as primer.

I found this on the Rustoleum site:

Use the following guide to help select the right primer for your surface:

Aluminum: Use Stops Rust Aluminum Primer

Drywall: Use Zinsser Bulls Eye 1-2-3

Masonry: Use Painter’s Touch acrylic latex Primer.

Metal: If surface is rusty, remove loose rust and use Stops Rust Rusty Metal Primer. If surface is clean or lightly rusted, clean surface and use Stops Rust Clean Metal Primer.

Plaster: Use Painter’s Touch Primer. Plastic: Use Specialty Plastic Primer or Universal.

Tile: (non immersion) For unglazed tile floors use Epoxy Shield Premium Clear or Tub & Tile.

Wood: For unstained bare wood, use Painter’s Touch Ultra Cover 2x Primer. For painted wood, no primer is needed.

So my question remains. Does that waterproofed wood count as “painted?” I think safer to use primer. The only Rustoleum primer I have around here is their clean metal primer. I used my quart of rusty metal primer. But my wife is headed downriver tomorrow. Maybe I can have her grab some of that Painter’s Touch Ultra Cover 2x Primer.

[GPW]

The Primer merely provides a nice smooth surface to paint on ( fill the weave or grain ) , we’ve all see Polyurethaned furniture that has No paint at all ( natural finish ) .. The only difference is the thinner Mix soaks deep into the wood …The more Mix you add , the more you get closer to a normal Poly finish . If you do the water test ( a drop of water on your wood ) , and if the water just sits on top and evaporates and doesn’t soak into the wood … then you’re done and you don’t really need to paint it at all … In an Exterior finish , you can get UV resistant coatings for over that … if needed .

[working on it]

* When I first used the "mix" on bare plywood (no prep, no sanding, no primer), during pre-painting tests on my TTT build, in 2012, I had best results using 3:1 thinner:poly, then 2:1, then 1:1, followed by 100% polyurethane. I let each application just barely dry to "tacky", before I went on to the next step. Then, allowing the poly to completely cure for days, I followed with my choices of TSC (Tractor Supply) alkyd (oil-based) enamel tractor paint, Rustoleum No-rust Enamel (because I had enough already on hand, that I wanted to use for the edge trim), and TSC aluminized silo paint (that didn't say it was for wood), with no prep, again, just two coats in quick succession. Worked perfectly, and no tendency to bubble-up or separate from the poly "primer".

* Of course, my testing was done on small pieces, under optimal (as close as it gets here in spring in N.Texas, if not just a little cool) temperature and humidity; the actual application on my trailer shell was done in direct sunlight, at 106-110 degrees, following the same method, but allowing one full week to allow the poly to cure, inside a 80-90 degree temperature building, between poly and paint (which was also applied in 105+ temps in direct sunlight. If there was going to be any problems with adherence, it should've shown up after going so far into extreme variance from the recommended application procedures. But, after 6+ years, there has been no deterioration.

* The plywood used was pre-sanded from the manufacturer, and pretty finely grained, which is a far cry from my next use of the poly "mix" and aluminized paint (this time Rustoleum, again not recommended for wood), on my truck bed cover panel project. on it, the plywood was of a lower grade, pretty rough, and again I did no prep at all. I used 2:1 thinner:poly, then 1:1 thinner: poly, then pure poly on both sides (with 2 coats of each step on the topside, and only one of each step on the underside. Same method was used, just allowing each step to get tacky before proceeding. But, the weather was very humid, and rainy then, and the poly never got fully cured before I used the aluminized topcoat. As soon as there was a chance to apply the paint on a hot, dry afternoon two days later? , I quickly applied two coats of the aluminum on just the topsides, and called it done.

* Time will tell how the aluminized paint will last on the bed cover panels, since there was less care given to the application. But, so far, after a month of exposure to rain, direct 100 degree sun, and all sorts of stuff falling on the covers (the reason why I built them), there's been no sign of the aluminum paint lifting off of the poly/"mix" preparation underneath. at this point, I fully expect the oil-based paint to adhere to a poly/"mix" undercoat as well as if proper prep work and/or actual primers had been used. I think the polyurethane-thinner "mix"-oil based paint will work on any wood, bare or not. The solvents seem to bond the varied coatings together, and since the "mix" has gained a foothold in the wood, they all happily live together. If aluminized paint will stick to a non-metal, non-primered, no-prep plywood surface, then it'll stick to prepped wood even better, I bet. Who needs primer?