Road Foamie - done for the year

[eaglesdare]

i have only painted one great piece. took me 3 months. it was the lone sailor with the american flag in the background. i did that for a guy that was retiring from the navy.
but i did this painting in an art class. everytime i had a problem trying to get the right look i had in my head, i could just ask the instructor. who then would come over and guide me in doing so. loved that painting. wished i had taken a pic of it!
it was displayed in the store front window. i was so proud. but haven't painted anything like that since.

the depth of things is what has me stumped. like a crease in jeans and to make something look 3 dimensional rather than flat.

[GPW]

My Impressionist thing is to not paint creases in jeans, etc. Just make marks on the canvas that "look" like that ... Up close , it's all just brush strokes and paint , across the room , sitting in your easy chair with a glass of wine , it looks right !!! Like a Monet , who I trace my painting roots back to ... All about getting the impression of Light and shadow ... " The BIG Effect !!! " The secret is, most of those pesky little details are totally Lost when viewed from a comfortable distance , as they should be , so why bother ... Old Artist saying ... " When in doubt , leave it out " ...

I tell my beginning students if they want to paint so it looks a photograph , then just get a camera ... Painting is about PAINT and brushes , and the creative translation from the Artist's eye to the hand to the canvas...

[atahoekid]

Being self-employed for 41 years now , I'm always open to suggestions ... just getting too old to want to start another business... Trying to enjoy retirement at home .. Sheltering in place ...
After these many years , I finally have a steady paycheck ... SS .... which is just enough to fund my "projects" ...
That and I'm still painting ... got a commission to paint the local birds for the Woodlands Conservancy ... Here's the first one done ... a juvenile crested night Heron ...

Wow, That is some talent you have there. I am jealous. I've never been able to find my "inner artist". Or "outer artist" either... That is beautiful work.

[GPW]

Mel, Thanks .... My Dad is an Artist , and I came from a long lineage of Artists , Musicians and Actors on both sides of the Family ... I never really had a chance to be anything else ...

Here's #2 of 4 that I'm working on now ... halfway done ...

It's a series ... The Four Seasons

[eaglesdare]

ok now your just ............nevermind. show off!!!!!!!!!!

just kidding you gpw. i love your skill! so when i plan my trip to nola, you will be teaching me how to paint!

[atahoekid]

I think I have finally figured out how I want to attach the walls to the floor and frame. I've attached a sketch below. I used Paint to draw it, first time I've used it, leaves lots to be desired.

Anyway, do you think this joint will work? There are also bulkheads in the front, middle and rear for attachment and strength. I'll be using epoxy for all the foam to foam and foam to wood joints and the entire outer surface will be covered in fiberglass and TB2. I'm thinking of not using any adhesive between the foam and the frame since the floor is bolted to the frame and the foam is epoxied to the floor. Do you think that's a good idea? Anyway, I think this will work but I worry I've missed some engineering principle.

So, Is it a go or "no go"? or

Your feedback is truly appreciated!

[GPW]

Looks Good to me ...

[Wobbly Wheels]

Hey Mel,

I've been playing around with epoxy and foam as well and I have one suggestion, but it's really only an opinion at this point.

The epoxy doesn't saturate the foam the way it does the wood fibers so those joints might not be all they could be. What might work better is to glue on the skirting as shown, then drill down through the floor and into the foam and epoxy dowels in. That will take any shear loading and will avoid a weak line where the epoxy and foam meet. If you have a table saw, shallow cuts down the dowels' length will allow more surface area for the epoxy to bond (or fluted dowels if you can find long ones).

I assume you know that you'll need a fillet on that inside corner and it just didn't make it into the drawing. Give SketchUp a try instead of Paint - it's another free download from the Google empire.

I've also found that cabosil seems to be a better thickener than wood flour for bonding foam: not sure why that would be but the difference is noticeable.

Have you thought about your layup for the outside yet ?
I'm thinking two units of ~6oz (one 90 and one biax) and veil for the finish but I'm still looking for ideas

[mezmo]

Hi atahoekid/Mel,

What are you using for an inside covering? I'm an advocate of
redundancy/backup within reason and possibility. One such
scenario for that would be to use a 6in high 1/4-1/2in thick "baseboard"
glued to the foam at the bottom of the wall [you could dowel through that
into he foam if wanted] and have a cleat at the juncture of the baseboard
& floor that would screw into the wall and floor, and then reinforce that
with the fiberglass tape/cloth and resin, with the fillets as mentioned by
Wobbly Wheels/Brian. The cleat may not be necessary with the fiberglass
and resin and filet, but that's a personal decision.

Also, I'd glue/epoxy/silicone the block of fill/spacing foam to the steel
frame. Whatever extra holding help that'd give is a plus, but I'd mainly
do it for frame corrosion protection in the 'future'. If the foam is just
butted against the steel frame with nothing between them, it is an open
joint allowing water and road grit to intrude and act like an abrasive
slurry to eventually cut through the frame paint and then become a
pocket of/for corrosion over time.

Good Luck on the build as you go along

Cheers,
Norm/mezmo.

[atahoekid]

GPW - Thanks for your approval. It takes a load off of my mind. I'm really trying not to overbuild as is my tendency, yet I don't want to build too light and have it fail. You seem to have struck the balance that I haven't been able to do yet.

Wobbly - The dowels are certainly a consideration, I will look at when the walls are up and before I seal the inside walls. Thanks for the sketch up reminder. I played with it for a while and I do think it's a whole lot better program than Paint. As far as a covering, I'm going light. I'm looking at 1.4 oz cloth set in TB2 instead of epoxy like GPW did in his build although he only used the fiberglass tape in the corners. I think I would get the same ultimate result without the expense and major mess of epoxy

Mezmo, I'm planning on lining the interior with a very thin plywood, maybe some paneling if I can find some that doesn't look tacky. Maybe FRP panels. Somewhat up in the air! Just something to provide a bit of additional strength and rigidity

Thanks for the thought about bonding the foam to the frame, I hadn't thought about the moisture and grime. I will definitely bond the foam to metal somehow.

Thanks for all the replies. It's nice not to have to rely on my own thinking!

[GPW]

Mel , overbuilding with Foam doesn't seem to have the same weight consequences as building with wood ... and with a good outer skin and a ply (paneling) inner skin it should be Very STRONG !!!

[atahoekid]

Mel , overbuilding with Foam doesn't seem to have the same weight consequences as building with wood ... and with a good outer skin and a ply (paneling) inner skin it should be Very STRONG !!!

Unfortunately, as I am thinking/planning about the build, I keep hearing myself say "Maybe I should put a piece of plywood/wood there". That is going to add up to a lot of weight if I don't stop myself...

[GPW]

Just keep telling yourself, foam weighs 2 lb. / cu. ft. ,plywood weighs 57lb. / cu . ft .

[Wobbly Wheels]

Mel, I'm trying to avoid having the weight creep up during the build as well. I agonized (ok, maybe not 'agonized'...) over using 3/8 exterior ply for the floor vs the 1/4" I wanted to use (only because I couldn't get 1/8").

I need to be able to get the 'box' off the trailer myself and if I don't keep the weight down I'll overload my little tent trailer frame pretty quickly - especially with the 'beer ballast' that seems to have become mandatory 'round here....

I'm figuring on using foam for much of the cabinetry like Mike's doing on his, so the weight savings ought to be enough to justify a cautious optimism about the finished weight. I decided on a SIP-style floor specifically because I could drop some of the weight of heavier ply by stiffening the panels with foam.
I will be using some 3/4, but very sparingly.

Are you going to be putting a membrane on the roof after laying it up, or just painting it ?
I don't know how the glue will hold up when it gets rained on - side walls are one thing, but the roof sees a lot more water. Not saying it's a bad idea, I'm just curious.
I think today I'm going to try this glue/glass thing that seems to be catching on.

[GPW]

W2 , I just painted the canvas on my roof (attached with T2) and it's sat out all summer in our Intense Heat , Sun , and Storms ... I can't see any change from the day it was painted ... save a few spots of bird poop ... JMHO thinking any "membrane " would be just overkill and not so Thrifty ... But a membrane roof seems so much a better idea considering there's nothing underneath to ROT... the main bugger of conventional trailers so roofed (over wood )...