START HERE Electrical Considerations when building a trailer

[sdtripper2]

Awesome picture.. I think I understand... if I'm "reading"
the photo right.. its campsite power in via orange cord, then run through
the cylinder shaped thing with yellow that must be the protecter, and then
into the power strip to split it out to the rest of the camper? My plan is to
run the power in, and then of course now through the protecter (forgot the
real name). Since I plan on wiring in my walls to outlets and switches, can
I just use something to split the cord as it comes out of the protector and
leave out the power strip? My goal is to have a permanent install for wiring.
How does that sound?

Definition:
Protector = GFCI

I think Mike got the GFCI pigtail that the ORANGE inlet extension cord is
attached to from the Home Depot. However maybe Mike can confirm this?

GFCI explanation by Bruce:
http://tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?p=144749

Tester from home depot that might be carried to test shore power before you hookuP to the your trailer:

Since I plan on wiring in my walls to outlets and switches,
can I just use something to split the cord as it comes out of the protector
and leave out the power strip?

Wok, you are cutting this electrical installation to the bone, this is understood. Yes you can
just skip the power strip however if you suddenly have a ground or and
open in one part of the trailer ALL of your power will NOT work and you are
then resigned to trouble shoot by unhooking rigged wires to figure out the
issue.

I would still use the power strip in my opinion as trouble shooting issues
can be narrowed down in less time when the outlets on the power strip are
marked.

On another note:
Most consider using both DC and AC in their trailers for options in power
when and if your not at a camp site with AC. Also for resale having both
AC /DC enhances your sale.

I am sure others may have more opinions on your questions and they will share here soon.

[wok]

I will take your advice and use the power strip, and then run extension cords from it inside my walls. My exterior walls will be built first, with the 2x2 supports, and then insulation and interior skin will be added in a few months when I have the money, so it will be easy to do it this way. I like the idea of the simplicity and reliability of the power strip as you describe it, and I can still hide the cords for a clean look. Thank you much, I think I have my plan now. I will post the pics when I have it in.

[Cliffmeister2000]

Question:
What and where can I get an inlet power receptacle for my trailer?

Answer:

Google search "Charger Inlet" or "Shore Power Inlet"
Different Inlet power receptacles here
Vintage Trailer Aluminum look Inlet Power receptacle
There are many solutions and inlet receptacles that you could use.
I have shown two here but read the accompanying threads to get more
Ideas. Some will be covered and have space for inlet connections for
cable TV. The basic answer is that the inlet receptacle will be covered
and have a MALE plug to take the FEMALE end of your outdoor extension
cord. Remember the inlet power receptacle to your trailer should
be on the left side looking from the rear of your trailer or drivers side of the tow vehicle.

I just found this at Tweedy's. Looks like it will work, and it's $13.95 plus about $10 shipping, vs. $49 and up. If 20 amps will do ya, this seems like a good low priced alternative!



http://www.tweetys.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=16439

[bearfromobx]

but I camp in a lot of campgrounds where the power systems are neglected, miswired and worse, so I chose to use a GFCI even on a simple extension cord system. It doesn't take much power through a human body to stop a heart and I want all the protection I can get!

There is a lot of good information of this page, but I just have a simple question I cant seem to find an answer for. For simplicty's sake, I know I can leave out the battery, but can I just run a big extension cord through a whole in my wall, and into a power strip like you might use for your home computer, and then use that to plug in things like fans and lights normally plugged in a wall socket at home. (This is over simplified. I would of course wire inside the walls and put it outlets and have it not look like a dump). But if I'm just using the power plug at the campsite, and plugging in things normally plugged in, need I do anything more?

[bearfromobx]

... is a portable GFCI (Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter) and is fine for the purpose, however it is expensive and can be replaced by GFCI outlets if you are going to wire outlets in the TTT anyway. The portable I use for work is about $250.00 and wired GFCI outlets are $15-$25 each and can be wired to protect more than one outlet. I use a subpanel on my trailer and GFCI equiped breakers mounted inside the sleep compartment to supply 6 outlets through the trailer body. Befriend a local electrician and a local HVAC tech and you will have the answers to most of the questions that are hard to find anywhere else (when you're both you get lots of questions!).

Awesome picture.. I think I understand... if I'm "reading" the photo right.. its campsite power in via orange cord, then run through the cylinder shaped thing with yellow that must be the protecter, and then into the power strip to split it out to the rest of the camper? My plan is to run the power in, and then of course now through the protecter (forgot the real name). Since I plan on wiring in my walls to outlets and switches, can I just use something to split the cord as it comes out of the protector and leave out the power strip? My goal is to have a permanent install for wiring. How does that sound?

[PcHistorian]

I'll expand this to include an actual schematic of my trailer, which is pretrty well passed the wiring phase for 110v AC. Rather than the inlet mounted to the outside of the wall, since I'm vinyl siding, I elected a "wet-location" box, with a door, usually for a duplex outlet, and mounted that right up against the frame underneath with an angled 1/2 inch hole cut upward to the 110v AC "cabinet." Now in there I have a long piece of 3 prong, heavy duty cord that I just stuff up into the box and close the door for travel. Open the door and pull out the plug when I stop, with some slack that gets pushed up into the inside. NOW before you do this, make sure you have a plug that will fit into the opening on the wet-location door!
First stop inside is a GFI outlet with the secondary output to the rest of the trailer so anything coming in is GFI'd right there. Due to all the talk here, I may end up taking a POP-UP breaker off of a simple power strip and wire it into the circuit before the GFI outlet. That limits the entire setup to 15A. If I wire in a tiny air-conditioner at some future time, I'll hard wire it with it's own breaker.
since I have an outlet on the outside, that gets it's power through a switch inside (a switched outside outlet) I wanted to ENSURE that that had a GFI on it. I haven't seen any park power provided with a GFI circuit, yet.

schematic link



cut-paste
http://sites.google.com/site/pchistoria ... &width=320

[eamarquardt]

Another approach:

I sailed for years off the grid. Never had a/c power never missed it. Everything I needed could be powered from 12 volts, propane, or coal/charcoal (a small heater vented outside).

If I want 120 volts while camping (small electric heater or air conditioning although neither are required anyplace I'll camp on the West Coast as if it's hot or cold enough to require them I, in all likelihood, won't be there) an extension cord with perhaps a power strip will meet my needs.

I anticipate that 100 watts of solar power will provide for my Norcold chest (but will do some testing first to verify and add more panels if required), a few lights, a small radio (those designed to run on batteries not a car/marine radio as they are power hogs designed to be used when an engine/alternator is feeding them), and perhaps charge my small netbook which can be used as a Television with over the air reception (using a USB dongle tuner) or a dvd player. If a/c power is available I will take advantage of it and connect my battery charger to it rather than lug out the solar panels and hook them up. Also, if I decide to go somewhere hot where air conditioning is a plus, I'm of the "opinion" that batteries/solar power will not be sufficient to run it and "shore power" will be required. Running a generator isn't generally acceptable to me as one goes camping to escape the noise of the city. Just MHO. I wouldn't enjoy being next to a constantly running generator.

A genuine deep cycle batter is best. Starting and typical "Marine" batteries aren't going to give the best service life or capacity. Splurge and buy golf cart batteries or quality deep cycle marine batteries.

Run wire of adequate size but minimizing current draw with LED lighting, a radio (if desired, designed to run on batteries with a DC input), and other low current draw items designed for 12 volts is a worthy goal. Microwave ovens, toaster ovens, and most 120 volt appliances are, again IMHO, not needed to enjoy a camping experience.

If you must have a heater, something like this would be excellent:

http://www.sigmarine.com/SIG-CCH.html

It has a pilot light and that might be enough to keep you warm (after warming your cabin) as I think even the low setting might be too much for a teardrop (but you could always open a window or vent to moderate the temperature).

Not to criticize the other thoughts espoused here as there is a lot of good information, but there is more than one way to "skin a cat", figuratively speaking. KISS.

Cheers,

Gus

[PcHistorian]

heat? I'm trying to figure out to design a rocket mass stove with a candle as an energy source, for my trailer. Cooling the inside in the summer and heating my water are other matters. How small can I buy an air conditioner? (100w unit? ;-) Can I take one of those electric coolers, or 4, and adapt the mechanisms to cool my trailer on 12v dc? (that's be cool, literally. :-)

My trailer is not just a vacation trailer but a work trailer, and an example of my work trailer, so the 110v AC system doesn't hurt, and besides, I know what I'm doing, I have the tools, scrounged the supplies, got nothing better to do with my time, that's as much as I can fit in there reasonably anyway...
(quite frankly, if it wasn't impossible to start with, I'd just get bored with it too easily, so why bother... ;-)

[eamarquardt]

Cooling the inside in the summer and heating my water are other matters. How small can I buy an air conditioner? (100w unit? ;-) Can I take one of those electric coolers, or 4, and adapt the mechanisms to cool my trailer on 12v dc? (that's be cool, literally. :-)

Simply put, one can't air condition a trailer using batteries. Even a small window unit draws 10 amps on ac current which would be about 100 amps dc current. You'd have to have about 1000# of batteries to be successful and then you'd have to figure out how you're gonna charge 1000# of batteries each day. Gonna take a heck of a battery charger or solar system to do so.

Cheers,

Gus

[bobhenry]

My barn build is about as non standard as your cottage
but we have a built in advantage. Roof angle on the cottage
looks to be 40 ?? degrees almost optimum for a solar
panel solar collector or a solar heater. To solve your
hot water and heat issues a very simple glazed collector
with a large coil of black plastic tubing will make a fantastic
water heater capable of producing 4 - 5 gallons of very
hot water while the trapped heat in the enclosure could
be stolen out with a small computer fan with intakes
from inside and exhausted back into the interior pressured
with a small computer fan. Stealing this heat will cause
some loss to the water heater mode but on a sunny day
you can literally scald yourself with the water exiting
the coil if precautions are not taken.
I found that pointing a mister type nozzel upward and
then letting the water dropletts float down while in the
shower eliminated the scald effect.
The water can be driven by a pump from an on board
water source or simply hooked into city water via a
hose inlet.

I am afraid Gus is correct in that AC requires AC.
Yep Alternating Current for Air Conditioning.
However a great second is moving air. A 12 vdc car radiator
fan will move a lot of air. O2Kool make a nice AC DC and
battery contained fan that will move a lot of air and run for
days on an on board battery and 6-8 hours on its self contained
battery pack.

I tucked the barns AC unit in the shade under the trailer and
vented just the cold air discharge into the barn under the
soffet thru a vent via a chase. It works very well but is not
as easy to set up as just flipping a switch.

[eamarquardt]

you can literally scald yourself with the water exiting
the coil if precautions are not taken.

We used to have a solar water heater on our house (it was cheaply made and deteriorated over time). On a sunny day, the water flowing from the solar heater was hotter as it flowed into the water heater (where it mixed with the cooler water in the water heater) than the water coming out of the water heater.

Cheers,

Gus

[PcHistorian]

I like the coiled hose idea, to heat water. I am really wanting to do this. The sloped roof (40-45 degrees) some slope will always be in the sun. Last summer the heat inside was really hot, like an attic in summer, even with the window and doors open. heat rises and no vents in the roof. SO I think I am going to do the hose, coil loop thing, but inside the roof, between the roof joists, and find a means like dowels to run joist to joist to keep it there, then have the 1/2 inch r=3 insulation inside of that, then some inch and a half of whatever space, and finally a fiberglass reinforced panel. I'm considering the small computer fan fan idea (12vdc, 1/4 amp) to vent the peak air inside down the sun side roof air pocket to vent the remaining heat out and still cool that side of the roof a bit. (picture to post later) The problem is... I have to do all four sides of the roof and have them work independently as to which one is in the sun. I wonder if I double insulate the roof, outside, hose loops, inside insulation, if I can heat the water and still use it to cool the interior cooler in doing so... Means either having 4 water pumps or one water pump and 4 divertors.
I do know I will be storing the water tanks under the frame... I need one pump anyway. Gravity feed might be nice but then I have to store the water at the top, inside. means minus headroom, unless once again it is between the joists. I know there are tanks for water for some house humidifiers that might be just right, if I thread in some fittings, for fitting between the joists but holding gallons of water... These tanks could only be in the central area of the roof as each of the corner sections are triangles. (see my build pages. I'll get a better picture of the roof sections up here.

[bobhenry]

Water tubing inside the roof cavity

are you sure?

I was thinking about a trapazoidal shallow box filled
with the tubing and then glazed , mounted OUTSIDE
ON the roof. It would look like a solar panel. You
can even get bronze tinted lexan for a better look
without losing much in performance. The outside
mounted collector will shade a portion of the roof
reducing solar gain inside.

You have gotta seal the underside of the roof and
install some soffit vents and add a ridge vent to vent
that summer heat. If it were my project I would
install a 2x2 on each side of the roof joist and then
layers of blue foam. The 2x2 creates a void and a
chimney from the soffet vent air to rise and escape
out roof vent and create a thermal chimney effect
"vacuuming the heat out the upper vent
( hot air rises).
Your solar hot water heater will have hot air in it
that in the winter could be diverted inside with
some creative venting

[TheDuke]

I've been looking at the early parts of this thread, trying to come up with typical wiring diagrams that I can modify for my trailer, BumbleB (used to be Skeetr). I found some links, but none of them work, and I thought it might be due to the BB upgrade. Any advice on how to get them to work, or maybe alternate sources for Tiny Travel Trailer wiring diagrams, and other electrical specs.

TheDuke

[bobhenry]

Click on electrical secrets and look at the stickies here is Joannes I studied and studied it before tackeling my 1st build.

http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=1941