OverTheTopCargoTrailer 7 x 16

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

so do any of you guys have some wiring tips ?




What I have is 4 x 210 watt Kyocera panels -

then a Outback - Flexmax 80 charge controller

& a set of 400 amp hour batteries.

the question is what size DC breakers & where ?
should the panels be wired + & - ?
and what size wiring goes where ?

I have the ac side under control....
its the DC side that I needs some help with..


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Here are some tips for you guys

Maximum Open Circuit Voltage (VOC)
• VOCistheunloadedvoltagegeneratedbythesolararray. • Greater than 145VDC Charge Controller suspends operation to protect components • 150DC max open circuit voltage with the coldest environment
NOTE: Although the Charge Controller shuts down at a voltage greater than 145VDC, it can withstand up to 150VDC from the array; anything higher than 150VDC will damage the Charge Controller).

Check the PV array voltage before connecting it to the Charge Controller (see page 76)
Wire and Disconnect Sizing
FLEXmax 80
• TheoutputcurrentlimitoftheFLEXmax80is80amps • Use a minimum of 4 AWG (21.15 mm2) wire for the output between the FLEXmax 80 and the battery
bus bar conductors • InstallOutBackOBB-80-150VDC-PNLbreakersfordisconnectandovercurrentprotection • The largest PV array that can connect to a Charge Controller must have a rated short-circuit current
of 64 amps or less under STC (Standard Test Conditions).

NOTE: Input conductors and circuit breakers must be rated at 1.56 times the short-circuit current of the PV array. OutBack 100% duty continuous breakers only need to be rated at 1.25 times the short- circuit current.

NOTES: • Each Charge Controller requires its own PV array. DO NOT PARALLEL Charge Controller PV+ and PV-
TERMINALS ON THE SAME ARRAY!
• An optional battery Remote Temperature Sensor (RTS) is recommended for accurate battery recharging (only one RTS is needed for multiple OutBack Series Inverter/Chargers and Charge Controller units when an OutBack HUB and a MATE are parts of the system). When one RTS is used, it must be connected to the component plugged into the Port 1 of the HUB.

FLEXmax 80
The Charge Controller is a buck type converter with the following properties: • 80 amp DC output current limit (default setting) • Listed to operate continuously at 80 amps (40°C/104° F)
With an 80 amp Charge Controller output current limit and PV array output higher than 80 amps offers little, if any, current boosting or Maximum Power Point Tracking advantage; in effect, any excess power beyond 80 amps is lost.
For NEC* compliance and the Charge Controller’s 80 amp output rating / MPPT capabilities, the largest PV array input must not exceed a rated short-circuit current of 64 amps.
Battery Side of the Controller
• All OutBack Power circuit breakers (OBB-XX) are 100% continuous-rated type breakers • The conductors connected to the breakers must have a 125% safety factor applied (i.e., an 80 amp
breaker must have a 100-amp conductor connected when used at its full 80-amp rating)
PV Side of the Controller
• UL* requires a 125% safety multiplier (before NEC calculations) • NEC* requires a 125% safety multiplier (after UL calculations). • The 156% safety multiplier is specific in the NEC* to PV applications only – this “dualâ€

[pete42]

http://www.ehow.com/how_7526324_wire-so ... ailer.html

will this help?

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

If I wire everything in #2 AWG , then the trailer will gain 200 lbs and cost an extra $2,000 for the wiring



Come on guys.....
I can't believe nobody on this form knows a little about simple solar dc wiring, I made this so simple for you......



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[vtx1029]

Not sure you panel p/n but I looked one up about your specs and it puts out just short of 8A per panel. I'd fuse as close to each panel as you can with a 10A fuse you can use 18 gauge or bigger wire from that to the charge controller. Keep the + & - the same. out of the controller fuse using a 35-40A fuse and run a 10 gauge wire to the battery.

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

OK vtx1029

You get an "A" for effort my friend

the panel has an Isc= 8.58 Amps
The NEC says that a breaker must be rated at 156% for over current..protection.

That equals 13.38 max amps ...the next larger size breaker is 15 amp....DC fuse

since the MC 4 wire and panel connectors are already # 10 and the max the 4 x 210 panels would put out would be 840 watts .... normal more like 600 watts best case NOC.
The voltage is 26.6 x 4 = 106.4 volts @ 8.58 amps.

We should be able to go with the #10 on a less then 10ft run, loosing less then 2.5% voltage drop.

I looked at a Sunboy combiner box and noticed they used a fuse breaker on both the + positive and the - Negative side, that is being extra safe.

Will tell you more about - Charge controller to battery latter, gotta run off to see the dentist OUCH !!!

http://overthetopcargotrailer.blogspot.com/

[vtx1029]

You don't add your voltage up unless your wiring them in series. Would your charge controller even accept that high of voltage?

Personally I think 15a is too big I'd rather play it safe then sorry. + a breaker is a waste of $ between the controller and panels IMO.

I'd keep it simple and have each panel wired separately to a bus bar and then connect that to the charge controller. It wouldn't be too hard to hook up some voltage indicators for each panel so you know your getting output from each one.


I'm no electrical expert by any means but I've never seen anyone fuse both + and - leads. And I've seen seen a lot of different systems in Auto's, motorcycles, aircraft, and custom automation equipment...

[bdosborn]

You ought to give some thought about series versus parallel configuration. Remember that when the panels are in series, *any* shadowing on a single panel will reduce the entire string output to about nothing. I have mine in parallel and wouldn't think of changing to series, even though my controller is rated for 75V input. Its amazing how many times there is a small shadow on one of the panels.

I'd run two strings of two panels in series as a compromise between higher voltage and shadowing.

The Outback is a great controller and the kyocera panels are top notch. As whole its a super slick setup, I'm jealous!

Bruce

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

Solar E panel coming soon , seams like I am always in waiting mode for more parts, set to arrive tomorrow. The final major part will be a Morning Star 300 watt pure sine inverter. When everything is all said and done, this panel will just require 5 simple connections and the whole trailer electrical system will be up and running. As you can see I will have about 5-6 breakers for the a/c and the d/c system. These are special Midnight Solar baby boxes, which hold 4 breakers per box.

1.) connect the battery
2.) connect the ground wire
3.) connect the solar panel
4.) connect the DC fuse panel
5.) connect the interior wall a/c lights



Since I am a little lazy today, you can jump over to my blog and see all the posted pictures over there.


http://overthetopcargotrailer.blogspot.com/

[bdosborn]

Hey, this is very cool! We're did you get it?




Bruce

P.S. I just got a Morningstar Suresine myself to upgrade the existing MSW inverter we already had. Pro tip: the inverter has to be disconnected from the battery to set the dip switches. I just ran our Keurig coffee maker as a test (600 watt load). It brewed 2 cups of coffee without a hitch or going into overload.

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

I got that USB outlet from LOWE'S it cost $20. There is also a box that can be plugged into outlet and gives you the same 2 USB outlets. That also costs $20.

The book recommends that you install a 3 amp fuse in the Morning Star Black / hot wire, if you did that were you still able to draw the 600 watts? Because that fuse would limit you to 360 watts in theory. The smallest fuse I have is 10 amps, now I need to make another trip to the store. The book says that it would allow a draw of 600 watts for a max 15 minutes. There are also 3 internal 30 amp fuses, they seam to cover the d/c side. Also if the unit exceeds 95 deg on the heat sink then it would shut down till it drops below 80 deg f.

Thanks for the tip , I posted some new pictures just now on my blog. They covering wiring, fuses and fuse holders for dc wiring. Really great charts for someone doing d/c wiring of any kind. I wish I would have found them sooner.

Since I am still a little lazy today, you can jump over to my blog and see all the posted pictures over there.


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[bdosborn]

The book recommends that you install a 3 amp fuse in the Morning Star Black / hot wire, if you did that were you still able to draw the 600 watts? Because that fuse would limit you to 360 watts in theory.

I didn't install a fuse on the inverter output because it's s already protected internally. Any kind of short on the output and inverter shuts down. I used a #12 wire on the output, which is rated for 25 amps, much higher than the inverter can produce. Probably the first time I've admitted to not using a fuse on a wire.

I did use a circuit breaker on the input. I'm using a 150A circuit breaker from the old inverter, I should replace it with a 100A per the Morningstar manual. I'm using #2 marine wire I had laying around and its good for 170A in free air so technically the 150A should work.

I'm a little disappointed with the Suresine right now, I've got it installed and it won't run the coffee maker. It goes into overload and shuts down. I've got a single piece of #4 wire from the battery to the circuit breaker I need to replace with #2, maybe that will help. It runs the blender and the satellite receiver just fine.

I found out the remote shut off circuit supplies 12V DC! I wired in an LED to the remote off switch that comes on when I flip the switch on. The terminal closest to the outside of the inverter is + , the inside terminal is -.

Bruce

[8ball_99]

Why get such a small true sine wave inverter to run a coffee pot? I wouldn't think you need a True sine wave inverter for something with a heating element.. I mean a TV, computer or something sensitive.

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

Hey Bruce

The #4 wire should be more then enough as it will Cary 60 + amps. The inverter has 3 x 40 amp dc fuses, so it's limited to 40 amps, don't know why they want a 100 from the battery. I will install a 75 at the battery as that is all I have right now

Then the thing about the ground wire being so large ? And grounding the neutral to ground seamed strange also ?

The manual says it will shut down when the heatsink reaches over 95 deg, The rating says it will do 600 watts at 25 deg c - that's about 75 deg F, so maybe try making coffee where it's colder outside when you start. If your room in the morning is at 80 deg you have less room to heat up. I was planing to put some washers under the unit to allow for more airflow under the unit.

8ball is right , I also have a cheap crappie 1000 watt $99 modified sine I will also connect for something like a coffee pot !!!

I hope to finish my panel this weekend hopefully ???

Will report back then.

[bdosborn]

The #4 wire should be more then enough as it will Cary 60 + amps. The inverter has 3 x 40 amp dc fuses, so it's limited to 40 amps, don't know why they want a 100 from the battery. I will install a 75 at the battery as that is all I have right now

I replaced the #4 with a #2 today, hoping it was a voltage drop issue and no change, I can't run the coffee maker. Oh well, I still like the inverter. I ordered a 100A circuit breaker, just so I don't have any warranty issues. I bet its limited to the 3X40A fuses in parallel so its really 120A max input.

Then the thing about the ground wire being so large ? And grounding the neutral to ground seamed strange also ?

I'm not going to bond the neutral to ground as I'm using an automatic transfer switch on the inverter to automatically switch outlets to inverter power. It could create issues with GFI receptacles. Besides, NEC doesn't allow a neutral - ground bond it in a trailer. I have no idea why the ground wire is so big, I guess to make sure the circuit breaker on the DC side operates if the 12V + cable hits the inverter chasis? I bonded it to the AC ground with a #12 awg.

The manual says it will shut down when the heatsink reaches over 95 deg, The rating says it will do 600 watts at 25 deg c - that's about 75 deg F, so maybe try making coffee where it's colder outside when you start. If your room in the morning is at 80 deg you have less room to heat up. I was planing to put some washers under the unit to allow for more airflow under the unit.

The trailer was in the garage and it was in the 40s F so I doubt that is the issue for me.

8ball is right , I also have a cheap crappie 1000 watt $99 modified sine I will also connect for something like a coffee pot !!!

That's why I tested the coffee pot with a temp feed on the Morningstar, I was going to keep the old one too if the Suresine didn't work. And of course it ran it. Now that it's permanently installed it won't.

Bruce

[OverTheTopCargoTrailer]

Well I have to tell you, when I saw some e panels advertised by solar companies and saw that they go for around $2,000 ... I thought there goes another dumb SUCKER.....but having almost finished wiring my own panel, since they don't sell small pre wired e panels for crazy people with 840 watt solar panels on cargo trailers, I would say if you include shopping for the parts then it can easily become a 20+ hour project. Not even counting the research time. Most electricians try to grab you for $80 to $120 per hour, so I can see how that project would go fast toward $2000 for a little larger solar e panel.

The nice part will be that my whole system will be plug and play, if I ever need to sell the trailer, all my hard work can be taken out in 5-10 minutes with some quick snap plugs, like Anderson connectors.



Everything you see here is installed inside a upper 24" wide x 30" high - kitchen cabinet.
Now don't laugh your BUTT OFF,
all those little parts above are close to $1,400
My labor not included

here are some pictures for you guys





AGAIN don't laugh your BUTT OFF,
all those little parts above are close to $1,400
My labor not included




















I hope you are all happy with the good info on d/c wiring,
I wish I had known that stuff before


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