Brakes

[eamarquardt]

There has been a "good bun fight" or "quibble", "bicker", or "exchange of ideas" surrounding the durability of HF trailers. I think they are "good enough" if used properly. However, a bigger issue in my mind is the safety of any trailer that doesn't have brakes. I posted the following in the string on HF trailers but decided to start a new string as some folks probably aren't following the "debate" as they aren't using a HF trailer. The thoughts I express below apply (in my mind) to all trailers.

Food for thought:

It is, IMHO, irresponsible to tow a trailer that weighs more than about a third of the weight of the tow vehicle unless the trailer has functioning brakes. Some states have laws that make this standard (pretty close) a legal requirement.

I don't care about the "legality" of such behavior because I/you have a moral obligation to respect the right others have to be reasonably safe when in the proximity of you and your vehicle.

I don't give a rats posterior if anyone uses a HF trailer safely. People on the forum have purchased the 17XX cap HF trailer, probably loaded it well beyond it's rated capacity, towed it with a "pregnant roller skate", towed it with no brakes on the trailer, broken the law, and eventually there will be an accident involving said behavior. A few prosecutions, well publicized, will bring a lot of people to their senses. Unfortunately it may/will be too late for someone.

I believe a number of folks that hang out on this forum need to think about the possible consequences of their behavior. The "I was being carefull" and it "couldn't happen to me" rational won't bring anyone back to life.

Accidents happen but some are preventable. I've lost too many acquaintances to accidents. You gotta do your part.

http://dangeroustrailerspersonalstories ... inlay.html

If you think it won't happen to you, think again.

There is no reason for over 68,000 accidents and more than 440 deaths a year involving vehicles towing trailers.....per

http://markpolk.rvtechtips.com/2009/03/ ... river.html

Here is a good article with lots of new info.

http://slaga.net/RV/How%20to%20Tow-version%202.pdf

Gus, out

[Shadow Catcher]

From first hand experience I will buy the "It is, IMHO, irresponsible to tow a trailer that weighs more than about a third of the weight of the tow vehicle unless the trailer has functioning brakes."
It is kind of like wearing a hard hat safety glasses and steel toed boots in an industrial situation. You don't need them till you need them and if I had not had them I would have had concussions and probably have been blind from flying metal chips welder flash (UV causes cataracts)...
I did not have problems towing MM#1 with our Subaru, but neither did I feel entirely comfortable and it was only 1150#, MM#7 has brakes and I hope i never need them, badly!

[dh]

I have to agree about the brakes. A quick glance at my Jeep's owners manual under the towing section, and wow, I'm borderline on needing a weight distributing hitch for my rig, and well into the "trailer brakes required" weight range.

[parnold]

I believe the trailer to vehicle ratio in New Jersey that requires brakes is 40%, but the 33% sounds like a better margin for safety. My tv is 2700 plus, and my tear is 700, so I'm feeling pretty good right now.

My next build will be bigger, and will have brakes.

[Corwin C]

I will be towing mine with a full size Chev Tahoe with plenty of capacity to tow 5-6 times the weight I'm expecting my fully loaded trailer to weigh in. With the 4-wheel disk brakes, I have more than enough braking power. Despite that fact, my tear will have brakes. You never know how your TV will change in the future, nor the conditions that you may run into whereupon you may need that extra little bit of braking capacity.

I CHOOSE to plan and build for that extreme. I know that should something happen, I would have difficulties sleeping at night if I didn't "prepare for the worst, and hope for the best." At the same time, however, I don't want to see the day when this kind of thing is required by law. I dread the day when I have to tromp on the brakes and that expensive govt. mandated anti-lock system says, "uh...nope, you're only going to stop as fast as I let you." If there is even a question whether you need brakes or not, you probably should have them.

I would hope that everyone who is building or buying a trailer gets educated about their vehicle, trailer, weights, capacities, stopping distance, etc. BEFORE they make a decision solely based upon cost or complexity. Think long and hard about the possibilities and potential consequences and make an educated decision. I'm confident with some serious thought, almost everyone will make the best decision for their situation.

[eamarquardt]

I dread the day when I have to tromp on the brakes and that expensive govt. mandated anti-lock system says, "uh...nope, you're only going to stop as fast as I let you."

ABS brakes are controlled by computers. Computers have glitches. Ask Toyota about "fly by wire throttle control". Both my brother and I have bumped into folks at low speed (parking lot) as our cars (Ford and Toyota) would not stop even though we were standing on the brake pedal. Forunately as we were going so slow there were no injuries or damage. I KNOW my car should have stopped! Std brakes do fail but do not have "computer glitches". Overall ABS brakes are probably saving lives but they are not "there" yet and they are incredibly expensive to fix.

I too dread computerized stability control, etc, etc, etc.

There you have it, again, the "World According to Gus".

Cheers,

Gus

[Arne]

Checked CT trailer/brake law. If trailer exceeds 40% of towing capacity, brakes are required.

[48Rob]

Overall ABS brakes are probably saving lives but they are not "there" yet and they are incredibly expensive to fix.

I've had many problems with ABS brakes on my vehicles, similar to yours, not being able to stop.

The simple solution is to pull the fuse than controls the very poorly designed system.

Having a computer "pump" the brakes is fine if it works, but after "rolling" through several intersections after applying the brakes on a slick road, I decided I could do a better job.

I haven't slid through an intersection since disableling the system.

Rob

PS. some ABS systems work VERY well, one of our cars has a good ABS system, and two others do not...

[dh]

Computers have glitches. Ask Toyota about "fly by wire throttle control".

90% of our buisiness at my plant goes to Toyota. The recall and shut down on production had our production down by 65% for 3 weeks. We actually recieved a letter of apology from Mr. Toyoda himself (no, that is not a typo, it is spelled Toyoda). Now they are looking at modifying one of our foot floor ducts, as the driver's shoe could get lodged between the foot duct and the gas pedal.

Sorry to go of topic.

[Dale M.]

In California ............

26303. Every trailer coach and every camp trailer having a gross weight of 1,500 pounds or more, but exclusive of passengers, shall be equipped with brakes on at least two wheels which are adequate, supplemental to the brakes on the towing vehicle, to enable the combination of vehicles to comply with the stopping distance requirements of Section 26454.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc26303.htm

26302....

(b) Every trailer or semitrailer manufactured and first registered after January 1, 1966, and having a gross weight of 3,000 pounds or more shall be equipped with brakes on at least two wheels.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc26302.htm

Dale

[boxcar]

Wow ....sane people.. I feel at home here....ABS brakes ,where do I start.
I know .... Computer+ brakes+ throttle= Disaster... But if you are towing a properly equiped teardrop you will have a back up system that won't fail you...... [img]:thinking:[/img]
All joking aside I think Gus is on the right track here we should all lirn from his wisdom.And maybe if we police our selvs the government won't se the need to regulate us out of existance. What are the chanses ???........ Boxcar....

[Rigsby]

over here if its gross weight will exeed 750kg, then it legally has to have brakes

[boxcar]

Well that equates to 1653.47 lbs so I would have to say probly...How's that for a solid answer...Boxcar...

[Woodbutcher]

I didn't use a HF trailer for my build. I was not asked any questions at the DMV when I got my title. After pulling my Tear 3 times I didn't feel comfortable with the braking (stopping) with my Jeep Wrangler unlimited. The Jeep is rated to tow 3500lbs. Sorry but that is crazy. I just installed brakes on the Tear and feel SOOO much better when stopping. It brings the whole experience back to what it was like to just be stopping the Jeep without any trailer in tow. The piece of mind is well worth the few hundred bucks the brakes cost.

Disclaimer.......I am not an engineer. Not overly educated either, but I have been behind the wheel for 39 years without hitting anything. I would like to finish my driving career the same way. You can't convince me extra braking is not worth the effort.

[Dale M.]

....

All joking aside I think Gus is on the right track here we should all lirn from his wisdom......... Boxcar....

Now if we could just get him to do away with the bold enhancement of the fonts "italics is more appropriate"...... At least in "publishing industry" that is way its done...

Dale