Rivet skin panels together?

[shoeman]

Has anybody used rivets to join aluminum panels together for their skin? I know we've discussed sealing and screwing panels together to form the roof.
I'm going to be piecing mine together from 5' wide pieces cut from 4x8 sheets and I'm having a hard time figuring out what method to use to join the pieces. I'll be using .040" skin with no sub-layer. Pop rivets could lend a real cool aircraft look I think. They key will be getting rivets of the correct length for this thin material.
Any thoughts or ideas??

Geoff

[madjack]

Geoff, your biggest problem doing it thataway is getting a good watertite seal...with the use of rivets and an auto body panel adhesive, it would probably work OK...my preference for such, is to overlap the sheets a couple of inches over a spar(no underlayment), use an automotive urethane sealer(auto windshield sealant) and insert a screw every couple of inches, with the use of a round head, SS screw, it give a riveted look and I know it will seal against the weather...I also predrill the screw holes and shoot a dab of sealant into the holes....
madjack

[Dale M.]

Why not.... Aircraft are riveted together.. that being said... Pop rivets are a rather poor choice as the are not sealed.... Moisture can weep through center hole and around ball end of rivet shank to allow a real leak in your skin....

Also you will have to develop a method of sealing the two layers of skin together and not cause any buckling of skin materials between rivets....

Generally to have a real good finish is to drill all holes and remove any burrs from drilling from between two sheets and work out any imperfections and using something like "Cleco" fasteners to stabilize all parts before you actually insert and pull rivets.... Also with number of rivets you need to install consider power rivet tools.... The quality of rivet job will be better than you can do with hand tools...

Suggest you explore the many type for rivets available for various applications. You may find the generic hardware store "pop" rivet lacking for your application..n Another phrase you may want to investigate is "blind rivets"...

Dale

[boardhead]

I like madjacks method of joining the panels with caulk and stainless steel screws. If you ever need to take it back apart for repair, replacement, or modification, removing and replacing screws is much easier.

[Nobody]

I used the same method as madjack & it has worked great thru 2yrs & several thousand miles.

Here's what mine looks like. There's another 'joint' exactly the same (except faces the other direction ) just in front of the fantastic vent

[shoeman]

Yeah, screws make the most sense. I can add spars as needed to align with the panel seams and make it simple.
Stainless screws are a neccesity I'd say for this job. Got to see if the orange boxes have any on the shelf.
On a side note, I cut one side panel to fit yesterday and it went easily. I borrowed a Kett metal shear from a friend that made cutting the door out very simple. Do I just rely on all the trim (door, floor, roof) and hinge to hold the sides on?

[QuietOutdoorsman]

Aircraft aluminum skin joins typically have 3 rows of bucked rivets and very often have an internal stringer common to the skin lap joint. And everything is all covered with sealant. Of course the airplanes I'm most familiar with, that lap joint has to be air tight and able to hold pressure near 14 psi.

So MadJack's recommendation isn't that far off from actual aircraft design. Definitely pre-drill and deburr all the holes and run a good bead of sealant in the overlap of the panels. A plain steel screw will eventually react with the aluminum and cause corrosion (in the aluminum), but a good quality stainless screw should be ok.

Dirk

[madjack]

Shoe, the SS screws can be expensive from a box store, I get mine from FASTENAL...here is a list of locations nearest you http://www.fastenal.com/web/locations.e ... r&state=ME ...you may have other bulk fasteners suppliers in your area...
madjack

[BPFox]

I used rivets on my first trailer and I wouldn't hesitate to use them again. That said, it kind of depends on what you are fastening your skin to. In my case, I was attaching directly to 1" square tubing. If you are attaching to wood, screws are the way to go. On a side note, I didn't bother to seal my pop rivet heads since the holes did not penetrate the inside of the trailer. I suppose eventually the metal frame could rust out, but after 15 years, there is no real sign of this. I will soon find out, however, since this trailer will be scrapped to provide a platform for my new trailer.

[Jim55]

Yes, one can use rivets. But, having built homebuilt aircraft, I can testify that rivets vary much in strenght. Check John Monnett's Sonex website for good information on "blind" or "pop" rivets.

Conqueror's Commander is one of the most well built campers I have ever seen. I was fortunately to walk through their factory a few months ago. They build for the off-road market, where sealing for dust is important. --- And they rivet their panels on! They use rivets with very large heads. --- Looks almost like buttons. I have no idea where they get these.

Photos of the Commander are at: http://www.callofafricatours.com/offroad01.htm
and
http://www.safaricentre.co.za/Conqueror.htm
These photos do not do justice to the camper. It really is something to see!

Jim

[shoeman]

Shoe, the SS screws can be expensive from a box store, I get mine from FASTENAL...here is a list of locations nearest you http://www.fastenal.com/web/locations.e ... r&state=ME ...you may have other bulk fasteners suppliers in your area...
madjack

Dang! That's about 3 miles from me. I was just in that neighborhood shopping for electrical parts and stuff. I'll have to check them out. I'm wondering if the rivet-look nails that the Teardrop Repair Shop would work? I may have to give him a call and see what he thinks.

[durant29]

How about if you already have riveted panels, and you want to re-seal (or just seal in the first place) the joints? Has anyone had experience with a product that would "wick" in between the already assembled skins, then set-up so as to seal / reseal the skins?
Tony B.

[mikeschn]

Here's food for thought...





Mike...